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kerochan
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about to order new Mac Mini or Trash Can Mac Pro ?

Sun Nov 04, 2018 11:15 pm

So I have placed the new Mac Mini in my basket, haven't checked out yet....

Thinking it might be easier to just get a refurbished Mac Pro.
it has all the TB2 ports I need for my hardware, no adaptors needed, I can plug my screen in also.
and I can order it with Sierra or El Capitan, no Mojave problems, I will use Logic 10.3.2 anyway, as its stable for me.

The new mac mini is great, but I really was hoping it would have TB2 ports AND TB3 ports.

Any thoughts?
Apple Certified Pro - Logic Pro X 10.3.
Logic Pro X 10.3.2 El Capitan. 10.11.3
Macbook Pro mid 2015 15" 2.8 Quad core i7 16GBRAM,
Thunderbolt 27 display.
UA Apollo 8 QUAD audio interface and satellite TB Quad & Apollo Twin Duo.
Genelec 8040 monitors + Avantone Mixcube
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David Nahmani
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Re: about to order new Mac Mini or Trash Can Mac Pro ?

Mon Nov 05, 2018 6:52 am

Can you list the specs for both machines so we can compare?
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• My Logic Pro X 10.5 book (Apple Pro Training Series)
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redgreenblue
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Re: about to order new Mac Mini or Trash Can Mac Pro ?

Mon Nov 05, 2018 7:38 am

I would be more inclined for the Mac Mini. The Mac Pro does have traditional ports, which is great, but if it ever needs a repair it is likely to be expensive. Having a warranty + AppleCare is a good thing. An OWC TB3 Dock can give you more ports and with the exception of the GPU the Mac Mini could very well bench as fast or faster than the Mac Pro.
Logic 10.5.1
2011 iMac 12 gigs RAM (10.13.6)
2018 Mac Mini i7, 32 gigs RAM (10.14.6)
MOTU 828 MKIII Hybrid
Behringer ADA8200 x2
MOTU Midi Express x 2
A nice variety of old analog and hybrid synths
Novation stuff out the wazoo, including an SL61mk2, SL37, ZeroSLmk2
http://www.shaneking.com
http://www.redgreenblue.bandcamp.com
 
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JurgenFrenz
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Re: about to order new Mac Mini or Trash Can Mac Pro ?

Mon Nov 05, 2018 7:44 am

The new Mac Mini supports eGPU via one of the Thunderbolt 3 connectors - there are already several manufacturers.
For Logic the inbuilt new Intel graphic chip should be quite enough, according to the specs the new Mini supports up to 3 (three) 4k monitors.
 
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redgreenblue
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Re: about to order new Mac Mini or Trash Can Mac Pro ?

Mon Nov 05, 2018 7:52 am

For me I'm not worried about the GPU, it is fine for my needs, I was just pointing out that it will have a weaker GPU than the Mac Pro.
Logic 10.5.1
2011 iMac 12 gigs RAM (10.13.6)
2018 Mac Mini i7, 32 gigs RAM (10.14.6)
MOTU 828 MKIII Hybrid
Behringer ADA8200 x2
MOTU Midi Express x 2
A nice variety of old analog and hybrid synths
Novation stuff out the wazoo, including an SL61mk2, SL37, ZeroSLmk2
http://www.shaneking.com
http://www.redgreenblue.bandcamp.com
 
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triplets
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Re: about to order new Mac Mini or Trash Can Mac Pro ?

Mon Nov 05, 2018 9:25 am

kerochan wrote:
Thinking it might be easier to just get a refurbished Mac Pro.


You're paying for 2 graphic cards that you don't need for logic and ram speed on the mac mini is twice as fast.
You really wanna pay so much money for a computer that was only meant for graphic and film editing?

