How do I use NRPN to Control Plugins?

I want to use [14-bit MIDI CC] messages from a [MIDI control surface of some kind] to do fine control of Logic plugin parameters.

 

Does anyone know HOW to do this? If you DO know HOW to do it, can you provide step-by-step directions?

 

What I DON'T want:

 

• A response of “who cares about stepping; no one notices”, etc. I NOTICE; I CARE.

• A link to another thread/website where the problem was never solved for the person who asked about 14-bit

• A technical discussion about what 14-bit MIDI is (I get it and I'm sick of being given tech BS instead of instructions)

• Anyone to tell me to "Google it" or "RTFM" (I've done this for YEARS)

• Simplistic "just activate MIDI learn and wiggle a control" (that does not work)

 

EDIT: I replaced reference to “NRPN” with “14-bit MIDI CC” to attempt to simplify the inquiry. I also removed “Korg Kontrol49”, because it seems that sending NRPN/RPN does not necessarily equate to sending 14-bit MIDI CC. I hope that clears things up somewhat.

Edited March 6, 2019 by dysamoria

Not sure if this helps...? NRPN support

I have read everything on this site that references NRPN and 14-bit values. There are no answers here. That's why I have made a new thread.

Alright, I wasn't sure you had.

I really do try to search for existing information first.

I hope there is an answer for this, I struggle to understand NRPN, and I've been doing midi since it was invented. Still don't get them.

I am responding from an iphone so can’t write a long explaination but nrpn is just cc messages 98 thru 101 (decimal) - you can create them in the event list. You need to look at your midi implementation reference (table) of your device and conform to sending those messages with data bytes as described. If the device is/are logic instruments - this info should be documented in the instrument manual - what are you trying to do? Not how but what is the final objective ?

I've used external synth/sequencer that transmit only NRPN by using MidiPipe to convert them into an easier range of Midi CC messages, and then cut the original Midi Port from Logic environment, of course.

 

I don't know if you're looking for a solution that involves additional software such as that though, and it was a pain to setup. It was for my old electribe, but it's possible i still have the configuration on a backup drive.

I think it might be possible to do this via the MIDI FX Scripter Plugin. It might be able to interpret NRPN's and output Logic Plugin Parameters. In the Effects manual / MIDI plug-ins / Scripter plug-in / Tutorial Script 15: Control Plug-ins there is an example. Extra programming would be required to interpret NRPN's.

 

Would this approach be of interest to you?

 

drb

Yes, I know what NRPN is. I don’t want another technical treatise.

 

Come on folks, my first message was pretty explicit.

 

I don’t want to manually type in values.

 

I don’t want to convert to regular CC (that defeats the whole point of using what are supposed to be 14-bit messages).

 

I don’t want to use some kind of third-party software.

 

I want someone to instruct me on how a MIDI controller that can send NRPNs [EDIT: which may or may not be actually 14-bit messages??] is actually USED for controlling plugins or native features in Logic (or on the Moog Model 15 iOS app, if you’ve got that, since it supports 14-bit MIDI and, like always, I can find no instructions on actually accomplishing that goal).

 

ES2 supposedly supports 14-bit MIDI.

 

Fromage claims to support NRPN for 14-bit control.

 

There are some others. I’d be happy just to get 14-bit interaction with one control in one plugin at this point.

 

I cannot find anyone actually USING 14-bit MIDI except accidentally (for example, Mackie MCU uses 14-bit MIDI for the volume sliders; no, you seemingly can’t use that feature to control anything else).

 

Every forum where I bring this up, I’m told to Google it. Duh. Been there, done that for years. Google sends me to my own forum inquiries and discussions where no one has ever answered the actual question of HOW TO DO IT. Everyone repeats the technical treatise on what 14-bit MIDI is and sends me links to technical dissertations about the same. NO ONE HAS EVER given clear step-by-step instructions on getting a MIDI controller to manipulate plugin parameters in a DAW via 14-bit NRPN messages. Apparently no one knows how. If that’s true, why do some plugins and programs support doing it?? Is this a feature implemented for absolutely no one to ever use?

