Plug-in Delay Compensation broken with external side-chain

[Darude]

I've been using logic for over 10 years now. I'm afraid that it's time for me to move on...

I understand your frustrations and you're well within your rights to move on.

 

Check out Waves Studio Rack. It's a free plugin that in itself has Waves' S1 Imager plugin built-in for each band/instance and is a wicked good parallel & serial plug-in "rack", if you will. https://www.waves.com/plugins/studiorack#introducing-the-new-studiorack-plugin-chainer

[ansolas]

the issue with bitwig (for me) is that you can't control subtracks of a group with a MCU :/

[Atlas007]

…

2. No support for any sort of rack style plugin packs like abelton. This is super helpful for parallel processing audio within a plugin chain and having simultaneous wet/dry control. Logic is at a huge disadvantage here.

Not sure to understand what you mean here… Line6, NI, IK, racks works just fine here…

 

3. Can't have a single instance of a midi effect (like an LFO) sharing multiple destinations.

Have you tried using IAC loop?

 

I could go on

Logic isn’t perfect, but no DAW is either. Every DAW has its flaws and pitfals. Good luck anyway on your journey!

[sunbrother]

…

2. No support for any sort of rack style plugin packs like abelton. This is super helpful for parallel processing audio within a plugin chain and having simultaneous wet/dry control. Logic is at a huge disadvantage here.

Not sure to understand what you mean here… Line6, NI, IK, racks works just fine here…

 

More and more DAWs now have re-usable built-in effects racks you can build with splitting, routing, assignable macros and stuff like that. If all you're accustomed to are Smart Controls, Channel Strips, and The Environment it may feel like you already have it, but in Bitwig/Ableton/Studio One it's more comparable to something like Kilohearts Snap Heap, built into the DAW. And in those you can save a rack like "Parallel Saturation Effects" and drop it into a slot like a normal effect; it will have its own custom knobs etc. https://rekkerd.org/sample-magic-ableton-magic-racks-mix-essentials/

 

I'm not sure why that belongs in this thread, however. Has anyone heard back from Apple about the 10.6.2 - 10.7.3 issue they introduced? I sent a few detailed and clear reports and didn't even get a reply.

[Atlas007]

As you mentioned, to me, this looks pretty much like Smart Control presets' like implementation into commercial 3rd party products...

[David Nahmani]

More and more DAWs now have re-usable built-in effects racks you can build with splitting, routing, assignable macros and stuff like that.

Here's an existing new feature suggestion on this topic where you could add your voice and suggest specific features such as splitting, routing and macros:

 

"Plugin Stack" feature. Who wants this?

[JOB]

More and more DAWs now have re-usable built-in effects racks you can build with splitting, routing, assignable macros and stuff like that.

Here's an existing new feature suggestion on this topic where you could add your voice and suggest specific features such as splitting, routing and macros:

 

"Plugin Stack" feature. Who wants this?

 

Nice. Just copy Ableton here, their layout is perfect, couldn't be quicker or easier.

[David Nahmani]

Nice. Just copy Ableton here, their layout is perfect, couldn't be quicker or easier.

Better post your comments regarding this topic in the linked thread!

[seewest]

Seem to having issues again

[sunbrother]

The list of issues introduced post-10.6.1 keeps getting longer. Not sure if I prefer the “fixed” behavior or the old behavior.

 

Enabling Low Latency Monitoring disables every sidechain in the song

[JOB]

I'm loving the fixed behavior. I can finally sidechain correctly. I'm working on the coolest sounding track I've ever made right now, that wouldn't have been possible in Logic until now.

 

It kinda pisses me off, because for years I thought the issue was my engineering skills, couldn't figure out why I couldn't get stuff dialed in the way others were. Got caught thinking it was some elusive trick or skill. Nope, just a defective DAW.

 

I had no idea about the sidechain latency issues until the last few years. Now that they're fixed, and things are easily dialed in and sounding great, I'm a mix of elated to finally know what my issue has been, and absolutely pissed at Apple and Logic for wasting a countless amount of my time.

 

Fortunately most of what I've done the past 10 years is 4 on the floor, so Xfer's LFO did the trick, but every time I veered away from that I could never dial in the sidechain right, and could never catch the feel I was going for.

[mclight]

Forgive my ignorance - but what exactly is "fixed" now? For me it was not so much a problem with incorrect timing when using sidechain (eg. these pumping compressors, no timing problems with these), but latency introduced when playing notes (eg. recording midi events via playing my keyboard). Since about a year I have to either switch on the low-latency mode or remove all sidechain inputs if I wanted to have low enough latency to record my playing properly (that is without noticeable delay). I suppose this has not been fixed, or has it? The last time I tested this is about 2 weeks ago and the problem was still there ...