With the money you save with mac mini, you can add a thunderbolt dock to minimize adapters:

https://eshop.macsales.com/Search/?q=&f ... dpath=4448
Logic Pro 9 Master Pro and X certified
ProTools 10 & 11 Certified Operator
2 x 3.06 Intel Six-Core 24 GB RAM, Logic 10.5.1, 10.14.6., UA Apollo
2012 i7 MBP 8 GB Logic 10.6.1, 10.15.7
Contact me for Logic help (Teamviewer, Zoom, Skype)
http://www.ultimatestudiosinc.com
 
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kerochan
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Re: about to order new Mac Mini or Trash Can Mac Pro ?

Mon Nov 05, 2018 9:32 am

David Nahmani wrote:
Can you list the specs for both machines so we can compare?


Hi David
The mac Mini comes to £1969.00 with Apple Care
The Trash can comes to £2570.00 with warranty

Here are the specs:
I really like the idea the trash can has Sierra and the right Tb2 ports, though it does feel like stepping backwards a bit.
Any thoughts?
mini.png
mini.png (50.01 KiB) Viewed 1219 times
PRO.png
PRO.png (101.11 KiB) Viewed 1218 times
Apple Certified Pro - Logic Pro X 10.3.
Logic Pro X 10.3.2 El Capitan. 10.11.3
Macbook Pro mid 2015 15" 2.8 Quad core i7 16GBRAM,
Thunderbolt 27 display.
UA Apollo 8 QUAD audio interface and satellite TB Quad & Apollo Twin Duo.
Genelec 8040 monitors + Avantone Mixcube
Macbook Air (for traveling) i7 2 core, 8gb RAM.
 
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kerochan
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Re: about to order new Mac Mini or Trash Can Mac Pro ?

Mon Nov 05, 2018 9:46 am

triplets wrote:
kerochan wrote:
Thinking it might be easier to just get a refurbished Mac Pro.


You're paying for 2 graphic cards that you don't need for logic and ram speed on the mac mini is twice as fast.
You really wanna pay so much money for a computer that was only meant for graphic and film editing?

With the money you save with mac mini, you can add a thunderbolt dock to minimize adapters:

https://eshop.macsales.com/Search/?q=&f ... dpath=4448

Thanks triplets
I will see if I can find that dock in UK.
* Actually I am confused triplets, which one of those docks do I need? I have a TB 2 display and my Apollo TB2.
whereas the macmini ports are USBC TB3.
Apple Certified Pro - Logic Pro X 10.3.
Logic Pro X 10.3.2 El Capitan. 10.11.3
Macbook Pro mid 2015 15" 2.8 Quad core i7 16GBRAM,
Thunderbolt 27 display.
UA Apollo 8 QUAD audio interface and satellite TB Quad & Apollo Twin Duo.
Genelec 8040 monitors + Avantone Mixcube
Macbook Air (for traveling) i7 2 core, 8gb RAM.
 
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David Nahmani
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Re: about to order new Mac Mini or Trash Can Mac Pro ?

Mon Nov 05, 2018 10:02 am

My vote goes for the Mac mini. Smaller, faster, leaner, more recent, less expensive, most likely a better resale value...

Check this out: https://9to5mac.com/2018/11/02/mac-mini ... geekbench/

Oh and I really like the idea of a dock if you're going to use multiple hard drives but don't need all of them connected simultaneously.
David Nahmani
• My Logic Pro X 10.5 book (Apple Pro Training Series)
Contact me for Private Lessons
Logic Pro X 10.6.1
MacBook Air 1.3 GHz i5 — MacOS X 11.0.1 — 4 GB RAM
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kerochan
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Re: about to order new Mac Mini or Trash Can Mac Pro ?

Mon Nov 05, 2018 10:23 am

Thanks David, you, and others on here have convinced me to go for the Mac Mini.

I really am confused with the dock thing though, at the moment I have 2 pieces of TB2 hardware and 2 USB 3 drives, and I have another 2 USB 3 drives I sometimes connect also.
The Mac Mini is TB3 USBC , so which dock am I meant to get!? a TB2 dock or TB3 dock?

