Help with lining up looped tracks in Logic Express

I posted the following in September on the official Logic Express discussion board:

 

"I'm working on my first song in Logic Express 9, and after successfully creating two tracks, lining them up perfectly, and looping them, I've run across a problem with the third track.

 

After creating the third track I zoomed in as far as I could and aligned it perfectly with the other two tracks. However, when I looped the third track and zoomed in all of the way to the beginning of its second loop,I saw that the track had slightly gone out of sync with the other two tracks. I've tried adjusting it over and over again, and even though the track appears to be perfectly aligned, once I loop it, it somehow doesn't match up with the other two tracks. Below is a simple diagram that illustrates the problem, just in case I'm not being clear enough.

 

Diagram Key: 'I---I' = one looped section

 

Track 1: I---I---I---I

Track 2: I---I---I---I

Track 3: I---I--- I--- I

 

Any help would be greatly appreciated, as I'd really like to continue with this project, but am so frustrated at this point that I don't want to do another thing in the program until this issue is resolved. Thank you."

 

One of the board members attempted to help me, but was not able to solve my problem. I abandoned the program for months I was so frustrated with it, and now I've come back it just to get frustrated all over again. I came to this board not only because the apple website is a f$@%ing piece of s#!+ and always sends me to an error page when I try to log in on the board, but also because someone here may be more helpful.

 

Here is a link to the thread I posted on the official board: http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=2585852&tstart=200

 

If I don't figure this out soon, I really think I will go f$@%ing crazy and take a s#!+ on the Logic Express disc.

 

Thanks.

When you click and hold on the region that loses sync, what do the numbers at the bottom right of the help tag say?

 

It should read "X 0 0 0". Anything else, and it will eventually lose sync when looping.

Never used LE, but Logic does have a bug where sometimes a region can't be made to be exactly an even-number of measures long. What you see in redlogic's screenshot is a dot after the "3" in the length. That indicates that the length of the section is 24 measures, 3 ticks, and some undetermined number of samples long. The 3 ticks can be trimmed, no problem. But the undetermined number of samples cannot always be trimmed using conventional methods.

 

So first, please confirm what the yellow help tag show for the region's length. If there's a dot at the end, make indicate it clearly so that in your post we don't confuse it as a period. Something like this would be good:

 

4_0_0_0.  <--- dot at end

Here is the information from several regions (all following periods are used to indicate dots):

 

Region 1: ._3_1_21.

Region 2: Same as Region 1

Region 3: Same as Region 1

Region 4: 1_2_2_38.

Region 5: 1_3_0_0

Region 6: Same as Region 5

Region 7: 4_2_0_9.

Region 8: 1_3_0_5.

Anyone?

I'm not sure I'm following: if you're trying to loop regions, how come they have such odd lengths rather than just plain "1 bar", or "2 bars"?

 

And are you only trying to sync the regions on tracks 1, 2 & 3?

All of the regions are MIDI recordings I made and I'm simply trying to line some of them up with others and then loop them. And I have been able to line all of them up originally, but once they're looped, sooner or later they go out of sync with the other region(s) I lined them up with.

 

There are actually quite a few tracks in the project, as when I started I figured I'd get a rough idea of what I wanted and then go back for fine tuning. I only brought up three tracks because that's what I was attempting to fine tune at the time and I wanted to keep things as simple as possible for anyone who could potentially help.

 

I apologize for any confusion, but as I'm sure you can tell, I'm still in the process of learning. I hope this has clarified some issues.

Attach a screenshot of the regions that start lined up then fall out of sync eventually when looping. You only need to show a few loops of each region so just do a selective screen shot (if you press Shift + Command +4 your mouse pointer will turn to crosshairs, click and drag over the area you need to show). Make sure the image is only 800 px wide then attach it to your post.

If you don't fix your regions' lenghts to match Logic's grid, you'll get the results you're currently getting: "phase music".

 

J.

From top to bottom:

 

Image 1: The regions on track 1 and track 2 are lined up. The looped region in track 4 is not lining up with them (the region in track 3 has already ended at this point).

 

The rest of the images are zoomed in as far as possible.

 

Image 2: The beginning of the region in track 4, clearly lining up with the other tracks.

 

Image 3: The end of the region in track 4, clearly lining up with the other tracks.

 

Image 4: The end of the first loop, slightly not lining up with the other tracks.

 

Image 5: The end of the second loop, slightly not lining up with the other tracks.

 

Image 6: The end of the third loop, slightly not lining up with the other tracks.

 

Image 7: The end of the fourth loop, slightly not lining up with the other tracks.

http://www.logicprohelp.com/files/screen_shot_2011_01_02_at_91714_pm_607.png

 

 

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5129/5319085827_0df008d08d_z.jpg

 

 

Do you see how nicely they line up with each other, and with the bar ruler on top ...and with the lines at the bottom (the grid).

 

Did you even set the tempo to your liking before you started recording?

 

J.

The project's tempo is set at 120, which I believe was the default setting.

 

I've tried changing the tempo by selecting the drum track and going to 'Tempo' and trying the two 'Adjust Tempo' options, but all it does is make everything far faster than I want it to be. Bleh.

I've tried changing the tempo by selecting the drum track and going to 'Tempo' and trying the two 'Adjust Tempo' options, but all it does is make everything far faster than I want it to be. Bleh.

 

The tempo isn't the issue. Look at how Jordito's regions all fall on the same spot ultimately. Every thing is set to fall on the measure whether it is one large (two bar long region) or several smaller regions that end up falling right on the bar.