 

You should see the MIDI 2.0 announcement thread I’ve been involved in on GearSlutz... sigh.

Edited March 6, 2019 by dysamoria

I looked at the manuals for ES2 and Moog Model 15 App. Both describe using 14 bit double precision MIDI CC's. This is *not* the same thing as NRPN. Both double precision MIDI CC's and NRPN do provide 14 bit precision. But, NRPN also provides a 14 bit NRPN number as opposed to the 7 bit MIDI CC number.

 

Using search on the three main Logic manuals I see nothing at all about NRPN's. I believe Logic simply is not programmed to recognize them. They could be passed through from a device that generates them to a 3rd party synth that recognizes them, or back to the same device that generated them.

 

So, noting the first sentence of your first post

 

"I want to use NRPN messages from a Korg Kontrol49 to do fine control of Logic plugin parameters."

 

I do not think this can be done without something "extra". (Assuming the Korg device is sending NRPN, not double precision MIDI CC.)

You are asking how do I start and control my transportation to get to L.A. without telling use are you driving a car, bicycle or airplane. You want us to tell you how to control it but we don't know what controls you have - You can't pedal an airplane and you can't control a plugin or synth if was not made to handle NRPN. You can't adjust the jet engine intake speed if the airplane has a prop and no jet engine. So you need to know what you want to do and if the device/plugin you want to control allows for it. And has for 14 bit - NRPN is a method to use two data bytes for manufacturing specific items.. Expression CC#11 can also be 14 bit but only used for expression - where NRPN can use 14 bit and can be implemented for anything - It could be the for the granularity of the screen color or anything for that matter. A lot of manufacturers utilize NPRN's for fine tuning due to the greater resolution that "can" be used or they may choose it to select one of over 16,000 tones - whatever.

 

So unless you confirm that the receiving device can in fact understand NRPN and was designed to do so with a purpose and what that purpose is.... No one here can answer you question...Because there isn't an answer...

 

 

Can Logic send NRPN (Yes) - Using the appropriate configured CC messages corresponding to NRPN functinoality.

Can you use it for finer control on devices/plugins - Yes but only if the developer has implemented a feature to utilize NRPN... In the case of Logic ( Apple supplied) Plugins -For NRPN I am not aware of any which do nor have I seen any documentation stating otherwise...

As far as 14 bit capability outside of using NRPN -The ES2 allows for it and I have used it for Expression ( much finer control) on one or two of the the plugins - although I don't recall which are supported....But there was only one two when I test this feature a few years ago.

In both of the above as for 3rd party plugins - you will have to check with them.

 

I am including a link to the ES2 for finer controller using 14-bit - but not NRPN.

https://support.apple.com/kb/PH27327?locale=en_US&viewlocale=en_US

 

So if your midi controller is only capable of sending NRPN and NOT CC data ( which I doubt is the case) then you are out of luck if you goal is to send NRPN information to a Logic plugin.

 

So your question should be more like this if you want others to understand what you are asking....

1/ How do I obtain higher resolution in controlling an ES2

2/ can a logic plugin understand NRPN

3/ Can the ES1 accept 14-bit

 

These all have different answers and you are asking one general question similar to " Do you walk to school or carry your lunch "

Thank you for your responses. I have been starting to wonder if NRPN/RPN and 14-bit were even necessarily the same concept. Just because NRPN/RPNs can be 14-bit messages doesn’t mean they are ALWAYS 14-bit. Are NRPN/RPN messages ALWAYS 14-bit? If yes, then I see why so many people are conflating them. I have previously just been saying “14-bit”. This thread was the first time I said “NRPN”. Just assume that any time I’ve said NRPN in the past, what I really mean is ANY kind of 14-bit MIDI CC. I don’t care what specific controller numbers are used. I just want to use 14-bit resolution to control something. So far, NRPN has been explicitly stated only by Fromage’s documentation.

