Foot Controller Suggestion

MainStage questions and troubleshooting

Foot Controller Suggestion

Postby everydayjones » Sun Sep 20, 2009 12:11 pm

Can anyone suggest a good midi foot controller for running MainStage 2? I'll be changing effects on the guitar, looping and changing effects on two vocal mics.
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Postby Antiphones » Mon Sep 21, 2009 2:55 am

I've been looking into this myself. As far as I can tell there is only one pedal on the market with double continuous controller pedals that has been specifically designed to work with soft synths and DAWs. Its the Waves Ground. This is a very configurable pedal and well built. My only gripe is that it has the noisy type of click foot buttons. These are very sturdy but them make a loud click which is fine if you're on stage with a loud PA, but a real pain if you're playing on stage near miced up acoustic instruments (which I often am) or in the studio near anything that's miced up.
http://www.wavesgtr.com/index.html?id=wavnav

Roland have the FC-300 which is a very nice pedal but for me won't work because it has no midi soft through or midi merge which I need since I'm using a guitar synth. This might work for you as long as you don't need midi soft through, its otherwise a very configurable pedal and it has very quiet foot switches.
http://www.roland.com/products/en/FC-300

There is also the Behringer FCB1010 which does have midi soft through but although it has lots of single click controller buttons, only two of them can be configured to send out controller messages, the rest are hardwired to send out patch change messages and can't be changed. Again this is no good for me because I need as many single click controller switches as I can get. But it might work for you if just need a couple of continuous controller pedals and a lot of program change click buttons. It looks like it has quiet foot switches but I haven't actually tired them.
www.behringer.com/EN/Products/FCB1010.aspx

Hope this helps.
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Postby shivermetimbers » Mon Sep 21, 2009 8:37 am

Antiphones wrote:
There is also the Behringer FCB1010 which does have midi soft through but although it has lots of single click controller buttons, only two of them can be configured to send out controller messages, the rest are hardwired to send out patch change messages and can't be changed. Again this is no good for me because I need as many single click controller switches as I can get. But it might work for you if just need a couple of continuous controller pedals and a lot of program change click buttons. It looks like it has quiet foot switches but I haven't actually tired them.
www.behringer.com/EN/Products/FCB1010.aspx

Hope this helps.


:?

Where did you get this info? You can do just about anything you want to with the FCB1010.

What specifically would you need it to do? If I may ask.
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Postby Antiphones » Mon Sep 21, 2009 11:32 am

Where did you get this info? You can do just about anything you want to with the FCB1010.

What specifically would you need it to do? If I may ask.


Perhaps you can do anything. I'm only basing this on reading the manual which you can download on their site. In the part where it talks about sending out controller messages, it specifies only pedals 6 and 7. I took this to mean that you the other pedals send out patch change messages and not controller messages.

Can you send out a controller message from any of the push buttons?
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Postby Kent Sandvik » Mon Sep 21, 2009 12:24 pm

I have not tried but I would check out the new Line 6 foot controllers, just announced, that have USB output and full configuration for MIDI Cc messages.
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Postby mmm42 » Mon Sep 21, 2009 12:25 pm

Antiphones wrote:I've been looking into this myself. As far as I can tell there is only one pedal on the market with double continuous controller pedals that has been specifically designed to work with soft synths and DAWs. Its the Waves Ground.


BTW: The Waves GTR Ground is well supported by MainStage 2, which means: to upper LED display shows the current program number and the lower onces display (in 3 LED characters) the actual mapping.
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Postby shivermetimbers » Mon Sep 21, 2009 1:18 pm

Antiphones wrote:
Where did you get this info? You can do just about anything you want to with the FCB1010.

What specifically would you need it to do? If I may ask.


Perhaps you can do anything. I'm only basing this on reading the manual which you can download on their site. In the part where it talks about sending out controller messages, it specifies only pedals 6 and 7. I took this to mean that you the other pedals send out patch change messages and not controller messages.

Can you send out a controller message from any of the push buttons?


Yes, you can.

You can set up each switch to be a program change. The switches can be all the same PC# or they can be totally different PC#'s. In fact, they will be a PC# ranging from 1 to 128.