You can tell I haven't bough a computer for some time!
Apple Certified Pro - Logic Pro X 10.3.
Logic Pro X 10.3.2 El Capitan. 10.11.3
Macbook Pro mid 2015 15" 2.8 Quad core i7 16GBRAM,
Thunderbolt 27 display.
UA Apollo 8 QUAD audio interface and satellite TB Quad & Apollo Twin Duo.
Genelec 8040 monitors + Avantone Mixcube
Macbook Air (for traveling) i7 2 core, 8gb RAM.
 
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triplets
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Re: about to order new Mac Mini or Trash Can Mac Pro ?

Mon Nov 05, 2018 1:17 pm

kerochan wrote:
I really am confused with the dock thing though, at the moment I have 2 pieces of TB2 hardware and 2 USB 3 drives, and I have another 2 USB 3 drives I sometimes connect also.
The Mac Mini is TB3 USBC , so which dock am I meant to get!? a TB2 dock or TB3 dock?


For the new mac mini you need this dock:

https://eshop.macsales.com/item/OWC/TB3DK12PSG/

But for your display and interface, this dock doesn't have dedicated TB2 ports. It has one mini display port which is the same as a TB port, which you could use for the display .So you would still need to get TB2 to TB3 adapters from Apple to use the TB3 ports on the mini:

https://www.apple.com/shop/product/MMEL ... -2-adapter
Logic Pro 9 Master Pro and X certified
ProTools 10 & 11 Certified Operator
2 x 3.06 Intel Six-Core 24 GB RAM, Logic 10.5.1, 10.14.6., UA Apollo
2012 i7 MBP 8 GB Logic 10.6.1, 10.15.7
Contact me for Logic help (Teamviewer, Zoom, Skype)
http://www.ultimatestudiosinc.com
 
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redgreenblue
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Re: about to order new Mac Mini or Trash Can Mac Pro ?

Mon Nov 05, 2018 1:58 pm

triplets wrote:
For the new mac mini you need this dock:

https://eshop.macsales.com/item/OWC/TB3DK12PSG/

But for your display and interface, this dock doesn't have dedicated TB2 ports. It has one mini display port which is the same as a TB port, which you could use for the display .So you would still need to get TB2 to TB3 adapters from Apple to use the TB3 ports on the mini:

https://www.apple.com/shop/product/MMEL ... -2-adapter


The MiniDisplay port on the dock might not support the Thunderbolt display. I'll try to be clear in my explanation: There is a difference between MiniDisplay port and Thunderbolt 2, even though the ports look identical. With the Touchbar Macs I deploy here at my job we need different adapters depending on if the display is MDP or TB, and that is for Apple displays!!! For your TB display you might need to get at TB3-TB2 adapter. Annoying but it will allow the ports on the TB display to be used. I'm not saying that I know FOR SURE that the dock won't work, but it is possible it won't. I'd ask OWC before ordering. There is also a difference between USB-C and TB3 even though they look identical. What confuses me about that OWC dock is this, TB3 doesn't support MiniDisplay Port, USB-C does. But USB-C doesn't support TB, that is why we need different adapters at my job.

For you most if not all of your needs will be satisfied with a TB3 dock. I don't know if the TB2 dock running through an adapter will work or not. I'm sure I'll find out when I order my Mac Mini and try to use the OWC TB2 dock that I have at home.
Logic 10.5.1
2011 iMac 12 gigs RAM (10.13.6)
2018 Mac Mini i7, 32 gigs RAM (10.14.6)
MOTU 828 MKIII Hybrid
Behringer ADA8200 x2
MOTU Midi Express x 2
A nice variety of old analog and hybrid synths
Novation stuff out the wazoo, including an SL61mk2, SL37, ZeroSLmk2
http://www.shaneking.com
http://www.redgreenblue.bandcamp.com
 
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kerochan
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Re: about to order new Mac Mini or Trash Can Mac Pro ?