 

The support.apple.com KB article you linked does not explain anything about USING 14-bit CC. I’ve read it repeatedly (and it has been thrown at me repeatedly, as if it were some kind of solution). Since people keep tossing it at me, I’m starting to wonder if anyone has actually read it (no offense intended to anyone here; I’m just sick of non-solutions being thrown at me). The article basically says (AGAIN) that 14-bit CC exists and that the missing controller sources/targets in ES2’s controller lists are missing because those numbers are reserved for 14-bit control (and it doesn’t even say THAT in clear language either). It is the ONLY Logic documentation that even seems to mention 14-bit MIDI CC.

 

So let’s change my question:

 

I want to control parameters in Logic with higher resolution than 7-bit, to cut down on the steppiness of control changes. I do NOT want to do this with an on-screen control, such as can be assembled in the Logic Environment. I want to use a hardware MIDI control surface, preferably a knob.

 

So the inquiry becomes:

 

• How do I know if a MIDI controller even sends 14-bit values? (Since the presence of NRPN/RPN does not mean 14-bit)

 

• How do I send 14-bit values from said MIDI controller, and get Logic (or Fromage inside Logic, or Moog Model 15 on iPad) to respond to them? It might be that I simply do not have the ability to SEND 14-bit MIDI controller messages, which is why Model 15, Fromage, and Logic’s ES2 aren’t responding as desired.

 

Every time I ask people what MIDI controller hardware sends 14-bit MIDI, someone comes along and explains what 14-bit MIDI is. I cannot stress enough how unhelpful this is. Then someone else mentions three or four products that use 14-bit CC to do things like pitch wheel and volume (on Mackie MCU), none of which helps me move a control on a plugin, in 14-bit resolution, from any hardware MIDI controller. They eventually conflate 14-bit with NRPN/RPN, which is why I did so here in this thread myself. As I said: Fromage explicitly states using NRPN for control. I assume they did this because they want 14-bit resolution available for the filter cutoff frequency control.

 

In weeks of endless conversation about this subject, not ONCE has anyone offered the equivalent of:

 

“Here are the steps to get your software to respond to 14-bit MIDI, from a hardware controller that supports it; and here are the hardware devices that can be configured to send 14-bit MIDI... and here are the instructions on doing that”.

 

I still don’t know why this is so difficult a discussion to even have. The only answer I can come up with is that no one else knows either. You stated that you’ve used 14-bit MIDI for expression in ES2... okay, how?

 

The only actual HOW TO examples I’ve seen was someone making a slider in Logic’s Environment that sends higher resolution messages to other parts of Logic, and NOT someone using a hardware MIDI controller to send 14-bit MIDI (with the exception being a video showing the maker of iVCS3 on iPad using a modified BCR2000 to send 14-bit MIDI CC to iVCS3, neither of which are things I own).

I wouldn't worry too much about stepping, honestly nobody hears it but you. If there is a part that you simply can't live with it you can draw the automation in.

I would say that there are not many (if at all) hardware controllers out there (excluding decent mixer faders which are an entirely different price and performance class than your average 0,50 cent mini-knob in a keyboard which costs 99 Euros) which can deliver 14-bit messages, because it actually is hard.

 

a) there is no way that a knob under, say, 25.- is able to correctly line up all 16000 or so discrete steps on its min-max travel of 3-4cm.

b) assuming it can, the travel from 14056 to 14057 is so miniscule that the bass player tapping his foot might cause it to change. This x 8 or 16 or how many encoders you're looking at will result in a constant flow of garbage data, flooding your MIDI in port.

c) if the encoder stands on the brink between two values, even the slightest ripple of mains hum from the power adapter will cause it to jump between both values 50 times per second. Again, multiply this data flow by 16 for real world numbers.

 

So it's not just a flick of a switch from 7 to 14 bit resolution. With all that in mind, there is no compelling reason for a manufacturer to build expensive 14bit AD-converters into the box when a cheap 7bit converter wouldn't perform worse. This is the reason why there are no cheap and thus not many 14bit knob boxes out there (if at all).