 

[Edit]Edited my poor spelling.

Edited January 4, 2011 by Scott Jackson

You need to use the grid in the Arrange area, and your help tag. I'm still not sure what you're trying to do, but trying to loop various regions of various odd lengths as you're doing doesn't sound like a good idea. How come the regions are not an exact number of bars? Are you trying to do an effect with odd rhythms and such? Or did you simply not take the time to adjust the tempo of your project to the tempo of your music - meaning, if you turn on the metronome now, it sounds off compared to the beat of your music?

 

If it's the latter, you need to solve that first. If a region sounds like a 2 bar loop, it should also look like a 2 bar loop.

It definitely sounds off when I turn on the metronome.

It definitely sounds off when I turn on the metronome.

 

OK so you should fix that first. One way would be to option-resize all your MIDI region so they LOOK right (a 2 bar region should occupy exactly 2 bars on the grid), then adjust the tempo in your transport bar to taste.

OK so you should fix that first. One way would be to option-resize all your MIDI region so they LOOK right (a 2 bar region should occupy exactly 2 bars on the grid), then adjust the tempo in your transport bar to taste.

 

I fit the drums to one bar and adjusted the tempo in the transport bar, but now there's empty space at the end of the region and each of its loops.

I fit the drums to one bar and adjusted the tempo in the transport bar, but now there's empty space at the end of the region and each of its loops.

 

Un-loop the region. Cut the original region to size. You can use the Marquee tool or what I like to do is place the playhead where you want to cut the region then select "Split By Playhead" and delete the new region that is empty space. Now re-loop the new region.

If I do that then I end up with the region not matching the grid again.

well,

 

Unloop,

 

Set your locators (loop - start and end point) to match your region, highlight the region, and use the 'Trim regions to fill within regions drop down.

well,

 

Unloop,

 

Set your locators (loop - start and end point) to match your region, highlight the region, and use the 'Trim regions to fill within regions drop down.

 

Do you mean "Trim to Fill within Locators?"

 

Because that doesn't seem to do anything.

I really am trying here.

I don't know. For all the trouble you are having with this, you would be better off redoing the projects and follow the advice given to you.

So no idea how I can get the grid to match the tempo I've selected?

OK so you should fix that first. One way would be to option-resize all your MIDI region so they LOOK right (a 2 bar region should occupy exactly 2 bars on the grid), then adjust the tempo in your transport bar to taste.

 

I fit the drums to one bar and adjusted the tempo in the transport bar, but now there's empty space at the end of the region and each of its loops.

 

You may be doing something wrong: changing the tempo of the project should not affect the musical length of your MIDI regions. If you've resized your MIDI region to be 2 bars long, then adjust the tempo, the MIDI region will stay 2 bars long.

You may be doing something wrong: changing the tempo of the project should not affect the musical length of your MIDI regions. If you've resized your MIDI region to be 2 bars long, then adjust the tempo, the MIDI region will stay 2 bars long.

 

I resized the region to be one bar long and adjusted the tempo to the way I want it, but there's still empty space between loops.

 

Is there some way I can change the grid to the tempo, because this doesn't seem to be working.

I resized the region to be one bar long and adjusted the tempo to the way I want it,

 

uh-huh.

 

but there's still empty space between loops.

 

Well, then you either didn't resize the region to 1 bar, or the music in the region is not 1 bar long. Do you mean you made the music fit to one bar, or you left the notes how they were and extended the region? You should post a screenshot, otherwise we've no idea what you're talking about really.

 

Is there some way I can change the grid to the tempo, because this doesn't seem to be working.

 

The grid is set to the tempo, whatever tempo your project is set to. If you played or wrote-in music that isn't at the same tempo as the project, that isn't Logic's fault. Have you used the metronome to see if it matches the music? Do the notes in the piano roll match up to the grid lines? Were you sent here to test us?

I resized the region to be one bar long and adjusted the tempo to the way I want it but there's still empty space between loops.

 

Are we still talking about a MIDI region? If yes then it shouldn't change length when adjusting the tempo: try this: open a brand new, empty project. Create a fresh, new empty 1 bar long MIDI region. Change the tempo of the project a few times. It doesn't matter what tempo you choose, your region should always be one bar long.

 

Is that working?

Well, then you either didn't resize the region to 1 bar, or the music in the region is not 1 bar long. Do you mean you made the music fit to one bar, or you left the notes how they were and extended the region? You should post a screenshot, otherwise we've no idea what you're talking about really.

 

I left the notes how they were and extended the region.

 

Have you used the metronome to see if it matches the music? Do the notes in the piano roll match up to the grid lines?

 

The metronome still doesn't seem to be matching the music.

 

Some of the notes in the piano roll are a little off of the grid, as they needed to be for it to be timed correctly.

 

Are we still talking about a MIDI region? If yes then it shouldn't change length when adjusting the tempo: try this: open a brand new, empty project. Create a fresh, new empty 1 bar long MIDI region. Change the tempo of the project a few times. It doesn't matter what tempo you choose, your region should always be one bar long.

 

Is that working?

 

The length of the region never changed by itself - I changed it to fit one bar and then corrected the tempo, which left empty space between the loops. It seems to me that the grid needs to be made to match the correct tempo, however, I don't know how to do that. When I used to open new projects I think I was asked what I wanted the tempo of the project to be, but for some reason that isn't happening now. How can I change it without the prompt? Can I change it in the middle of a project or can I only do it when I create a new one? How am I supposed to the know the tempo of a project before I've started working on it?

It's easier to help you if you upload the logic file.