Any switch can be programmed to send out 5 PC, 2 CC, and parameter values all at once.

Imagine using an external midi Reverb, delay and Logic. You want to change the Reverb value, the delay value, and in Logic, switch a guitar patch and use the wah pedal and control the volume. Step on 1 switch and BAM... everything swithes at once.

So in its basic use, switch 1 can be PC 001 associated with that can be CC#7 (volume) and the EXP pedal can be set anywhere from 0 to 127 or anywhere in between. The values can be seen in the Logic/Mainstage Midi window.

Presets can be copied and moved around to suit your needs.

The FCB1010 will work with anything that is controllable.


The manual seems to be confusing to many so you really need to sit down and work with it at a basic level until you are comfortable to 'riverdance.'
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Postby fader8 » Mon Sep 21, 2009 2:30 pm

I have the older version of this on my keyboard rig:
http://www.voodoolab.com/gcontrolpro.htm

Fully programmable and accepts 2 pedals. They can be either expression pedals or your favorite volume pedals, (I've got 2 nice Ernie Ball pedals connected.)
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Postby Antiphones » Mon Sep 21, 2009 2:39 pm

The manual is unclear, I spent some time reading it and still didn't get that you could change each pedal to send out controllers. As shame because I ordered a Waves Ground instead and the FCB 1010 would have been lot cheaper and it has quiet switches!
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Postby everydayjones » Mon Sep 21, 2009 4:45 pm

Thank you for everyone's excellent suggestions. I've got a ton of boss/line-6/sans amp pedals that I currently use, however, I'd like to change everything to using MainStage as I'm tired of pedals constantly going out or producing a popping sound (just before they go out).

I'm new to Mainstage and midi, so you'll have to excuse me, but my live show consists of myself (guitarist, backing vocal) and a female (vocalist, djembe).

We do a range of songs from the simple singer-songwriter to the full blown Tim Reynolds live looping & sampling. We use EQ (telephone), tremolo, delay, etc on vocals as well as doing bass lines, electric guitar (sans amp) soloing, etc. Some pedals need to be tap-tempoed (delay, wah). I'm hoping all of this functionality can be replaced by Mainstage and the FCB 1010. Can it?
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Postby shivermetimbers » Mon Sep 21, 2009 9:04 pm

everydayjones wrote:Thank you for everyone's excellent suggestions. I've got a ton of boss/line-6/sans amp pedals that I currently use, however, I'd like to change everything to using MainStage as I'm tired of pedals constantly going out or producing a popping sound (just before they go out).

I'm new to Mainstage and midi, so you'll have to excuse me, but my live show consists of myself (guitarist, backing vocal) and a female (vocalist, djembe).

We do a range of songs from the simple singer-songwriter to the full blown Tim Reynolds live looping & sampling. We use EQ (telephone), tremolo, delay, etc on vocals as well as doing bass lines, electric guitar (sans amp) soloing, etc. Some pedals need to be tap-tempoed (delay, wah). I'm hoping all of this functionality can be replaced by Mainstage and the FCB 1010. Can it?


As I mentioned before, if it uses PC, CC, Notes, Tap Tempo, etc ... the FCB1010 should be able to control it.

As a matter of fact, Look what I just found. Someone (not me) posted a tutorial on MS 2 using a FCB1010 to control the Looper and Playback.

Watch it in full screen mode.

http://www.samgreene.com/drupal_samgreene/mainstage2-and-loopback

<embed src="http://vimeo.com/moogaloop.swf?clip_id=6242833&amp;server=vimeo.com&amp;show_title=1&amp;show_byline=1&amp;show_portrait=0&amp;color=&amp;fullscreen=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" allowscriptaccess="always" width="400" height="300"></embed>
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Postby jruckaudio » Sun Sep 27, 2009 11:48 am

i can't believe no one has mentioned the apogee gio, designed for mainstage.. its pretty expensive, as is all apogee stuff but definitely worth looking into
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Postby Robert Wilson » Sun Sep 27, 2009 2:21 pm

I just ordered a Nobels MF1 MIDI Foot Controller off of eBay.

http://www.nobels.com/cgi-bin/products/show.pl?e_mf-1

Anyone know if they work with MS?
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Postby herr gunstig » Mon Sep 28, 2009 10:35 am

Robert Wilson wrote:I just ordered a Nobels MF1 MIDI Foot Controller off of eBay.