[JOB]

Forgive my ignorance - but what exactly is "fixed" now?

 

The sidechain timing used to fall off when applied to busses if the project got past a certain point of tracks/busses. That's working now, bus away and the sidechaining remains locked in as it should.

[seq998]

When I’m sidechaining some channels with Logic 10.7.3 compressor I get timing unsynced percussions onto other channels with Logic Sampler. It’s a nightmare!

[ViktorL]

I have the same problem. In my last Logic session I wanted to side chain the bass to the kick drum. And then my vocal tracks with Melodyne ARA got out of sync. I hope that this bug will be fixed in the next release.

[rfpm]

Been a while since I checked in on this thread, moved over to Reaper due to this issue a few years ago and never looked back. Seeing that 10.7.5 just released and it's nearly 2023, have Apple yet addressed and fully fixed this issue for all scenarios it occurs in or is it still present in multiple ways?

[RB77]

On 7/19/2022 at 4:43 AM, ViktorL said:

I have the same problem. In my last Logic session I wanted to side chain the bass to the kick drum. And then my vocal tracks with Melodyne ARA got out of sync. I hope that this bug will be fixed in the next release.

Exact same issue here. If I have melodyne in the project and add any kind of sidechaining to a bus, it knocks all of the timing out of whack on melodyne. Really frustrating since it didn't used to do this before 10.6.2.

[sunbrother]

Can anyone who observed the current version of this problem in 10.6.2 to 10.7.4 let us know if this problem is still present in 10.7.5?

Edited November 15, 2022 by sunbrother

[sunbrother]

The problems introduced in 10.6.2 are still a problem in 10.7.5.

1. Sidechaining inserts to any audio track will throw off the timing of all other tracks in the project.

2. Using Low Latency Monitoring mode will re-route the sidechains of tracks you are not monitoring.

[NateVanDeusen]

Same issue here, I just bought an m1 studio and went from my intel mini running Logic 10.5.1 to Logic 10.7.5 and now all my old projects are having major latency issues on tracks that have any external sidechaining. I still have my Intel Mac mini with 10.5.1 and have none of these issues. I guess i'll have to go back to that until these issues are corrected.

Unfortunate that I thought upgrading would improve my work flow, instead I'm just wasting time trying to figure out these issues. 

 

[NoPro]

Fixed ?

Edited December 24, 2022 by NoPro

[des99]

I think when they finally fix this the release notes will shout about it in ALL CAPS! 🙂

No fixed for now. 😔

Edited December 24, 2022 by des99

[sunbrother]

For anyone who’s curious the current workaround I know of (for general mixing scenarios) is to create extra buses so that you’re never sidechaining between individual tracks, even if it means having a lot of single track buses.

[NoPro]

I’ll be checking things with headphones closely when side-chaining anything . 

[Rambird]

Does anybody know if the V14 Studiorack makes it reliably possible to use older Waves Plugin versions (that haven't been updated via the **** update plan). Talking about V10-12. I wrote to the W support and they told me it might work but they haven't tested it, I would test it myself but I though maybe someone already did that over a longer period of time.

[cuervopunk]

Nop, still broken, I have to disable the external side chain when recording, otherwise I have TERRIBLE latency.

[jimmyk]

Hello - I have not been mixing for a while but just recently got back into it.  I bought a new M1 mac mini running Ventura13.1 and Logic 10.7.6 

I am trying to sidechain Trackspacer on my bass track with my kick as the sidechain.  I am experiencing the awful latency and timing issue described here.  I am using the Trackspacer plugin on the bass audio track and using the sidechain input directly from the Logic Drummer instrument track.

I really would like to get this project finished.  I think I have read all of the posts in this topic but is there any workaround to this that doesn't completely wreck workflow?  I thought I read something about using busses, but couldn't find a clear how-to. I would hate to have to bounce everything to stems for example and mix in a new file with no/zero latency plugins and then not be able to make more tweaks without bouncing every time I do.

I would be grateful if someone could provide a reasonable workaround until this gets fixed.

[jimmyk]

NM - I restored version 10.6.1 from my old Mac and it now works great!  Not sure what else is broken in 10.6.1 but I am happy for now.

[steinweg]

Has anyone of you guys still hope, that they will finally fix this in the near future? It is soo annoying to work around it all the time... I have been reporting this every few months since 10.6.3 now, nothing happened.

[sunbrother]

4 hours ago, steinweg said:

Has anyone of you guys still hope, that they will finally fix this in the near future? It is soo annoying to work around it all the time... I have been reporting this every few months since 10.6.3 now, nothing happened.

Not really. With the amount of work they're pouring into Logic for iPad I have a feeling we'll see a new version with a subscription before we see this issue fixed for good.

Edited May 21, 2023 by sunbrother