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Help new user configure a MIDI multi-instrument


knolan

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Hi,

 

I'd be very grateful for some basic setup help that has eluded me for a long time. I have read the emagic documentation thoroughly, but still cannot succeed in setting up Logic to manage a number of MIDI multi-thimbral synths. Here are the list of instruments connected via a MOTU Time-piece to Logic Pro 7 on a well configired G4:

 

K2500XS

SY99

SY77

JD800 (2)

Nord Lead 2

Korg Z1

 

 

i wish to use Logic as a sequencing environment to control all of these. in particular, I wish to use the K2500, SY99 and SY77 in multithimbral mode.

 

Everything I have tried - on and off for 2 1/2 years (from logic 5.5 believe it or not) has failed - and now am I trying desperately in earnest to get this working.

 

So - my basic requirement - to set up each of the above in logic. If i concentrate on just the SY99, then my problem - and any proposed solution can be apploied to the rest.

 

Before i start - I genuinely have read the documentation, but nowhere in the combined documentation of 5.5, 6 or Pro 7 does it explain the procedures I need - and there is clearly something I'm missing. i don't know anyone in Ireland who can help me - hence some kind heart on this forum is my last gasp attempt to have a resolution. Note also that I am computer literate, understand MIDI, and have no connnectivity problems - my issue is in configuring Logic.

 

Here is what I want to be able to do:

 

1. For the Sy99, see all 16 of its subchannels as seperate tracks in the arrange window.

2. see each sub-channel as a seperate stave in the score window

3. I don't care about program names - they will change too often on the SY99 for me to keep track of them

4. Be able to record each of those on its sub-channel/track by simply record-enabling it, withough having to change midi-channel on the master keyboard (the K2500)

5. Be able to layer/record any combination of instruments (say SY99-subchannel 2, SY77 subchannel 11 and one of the JD800s) simply by record-enabling them in logic.

 

Is all of thsi possible?

 

And - crucial - in setting up my MIDI setup in Logic - do I need to enter the environment, or is this setup fairly standard and something that should just set up fairly automatically?

 

Note also that since i now have a mess of a setup, i don't know how to go back to a 'virgin' setup to start over.

 

This is what I tried to so far (i have not been able to find how to locate the variousmultis song to drag any relevant objects into mine).

 

1. I set up MIDI in OSX Core-audio (I'm on 10.3.8 ). However - I'm not sure on how many channels to activate for send and receive for, say the SY99. I set up send and receive on all 16 channels seeing as I want to use it as a multithimbral sound source - not sure if ths is correct though.

 

2. I entered Logic and deleted everything on the default song.

 

3. I entered the environment window, set up a new multiinstrument and activated all 16 sub-channels by clicking on them.

 

4. I did nothing more in the Environment - I did not setup a physical input or a sequencer input, I simply left the multi-instrument suspended in the middle of the environment window (and renamed it sy99)

 

5. I went to the arrange window, created a new track and associated it with the sy99.

 

Howvever - I can find no way to have this track show the 16 sub-channels of the sy99 in the arrange window. So - if I want to record different instruments on different sub-channels, I must manually change the transmit channel on the master keyboard. and then, even if I record, say 6 lines this way, they all appear on a single panio-style treble and bass staves on the score window.

 

Also - if i want to layer/record one of the JD800s with one fo the SY99 sub-channels, I must manually change the JD800 receive channel - which I assume is not the way it can be done.

 

So you see that my setup is extremely basic, and I would be very grateful if someone could find the time to give me a bullet-list of procedural steps to set up a multi-thimbral instrumetn so its sub-channels get seperate tracks and staves, and how I can layer/record several physical synths by simply record-enabling, irrespective of their midi channel(for single-instruments that is).

 

I started reading over two years ago and am now desperate - please help - there is definitely a missing link in my brain regarding how Logic works, that isn't clarifying over time.

 

Thanks!

 

yours - in hope,

Kevin Nolan

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Well, first of all, I would definitely encourage you to create a clean autoload, and add to it as you go.

 

That would mean go to your environment and clean everything up but the Audio layer (where you can delete or/and add Audio objects to suit your taste).

