tempo change causes regions to move out of sync

ive been working on a song we recorded live in a studio to a click in protools.

Ive imported the tracks into logic and ive been cutting and moving audio regions, recording midi tracks etc.

 

when i imported the song i left the tempo in logic on default 120, and now i want to do some quantize edits on some tracks, but the original speed was 126.

 

when i change the tempo to 126, all the regions move out of sync. is there a setting whereby i can change tempo, but keep the regions locked in time?

• undo your tempo changes so that you're back to square one

• select all regions and use the SMPTE-lock function. A little lock icon will appear on each of the regions

• do you have any automation? If so you have to lock that too before changing the tempo (post back if you need info on how to do this)

• change the tempo

• SMPTE-unlock all of the regions

thanks ski, i have a lot of automation going on, so i need more information

cheers

OK.

 

It's important that you not touch the current tempo before you lock the automation.

 

I'm assuming here that you've SMPTE-locked all of your arrange page regions by now.

 

There's a key command that lets you open the automation event list which looks just like a regular event list but which shows you the automation data. I don't use stock key commands, so you'll have to do a search in the k/commands window for it. Once you find the command, click on the track header for any track known to contain automation. Hit that key command, and a list of automation data for that track will appear.

 

Next, click the "hierarchy arrow" (ULH corner of the auto/event list) and you should see a bunch of entries that all say *Automation. This represents all of the automation regions for all tracks. Now do CMD-A (select all) and invoke the SMPTE-lock function. You'll now have locked all of the automation regions.

 

Now you're free to change your tempo and the automation data will conform to the changes. Had you not locked the automation data, it would have stayed put at the 120 BPM tempo.

 

Hit Play and check playback, especially the automation moves. IMPORTANT: do not attempt to tweak existing automation while the automation data is SMPTE-locked.

 

Once you're satisfied that everything's playing back nicely, open the auto/event list again, hit the hierarchy arrow to show you the list of *Automation regions, select-all, and SMPTE-unlock them. Finally, select all of your arrange-page regions and SMPTE-unlock them.

 

Post back if you have any trouble.

thats great, its worked but there is a problem....

now if i move or copy any audio or midi region, the entire arrangement goes silent, nothing on any tracks and the level meters showing nothing

Did you have any regions (or the song start marker) positioned to before bar 1 1 1 1 prior to doing any of this?

ive loaded a project file backup from before i started this and first regions start at 1.1.1.1. no markers in this project(the marker list is empty) although im not sure if a song start marker is different?

Awake now...

 

1) save this project under a new name. Then shut down your computer, reboot, relaunch, reload, and see if the song plays

 

2) if that doesn't work, go up to Song Information and re-organize memory

 

3) if that doesn't work, create a new instrument track, load up anything you want, and see if it plays

 

Post back with your results.

thanks again sir. ive done all 3 and no better. song plays fine when i create a new track and drag a file in from the audio bin, but as soon as i try dragging again, same thing.

youve had this one before?

also better mention ive just installed logic 9 on a new mac that im using while my mbpro is being repaired and the songs im editing were recorded on logic 8

Ouch!

 

The first thing that came to mind was this: L8 songs don't always play nice in L9. There is also a bug that some people have reported where moving regions causes all sound to stop -- just as you described.

 

OK, going to take you through one or two more procedures. Let's start with this one:

 

1) EXPERIMENT: go back to an earlier version that's at 120 BPM. Open the auto/event editor, click the hierarchy arrow, select all and hit Delete. Basically you're going to be erasing all of your automation data.

 

Then lock all of your regions, change the tempo, unlock the regions, and see if it plays back OK after you move a region.

 

If you have success with this then we need to address the issue of retaining your automation.

success. ive deleted automation data and project works good.

important to note that the automation was done after upgrading to L9..

over to you!

XLNT!

 

Will get back to you in a little while to tell you how to save your automation data.

Here's an alternate procedure for preserving the timing of your automation. It moves the automation out of actual track automation and moves it into regions. Then you change the tempo and move it back to track automation. The procedure is a little tedious but it works like a charm:

 

1. Determine which tracks contain automation. Then duplicate each of those tracks (using the "new track with same Channel Strip/Instrument" function). So if you have "Audio 1" containing regions and associated automation, create a duplicate Audio 1 track. Do this for each track in your song that contains automation.

 

2. Use the pencil tool to draw a blank region on one of your duplicate empty tracks. Doesn't matter if the track you choose to do this on is an audio track or a MIDI track. Stretch this region to the full length of your song (important: it must start at bar 1, beat 1, and go to the end or even slightly past it).

 

3. Color this track red or some other easily distinguishable color

 

4. Copy and paste this blank region onto each duplicate track you created.

 

5. Select all of these blank tracks using shift and then use the track automation option "move all track automation data to region" to convert automation data to MIDI region-based data.

 

6. Do a select all (CMD-A) in the Arrange window and SMPTE-lock everything.

 

7. Now you can change your tempo and the original timing of your automation data will be preserved.

 

At this point, CHECK PLAYBACK

 

8. Once you're satisfied with your new tempo, re-select your (red) automation regions and use the function "move all region control data to automation" to put the data back into your automation tracks. This will empty out your "automation regions" and you can now delete them. But before you do, ensure they're empty by using the function "select empty regions".

thats really great, thankyou

 

so is this a logic8 -9 import bug, or is this something else?

Cool!

 

Hard to say what the cause of the no-playback problem is. I don't know myself. I've never looked for the trigger, just a solution. I hope this works out for you!

its all good. thanks again for taking the time!

ive discovered similar problem on a track that i changed tempo on weeks ago.

this time no automation data was present. ive mixed and comped a lot since then and im reluctant to go back to original files.

 

can you put me in the direction of any threads about this? it's a nasty bug!

I see this is an old thread but I'd like to add something to the conversation. It would have helped me and I hope it will help others who find there way here.

 

Setting "Lock SMPTE position" on the regions IS the solution to the problem, BUT something really threw me off when I tried using it.

 

I locked my regions to SMPTE and then clicked and held down the mouse button while scrolling down to the tempo I wanted.  It appears to not be working because the regions DO NOT shift to reflect their new position EVEN THOUGH their length DOES change.  BUT when you let up on the mouse button, THEN the regions move to their correct positions.  At first I would scroll my tempo, see it wasn't working and then scroll it back to it's current setting.  Finally I accidentally let up on the mouse button while on a different tempo setting and then I saw that it was actually working.  

 

SUMMARY:

While scrolling to a new tempo it gives you correct visual feedback of the region length change BUT doesn't give you correct visual feedback of the regions position change making you think it's not working.

 

Hope this helps.