 

TL;DR: There's no point in getting bitchy. It's not that we refuse to tell you. It's because no one is doing it. You're the pioneer. Make it work, then tell us.

I hope there is an answer for this, I struggle to understand NRPN, and I've been doing midi since it was invented. Still don't get them.

 

The MIDI spec, for all the good it has done, is lousy. There, I’ve said it.

 

With which part of the whole NRPN thing are you having difficulty? The math of MSB and LSB? That’s the only part anyone seems to talk about when I bring up 14-bit CC messages. I can’t even tell if the math actually matters to end users, or if it just matters to developers (nor can I determine why some developers include 14-bit controller conversion charts in their documentation; where is that info supposed to be used?).

 

Then again, I can’t even tell if there ARE “end users” of 14-bit MIDI CC messages. If we cannot map a 14-bit controller the same way we map any other CC to control things, then what the hell is the point in having it? Is it ONLY implemented for hardware synths and never ever ever meant for users to use for controlling things of their own choosing? If so, why does, for example, Fromage indicate that it uses NRPN 0 for filter cutoff? How does one actually send the appropriate message to the plugin for this?

 

From what I can tell, 14-bit MIDI is almost never implemented and is at mythical status. Just trying to converse about it proves this point because the conversation is the SAME EVERYWHERE. The same unhelpful points keep getting rehashed, and the same assumptions keep getting inappropriately promoted (like me calling it NRPN, instead of just saying 14-bit MIDI; but then I would have gotten a similarly unhelpful dissertation about what 14-bit MIDI is, with no instruction on actually taking advantage of the feature). This is why my posting is a bit pissy.

 

Basically, when I say 14-bit MIDI is a virtual myth, someone will come along to defend MIDI and say “Nuh uh! 14-bit is used on the sliders of my Mackie Control for volume!!” Ask that same guy how this helps me control a filter cutoff knob in a plugin and he’s mysteriously silent.

I wouldn't worry too much about stepping, honestly nobody hears it but you. If there is a part that you simply can't live with it you can draw the automation in.

 

This isn’t what I’m asking for.

I would say that there are not many (if at all) hardware controllers out there (excluding decent mixer faders which are an entirely different price and performance class than your average 0,50 cent mini-knob in a keyboard which costs 99 Euros) which can deliver 14-bit messages, because it actually is hard.

 

a) there is no way that a knob under, say, 25.- is able to correctly line up all 16000 or so discrete steps on its min-max travel of 3-4cm.

b) assuming it can, the travel from 14056 to 14057 is so miniscule that the bass player tapping his foot might cause it to change. This x 8 or 16 or how many encoders you're looking at will result in a constant flow of garbage data, flooding your MIDI in port.

c) if the encoder stands on the brink between two values, even the slightest ripple of mains hum from the power adapter will cause it to jump between both values 50 times per second. Again, multiply this data flow by 16 for real world numbers.

 

So it's not just a flick of a switch from 7 to 14 bit resolution. With all that in mind, there is no compelling reason for a manufacturer to build expensive 14bit AD-converters into the box when a cheap 7bit converter wouldn't perform worse. This is the reason why there are no cheap and thus not many 14bit knob boxes out there (if at all).

 

Why does it have to be all or nothing? What would it cost to provide a generic MIDI controller with pots that are scanned frequently enough to provide at least 1024 steps? Obviously some hardware is made to do this or better: DSI, several Moog hardware synths, and the Alesis Fusion. All are digitally controlled analog, and all are making efforts to provide better than 7-bit resolution between their front panel controls and the synth engine. A generic MIDI controller need not be nearly as expensive as any of those.

 

TL;DR: There's no point in getting bitchy.

 

A point? No. It’s just expression of frustration. Is there a cause and a reason for said frustration? Yes! I admit it’s somewhat misdirected here (but not entirely; see the “who cares” response), because the people here aren’t the same ones I’ve dealt with in other forums. It’s just that, over years of time investigating this, all I’ve gotten is useless info and argument.

 

It's not that we refuse to tell you. It's because no one is doing it. You're the pioneer. Make it work, then tell us.