I looked at the manual and the default configuration is to send program change, so you will be able to change patches with it... it also has a "midi note mode" which should work with all of the buttons and things you might want to control in MainStage. I don't think it is automatically recognized by MainStage, so you won't get automatic assignments for the factory content, but it should work if you assign it manually.
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Postby Robert Wilson » Mon Sep 28, 2009 10:39 am

herr gunstig wrote:
Robert Wilson wrote:I just ordered a Nobels MF1 MIDI Foot Controller off of eBay.


I looked at the manual and the default configuration is to send program change, so you will be able to change patches with it... it also has a "midi note mode" which should work with all of the buttons and things you might want to control in MainStage. I don't think it is automatically recognized by MainStage, so you won't get automatic assignments for the factory content, but it should work if you assign it manually.


Thanks! By manually do you just mean click a button, with learn selected in layout mode and then one of the Nobels' pedals?
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Postby RedBrooklyn » Mon Sep 28, 2009 9:26 pm

i'm about to try this with an expression pedal and a few little sustain pedals.

http://www.eowave.com/controllers.php?prod=53

I like small stuff that fits in my carry on sized case.
yada...
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Postby Robert Wilson » Wed Sep 30, 2009 11:26 am

herr gunstig wrote:
Robert Wilson wrote:I just ordered a Nobels MF1 MIDI Foot Controller off of eBay.


I looked at the manual and the default configuration is to send program change, so you will be able to change patches with it... it also has a "midi note mode" which should work with all of the buttons and things you might want to control in MainStage. I don't think it is automatically recognized by MainStage, so you won't get automatic assignments for the factory content, but it should work if you assign it manually.


I posted this over on the LUG site but I'll post it here too in case anyone else is looking at an MF-1:

I've just connected up the MF-1 and have to say I'm pleasantly surprised. This despite two pedals not working - 'bank up' and No.1.
So far I've managed to assign 'bank down' to change patch, No.6 to Play/Stop on the playback plug in and the other 8 pedals to MIDI notes c-1 upwards, assigned to Ultrabeat patterns.

This is a huge step forward for me, despite the obvious limitations.

Unfortunately I don't have a portable MIDI interface with MIDI IN so it'll be confined to the home studio for now.
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Postby Robert Wilson » Tue Oct 06, 2009 11:20 am

Update:

This despite two pedals not working - 'bank up' and No.1.


I managed to repair them - yay!
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Postby littleeden » Thu Nov 05, 2009 5:12 am

I'm surprised no-one has mentioned the Waves GTR Ground, which gets a lot of praise in this context on other forums. I've not used it myself, but other users have praised the ease of set-up. The main drawbacks seem to be noisy footswitches (not a big problem on stage, unless using mic'ed acoustics), and I believe it needs an external power supply - which is the main reason I haven't gone for it yet, although if my GIO doesn't turn up soon, I may well be cancelling that order and switching my allegiance.

Anyway, would be interested to hear any user experiences.
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Re: Foot Controller Suggestion

Postby logicdroid » Wed Nov 18, 2009 8:37 pm

everydayjones wrote:Can anyone suggest a good midi foot controller for running MainStage 2? I'll be changing effects on the guitar, looping and changing effects on two vocal mics.


Apogee Gio seems to be what you need.

I'm using FCB1010 with iFCB as sysex editor.
This unit is the cheapest I could find and it doesn't come short of features.

-I've managed to make it work in stompbox mode without the UNO chip.
-Stomp on a pedal to Send 5 PC messages, 2 CC messages, 1 note on message to 5 different AU instruments or Outboard processors/samplers at once.
-CCs on Both expression pedals.
-Triggering samples by sending note on messages to EXS24. Ultrabeat etc.
-Tap tempo

All this is programmable for each pedal.

Another controller I miss using is the one that came with Zoom's 2020 (legacy product) or was it the 1010....? Cheap as chips if you can find a working one..

Anyway, happy hunting!
Best.
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