Mon Nov 05, 2018 10:47 pm

redgreenblue wrote:
triplets wrote:
For the new mac mini you need this dock:

https://eshop.macsales.com/item/OWC/TB3DK12PSG/

But for your display and interface, this dock doesn't have dedicated TB2 ports. It has one mini display port which is the same as a TB port, which you could use for the display .So you would still need to get TB2 to TB3 adapters from Apple to use the TB3 ports on the mini:

https://www.apple.com/shop/product/MMEL ... -2-adapter


The MiniDisplay port on the dock might not support the Thunderbolt display. I'll try to be clear in my explanation: There is a difference between MiniDisplay port and Thunderbolt 2, even though the ports look identical. With the Touchbar Macs I deploy here at my job we need different adapters depending on if the display is MDP or TB, and that is for Apple displays!!! For your TB display you might need to get at TB3-TB2 adapter. Annoying but it will allow the ports on the TB display to be used. I'm not saying that I know FOR SURE that the dock won't work, but it is possible it won't. I'd ask OWC before ordering. There is also a difference between USB-C and TB3 even though they look identical. What confuses me about that OWC dock is this, TB3 doesn't support MiniDisplay Port, USB-C does. But USB-C doesn't support TB, that is why we need different adapters at my job.

For you most if not all of your needs will be satisfied with a TB3 dock. I don't know if the TB2 dock running through an adapter will work or not. I'm sure I'll find out when I order my Mac Mini and try to use the OWC TB2 dock that I have at home.


Thank you for you time redgreenblue,
Yes, you are correct about the mini display port, it will not work with TB 2 or any TB for that matter, even though it is identical!
However there is no difference between USBC and TB3, its just a different name! as you can see confirmation on here:
Screen Shot 2018-11-06 at 06.47.01.png
Screen Shot 2018-11-06 at 06.47.01.png (27.72 KiB) Viewed 1091 times
from the Apple site itself.
Apple Certified Pro - Logic Pro X 10.3.
Logic Pro X 10.3.2 El Capitan. 10.11.3
Macbook Pro mid 2015 15" 2.8 Quad core i7 16GBRAM,
Thunderbolt 27 display.
UA Apollo 8 QUAD audio interface and satellite TB Quad & Apollo Twin Duo.
Genelec 8040 monitors + Avantone Mixcube
Macbook Air (for traveling) i7 2 core, 8gb RAM.
 
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triplets
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Re: about to order new Mac Mini or Trash Can Mac Pro ?

Tue Nov 06, 2018 7:58 am

kerochan wrote:
However there is no difference between USBC and TB3, its just a different name!


That only applies to Apple computers.

On PCs you can have a USB-C port, but no Thunderbolt 3 implementation. Most likely USB 3.1.
Logic Pro 9 Master Pro and X certified
ProTools 10 & 11 Certified Operator
2 x 3.06 Intel Six-Core 24 GB RAM, Logic 10.5.1, 10.14.6., UA Apollo
2012 i7 MBP 8 GB Logic 10.6.1, 10.15.7
Contact me for Logic help (Teamviewer, Zoom, Skype)
http://www.ultimatestudiosinc.com
 
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redgreenblue
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Re: about to order new Mac Mini or Trash Can Mac Pro ?

Tue Nov 06, 2018 9:55 am

yes, there is a difference in function, for example a USB-C cable can't do Target Mode data transfers, plus the MacBook has a single USB-C connector that ISN'T a TB3 connector, which means a TB3 dock and/or TB display won't connect to it. We discovered that the hard way. (that is such a s#!+ computer) Plus I don't think that TB3 supports powering the computer which is why the power adapters that come with the Macs are USB-C. This isn't me being pedantic, the differences matter for some things.
Logic 10.5.1
2011 iMac 12 gigs RAM (10.13.6)
2018 Mac Mini i7, 32 gigs RAM (10.14.6)
MOTU 828 MKIII Hybrid
Behringer ADA8200 x2
MOTU Midi Express x 2
A nice variety of old analog and hybrid synths
Novation stuff out the wazoo, including an SL61mk2, SL37, ZeroSLmk2
http://www.shaneking.com
http://www.redgreenblue.bandcamp.com
 
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redgreenblue
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Re: about to order new Mac Mini or Trash Can Mac Pro ?