 

See, that’s a totally fair response. No one is doing it. That’s an admission that is quite valuable, really, but so few people are willing to make it. So, thank you!

 

The next question then would be “why is 14-bit MIDI CC supported by some software products, if no one is using it?” Examples already given are Fromage, Model 15, ES2... Did the developers of those products not test that function after they included it? (Maybe I need to try to contact Ohm Force and ask them to explain how 14-bit MIDI can be demonstrated in Fromage; I’ve asked over at the Moog forum, but the answers haven’t been forthcoming there either).

 

Then comes the question:

 

“How do we attempt to do it?” I have a Korg Kontrol49 that sends NRPN/RPN messages. Can I use that to send 14-bit CC to something? I’ve set the MSB and LSB as per Moog Model 15’s chart of used 14-bit controllers and it provides me with the same 7-bit resolution (or a broken behavior that is clearly the result of the MSB and then the LSB each being confused as the actual message). Is the Korg Kontrol49 not meant to send 14-bit CC? If so, why can I configure it to send NRPN/RPN from the front panel? What purpose is that feature? Korg’s own Wavestation template sends it from the Kontrol49, but only for volume controls.

 

If no one else thinks it’s worth doing, because “no one notices stepping”, well then, no one is going to help me figure it out. Then the other people like me never get any answers either. It’s not that NO ONE wants this. People do. Otherwise, why would the MIDI 2.0 specification have higher resolution? I’ve seen other people ask about this, and they’ve just stopped asking and given up, rather than take to task the people who give out unhelpful commentary. If I don’t make noise and rattle the cage, it seems almost no one else is going to.

From what I can tell, 14-bit MIDI is almost never implemented and is at mythical status. Just trying to converse about it proves this point because the conversation is the SAME EVERYWHERE.

Do you mean generally, or in a Logic environment?

 

I use my BCR2000 with Studio One and it's set to 14 bit resolution and controls plugins great. Never thought it was a grand mystery really.

 

I'm sure i've left the hardware on 14 bit template and mapped to Logic too, maybe i should try again?!

I have a Korg Kontrol49 that sends NRPN/RPN messages. Can I use that to send 14-bit CC to something?

It is yet to determine whether that actually are controls with a resolution of 14bit or if only their address is coded in two bytes. You mentioned the confusion between terms earlier:

 

NRPN / RPN first and foremost means that the *number* or address of the controller is coded in 14 bit, thus eliminating the limitation to only 127 different MDI controllers. It *may* also mean that those controllers have a resolution of 14bit for their values, but that's not a given, and manuals are suspiciously vague about this. Something like RPN Pitch Bend Range clearly does not require 14bit resolution, 6 bits would be sufficient to cover the usual -24 / +24 range, however, the address is obviously defined by two bytes.

OK,

 

Looking at the page for ES2 referenced above and the manual included with the Moog Model 15 app, I have set up both to use the big "FIXED CONTROL VOLTAGE" knob on the 904A Filter as a double precision 14 bit controller (not 14 bit pitch bend, not 14 bit NRPN, not 14 bit RPN) for the filter cutoff on ES2. All of the steps to be performed at the ES2 are in fact in the page referenced above. All of the steps to be performed at the Model 15 app are in its manual or prompts.

 

I really did not hear stepping with 7 bits, but I recorded a bit and checked the Logic event list and saw that the expected MIDI messages were recorded.

 

Have you actually read these documents and tried to follow them?

 

drb

Wow, you are quite the charmer, I can see why we are all bending over backwards to figure out your problem for you.

 

This is a friendly helpful board, or usually is.

If there was a like button i would've pressed it ^^^^

Resurrecting this for a final point I found while looking through threads referenced in this one and further.

 

In a KVR thread where the OP of this one is using the forum name Jace-Beos, the OP of this one mentions having problems especially with "filter sweeps at high resonance".

A few posts later someone with the forum (KVR) name JCJR made an interesting post especially the last three paragraphs.