 

You don't need the physical input and sequencer input objects to be present, so don't worry about them for now. Although for troubleshooting it can be really helpful to have a simplified "click and ports" layer consisting of one physical input object, it's SUM output cabled into a Monitor object, cabled into the sequencer input object, that's it.

 

Then on a MIDI instruments layer, create your multi-instruments. It's fine to have your multis "suspended in mid air" as you said: Logic routes all incoming MIDI data to the currently selected MIDI track in the Arrange window, and your multi has a direct output setting in its parameter window. No need to cable anything.

 

Now in your environment, select the multi by clicking on its icon at the top of the object. In the parameters, make sure the "port" parameter is set to the correct port on your MIDI interface, the one where your SY99 is cabled.

 

In your Arrange window, you can create MIDI instrument tracks and assign them to each channel (sub-instrument) of your multi. Just adjust the "channel" parameter. The concept is that a multi is like 16 sub-instruments, each on its own MIDI channel, but all going to the same port on your MIDI interface. So they are all controling the same hardware synth.

 

The only thing left that you have to check is that your SY99 is in multi-timbral mode. For that you'll have to look up your manual and look for a "performance" mode or something like that. You should be able to play all 16 channels at the same time (for example, you can record drums on cha1, bass on cha2, piano on cha3... and then play back everything at the same time from Logic). I know on the K2500 you just have to click the topmost leftmost button called "Program" to enter the Program mode and voila, you're in multi-timbral mode. On other synths it can be a little more tricky.

 

Hope I helped? Let me know how it goes, or if you have any further questions. We should definitely be able to get you up and running through this forum. Good luck!

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David,

thank you so much for your response to this question. I have had the same exact problem, trying to setup the midi portion since I bought this software some 5 years ago.

I've used it for realtime tracking in that time, but have never been sucessful with the midi to run the way it should.

I haven't tried your solution yet, but thank you so much for taking the time to respond so thoroughly. I too have read the manual, and maybe it's because I'm not a keyboard guy, but your explanation was excellent and also a great example that Logic should maybe include so us midiots can have some clue as to how this all should be configured.

Thanks again man!

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Well maybe I spoke too soon.

Here I am once again trying to configure my midi setup..and I keep getting stuck with whether I use OMS or FreeMidi.

I've tried both. Oms won't detect my Motu MTP AV, and freemidi says I have to use OMS as my main midi platform.

Help guys...I know I don't have all the latest stuff, but I have never been able to get this to work since I got it all. What am I doing wrong?

 

Sincerely frustrated.

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Matchless, sorry to hear that. I encourage you to start another thread detailing your problem and what version of OMS and FreeMidi you use and how you configure them.

 

One quick, obvious solution would be to upgrade to OS X, which doesn't need OMS or FreeMidi. But that would mean upgrade to Logic Pro 7, and upgrade to a Dual G5..... ok there must be an easier way! :(

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Thanks David and ChrisE -

 

It's working. Believe it or not, I have spent months trying to get one track on the arrange window to 'open' into 16 sub-tracks associated with the multiinstrument called sy99.

 

It never once occurred to me that I simply allocate one midi track in the arrange window to each sub-channel. I had explained my problem to numerous people at emagic, soundtech, sos furum and some colleagues over the phone, and was utterly frustrated at how easy everyone said it was. It just never occurred to me how to allocate tracks to sub-channels. This was the missing link in my understanding of Logic - and on reading Davids reply the penny dropped, and I have almost finished setting up an initial workable Logic setup. You cannot know what a relief this is - I was beginning to think I had a screw loose (no comments please!).

 

In any case - thanks a million - a myriad of stuff has all clicked into place seen as I had read the docs. All along I had expected 'sub-tracks' associated with sub-channels and was perplexed when they would not materialise - its seems so obvious now!

 

Cheers,

Kevin.

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I too searhed high and low in the manual for this info. I originally had someone else set set up my environment back when I used 4.5, so I didn't know how to do it when I got to 6. Just TONIGHT I had a friend explain it to me - very simple once you know. Why oh why wouldn't they put this critical info in the manual?

Anyway, thank goodness for this forum.

Shari

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