Tue Nov 06, 2018 10:01 am

The benchmarks are looking really good for this machine. Time for some debt!
Logic 10.5.1
2011 iMac 12 gigs RAM (10.13.6)
2018 Mac Mini i7, 32 gigs RAM (10.14.6)
MOTU 828 MKIII Hybrid
Behringer ADA8200 x2
MOTU Midi Express x 2
A nice variety of old analog and hybrid synths
Novation stuff out the wazoo, including an SL61mk2, SL37, ZeroSLmk2
http://www.shaneking.com
http://www.redgreenblue.bandcamp.com
 
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kerochan
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Re: about to order new Mac Mini or Trash Can Mac Pro ?

Tue Nov 06, 2018 10:15 am

redgreenblue wrote:
yes, there is a difference in function, for example a USB-C cable can't do Target Mode data transfers, plus the MacBook has a single USB-C connector that ISN'T a TB3 connector, which means a TB3 dock and/or TB display won't connect to it. We discovered that the hard way. (that is such a s#!+ computer) Plus I don't think that TB3 supports powering the computer which is why the power adapters that come with the Macs are USB-C. This isn't me being pedantic, the differences matter for some things.


Nightmare confusion! thanks for the info though! much appreciated
Apple Certified Pro - Logic Pro X 10.3.
Logic Pro X 10.3.2 El Capitan. 10.11.3
Macbook Pro mid 2015 15" 2.8 Quad core i7 16GBRAM,
Thunderbolt 27 display.
UA Apollo 8 QUAD audio interface and satellite TB Quad & Apollo Twin Duo.
Genelec 8040 monitors + Avantone Mixcube
Macbook Air (for traveling) i7 2 core, 8gb RAM.
 
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kerochan
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Re: about to order new Mac Mini or Trash Can Mac Pro ?

Tue Nov 06, 2018 10:17 am

triplets wrote:
kerochan wrote:
However there is no difference between USBC and TB3, its just a different name!


That only applies to Apple computers.

On PCs you can have a USB-C port, but no Thunderbolt 3 implementation. Most likely USB 3.1.


Cheers triplets, it really is confusing!
Apple Certified Pro - Logic Pro X 10.3.
Logic Pro X 10.3.2 El Capitan. 10.11.3
Macbook Pro mid 2015 15" 2.8 Quad core i7 16GBRAM,
Thunderbolt 27 display.
UA Apollo 8 QUAD audio interface and satellite TB Quad & Apollo Twin Duo.
Genelec 8040 monitors + Avantone Mixcube
Macbook Air (for traveling) i7 2 core, 8gb RAM.
 
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kerochan
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Re: about to order new Mac Mini or Trash Can Mac Pro ?

Tue Nov 06, 2018 10:20 am

redgreenblue wrote:
The benchmarks are looking really good for this machine. Time for some debt!


yep I saw that, good stuff.
Apple Certified Pro - Logic Pro X 10.3.
Logic Pro X 10.3.2 El Capitan. 10.11.3
Macbook Pro mid 2015 15" 2.8 Quad core i7 16GBRAM,
Thunderbolt 27 display.
UA Apollo 8 QUAD audio interface and satellite TB Quad & Apollo Twin Duo.
Genelec 8040 monitors + Avantone Mixcube
Macbook Air (for traveling) i7 2 core, 8gb RAM.
 
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David Nahmani
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Re: about to order new Mac Mini or Trash Can Mac Pro ?

Fri Nov 09, 2018 1:31 am

Here's a review of the new Mac mini: https://marco.org/2018/11/06/mac-mini-2018-review

David Nahmani
• My Logic Pro X 10.5 book (Apple Pro Training Series)
Contact me for Private Lessons
Logic Pro X 10.6.1
MacBook Air 1.3 GHz i5 — MacOS X 11.0.1 — 4 GB RAM
iMac 3.2 GHz Quad Core i5 — MacOS X 10.15.4 — 8 GB RAM