 

Link - https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=7256262#p7256262

 

In my words, he suggested the non-smooth effect had nothing to do with MIDI at all. It was the result of a high resonance filter picking out one harmonic at a time from a pitched tone.

 

This sounded very plausible to me. I tried it with a Moog Mother-32, not using MIDI, head phones plugged directly into the Mother-32. Got exactly that result with pure analog.

 

I wonder how many low resolution MIDI bashers have been fooled by this.

 

Sadly, no one (at least for a few pages, I did not read the whole thread) reacted to his post.

 

I like MIDI. Including 7 bit. I post this as something for anyone thinking that they absolutely have to have high res MIDI to think about.

 

drb

Resurrecting this for a final point I found while looking through threads referenced in this one and further.

 

In a KVR thread where the OP of this one is using the forum name Jace-Beos, the OP of this one mentions having problems especially with "filter sweeps at high resonance".

A few posts later someone with the forum (KVR) name JCJR made an interesting post especially the last three paragraphs.

 

Link - https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=7256262#p7256262

 

In my words, he suggested the non-smooth effect had nothing to do with MIDI at all. It was the result of a high resonance filter picking out one harmonic at a time from a pitched tone.

 

This sounded very plausible to me. I tried it with a Moog Mother-32, not using MIDI, head phones plugged directly into the Mother-32. Got exactly that result with pure analog.

 

I wonder how many low resolution MIDI bashers have been fooled by this.

 

Sadly, no one (at least for a few pages, I did not read the whole thread) reacted to his post.

 

I like MIDI. Including 7 bit. I post this as something for anyone thinking that they absolutely have to have high res MIDI to think about.

 

drb

 

I noticed the harmonics issue. I'm not talking about that either.

 

But let's by all means keep bashing me as ignorant, doing something wrong, etc. Thanks everyone.

OK,

 

Looking at the page for ES2 referenced above and the manual included with the Moog Model 15 app, I have set up both to use the big "FIXED CONTROL VOLTAGE" knob on the 904A Filter as a double precision 14 bit controller (not 14 bit pitch bend, not 14 bit NRPN, not 14 bit RPN) for the filter cutoff on ES2. All of the steps to be performed at the ES2 are in fact in the page referenced above. All of the steps to be performed at the Model 15 app are in its manual or prompts.

 

I really did not hear stepping with 7 bits, but I recorded a bit and checked the Logic event list and saw that the expected MIDI messages were recorded.

 

Have you actually read these documents and tried to follow them?

 

drb

 

Of course I've actually read the documents and tried to follow them. That why I came here. Thanks for presuming I haven't done due diligence.

 

Can you elaborate on what YOU did with ES2 and Moog Model 15? What was the expected MIDI data that you found in the event list?

Wow, you are quite the charmer, I can see why we are all bending over backwards to figure out your problem for you.

 

This is a friendly helpful board, or usually is.

 

Yes, I've always found this board helpful. However, with THIS subject, I have found NO board helpful. Like I said, it seems impossible to even TALK about the subject because people make every wrong presumption possible. I just basically gave up. That's why I haven't commented on this thread in over 9 months. I just walked away because nothing seemed possible, even TALKING about the subject.

 

If I seemed to be irritated, well, consider that, by the time I came here to ask about it, I had already spent hours on this, at multiple forums, and multiple people, and not once has anyone ever made any clear statement on HOW this works. It's been CONSTANT links to every useless bit of info I've ALREADY seen, vague commentary that amounts to memes but not actual experience, and so on. It's been very similar to trying to get help on obscure Windows tech issues, except no one has yet suggested to me to reinstall the OS to fix anything.

 

But let's not leave any room for human emotion here. Obviously I must simply be a lazy and ignorant jerk who doesn't read manuals or try things for himself, expecting everyone to do things for me, etc etc, whatever endless blame the frustrated user memes we got...

Been a while. I will try to duplicate what I did with ES2 and Model 15 tomorrow. In the mean time could you try to ask some more specific questions, since you have looked at the documents. I do not know what does or does not make sense to you. No one is born knowing this stuff.

 

drb

Here is a somewhat detailed list of instructions for sending 14 bit MIDI control messages from the Moog Model 15 App on an iPad to ES2 in Logic.

 

Hope this helps.

 

How to tell the Model 15 App to send 14 bit MIDI when moving a knob.

 

0) Ensure that you can send any MIDI from the MODEL 15 App to Logic.

I have no idea what your hardware/software setup is, so I cannot

tell you anything here.

 

1) Choose a knob (for example the "FIXED CONTROL VOLTAGE" knob on the

"904A VOLTAGE CONTROLLED LOW PASS FILTER").

 

2) Tap the "SETTINGS" button near the top right of the Model 15 display.

 

3) Tap "MIDI" on the left of the display.

 

4) Ensure that "SEND KNOBS/SWITCHES" is on (background is white).

 

5) Tap "MAP CCs"

 

6) Ensure that the knob is step 1) is visible on the display.

It should have a circle around it. What else (a number or "--")

is displayed depends on your configuration -- which I do not know.

 

7) Double tap the knob. A panel "MIDI CC Assignment" should appear.

 

8) Type the number "16" in.

 

9) Below the number, there are four commands. Make sure the one after "Clear"

says "Make 14-bit" (tap it if it does not). This toggles between 7 and 14

bit tranmission. If it say "Make 14-bit", then it is currently set to 7 bit

and vice versa. In effect, make 7 bit for now so we can see what that

looks like in Logic to compare with what happens when changed to 14 bit.

 

10) Tap "Set" to finish that dialog and save.

 

11) Tap the "X" near the top left to exit "MIDI MAPPING".

 

12) Create a new logic project with a single software instrument track.

 

13) Load ES2 as the instrument, use the default sound for simplicity.

 

14) Open the Event Editor

 

15) Start recording, move the knob on the Model 15. You should see many

events - Status=Control, Num=16, different values.

 

16) The fact that all of the events have the same Status/Num indicates

that the Model 15 is sending single precision (7 bit) MIDI CC messages.

 

17) Go backinto settings/midi/mapp ccs on the Model 15.

 

18) Double tap the same knob as before, then tap "Make 14 bit".

The dialog goes away and the knob now has 14-BIT displayed.

 

19) Click the "X" to get out of midi mapping.

 

20) Delete the current Logic recording and start a new one. Move the knob.

Stop the recording.

 

21) This time you should see alternating CC messages with num-16 and num-48.

This is the 14 bit transmission from the Model 15. To get 14 bits,

2 CC messages are sent. (RPN or NRPN would be 4 CC messages each)

 

22) Note we haven't actually done anything with the ES2 yet.

 

23) Click the MIDI button near the lower left of the ES2 panel.

 

24) Click the arrow beside Ctrl C and select 16 GP1.

 

25) Go to the 2nd router which should be unused at this point.

Select Cutoff 1 as the target, Ctrl C as the source.

 

26) Move the green arrow to the top (how much modulation).

 

27) Move the cutoff know on filter 1 to the minimum.

 

28) Now, hold a note and move the Model 15 knob.

You should be able to hear the effect.

 

29) Can you hear a difference between 7 bit control and 14 bit?

This is actually difficult. You will have to move the knob slowly

(look up how to use two fingers on the Model 15 to help with this).

And, you will have to experiment with patch settings on the ES2 that

make a difference audible. Most will not. This is why 14 MIDI is

not commonly used.

 

 

I have now given a detailed answer. If you have further questions (that's OK) please make them detailed questions.

 

drb

Been a while. I will try to duplicate what I did with ES2 and Model 15 tomorrow. In the mean time could you try to ask some more specific questions, since you have looked at the documents. I do not know what does or does not make sense to you. No one is born knowing this stuff.

 

drb

 

Thanks. I absolutely agree. I’m in the middle of massive file management tasks (can’t afford new hard drives, so I’m archiving Windows stuff to DVDs so I can repurpose Windows drives), so I’ll need to revisit this topic again at a later time.