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Logic devs: you have a safety problem


braindongle

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Twice this evening, during playback in a project with moderate system resource utilization (see image), Logic (10.4.8 on a 2018 MBP) output garbled noise at AN INSANELY LOUD +41 DB. The first screen capture of the main window shows this having happened at around 33 seconds. The second screen capture shows that during while repeating playback (both from the beginning) it did not happen.

 

Any thoughts, community? Bad acting third-party plugins is no answer. This should simply be impossible. Tympanic membranes and speakers will be destroyed.

 

540195232_ScreenShot2020-01-03at6_29_59PM.thumb.png.fe9f58b0809251bce5918d57537c275f.png

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I have an RME fireface - never happened for me. I think I would suspect your interface box, or it's connection rather than Logic, otherwise a lot more people would have it too.

 

I do notice if I have too many cpu hungary plug-ins going, I will get a 'thump noise' and then no audio. But the thump is about the same volume as the music. As soon as I shut off some AU's or make the buffer larger, the problem goes away. (different problem than yours I suspect)

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some thoughts:

put a limiter on your main out. reboot. and does this happen in all projects, or just one? and in the same place?

 

i'd think it was a 3rd-party plugin 'signalling' demo use, but..? and is it coming from any one track?

 

this is (obviously) not a problem we're all having, so... something particular to that project, or your setup. try some of the above, try playing thru your mac speakers (without your audio interface connected. good luck with this!

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I have an RME fireface - never happened for me. I think I would suspect your interface box, or it's connection rather than Logic, otherwise a lot more people would have it too.

 

I do notice if I have too many cpu hungary plug-ins going, I will get a 'thump noise' and then no audio. But the thump is about the same volume as the music. As soon as I shut off some AU's or make the buffer larger, the problem goes away. (different problem than yours I suspect)

 

 

Is your interface usb?

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Bad acting third-party plugins is no answer. This should simply be impossible. Tympanic membranes and speakers will be destroyed.

 

 

actually that is the answer.

Aside from putting a limiter on the master output, there's not much they can do.

 

I believe that's bullshit. Since my noise blasts went away when I changed interfaces it is obviously fixable. And I've got tons of third party plugins.

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I think it can and should be prevented. A built in ice9. Whether it’s caused by a plugin or logic itself is anyone’s guess but I’m far more suspicious of it being logic itself or perhaps the audio driver. I had it happen to me a few times using hardly any plugins and built in Mac pro audio. Ice9 helps a lot. I will share it here later cause I know it’s hard to find
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actually that is the answer.

Aside from putting a limiter on the master output, there's not much they can do.

 

I believe that's bullshit. Since my noise blasts went away when I changed interfaces it is obviously fixable. And I've got tons of third party plugins.

 

i've been using RME for years, different kinds and i don't have random bursts out of the blue.

i've had random bursts with dodgy plugins - early version of serum i.e.

 

@dewdman: what's ice9 ?

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For me it happened with VePro running. And I never had it either until just in the past months something changed somewhere, either in LPX or VePro, from my perspective, but I'm more suspicious that it's LPX.

 

Ice9 is a freebie plugin that someone made which is a very simple lightweight brick wall limiter you can put on your master bus. The person that made it is no longer in business and there is no official place to download it anymore. A few months back I searched all over for it and someone sent it to me privately from a forum..

 

ice9.jpg.c1952394f8fc2301141720c54ade4ef9.jpg

Ice9_1.1.0_OSX_Installer.zip

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Ploki, if you're referring to Ice9, then welcome to the secret club. I've had software and wetwear induced "blasts" that have nearly blinded me...not any more, Ice9! And since it's on the 2bus @-1, it lets me know if I'm banging on heaven's door when I'm deep in the mix somewhere else...nice actually...hth.../s~
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yea I'd love to know too. Unfortunately it is inexplicable.

 

not finding the problem is not the same as a problem being inexplicable. just saying... something causes these things to happen, and seems worth exploring. but, no offense, maybe it's deeply hidden. anyway, we all live with workarounds, so good when you find one that works for you.

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Not true mate, it has been all over numerous forums in recent months. And here it is now again. Ice9 is a good remedy for those suffering from this "bug" wherever its coming from. i spent a bunch of hours a few months ago trying to figure it out and could not. I can't even find a way to consistently replicate it. It happens randomly and I nearly had a heart attack every time it did happen. When you actually know WTF you are talking about on this topic maybe can come advise us Fisherking.

 

I feel this started happening within the past few months...LPX underwent a couple big updates during the same time frame...10.4.5 as we now know, had a lot of bugs, many of which have been fixed...some not. There is no possible way for us to figure out now what is causing this, but it *IS* happening...and its not just me.

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ok, not just you, but still... what percentage of logic users? 1%? more? less? no one i work with has the issue. and i've not seen it, up thru the current 10.4.8.

 

anyway, if it were just a logic issue, wouldn't we all see it? if it were me, i'd reach out on forums where it's being discussed, and see what you have in common; the mac itself, certain 3rd-party plugins, or... your interface.

 

anyway... whatever works. again, we all turn to workarounds when we need them.

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It could also be a core audio issue somehow, who knows, but its beyond our ability to determine as far as I can see right now. I literally almost had a heart attack from the noise burst and I'm thankful my monitors do not appear to be destroyed, but I personally cannot afford to not have ice9 on the master bus at this point. The system, whether its LPX, or core audio, or some plugin(which is unlikely because as I said it has been happening even with very simple projects and different people have been reporting different use cases with the same problem), its anyone's guess what is causing it, but yes.....I'm glad that a "work around" is available with ice9. I have no idea how and when I will be able to feel safe about it actually, since we don't know what's causing it, no word from Apple or anybody else about identifying it or fixing it.
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not stupid, dewdman42, since it proves my point: a handful of people on internet forums report this (think of all the logic users & pros who don't spend time on forums). so probably not an apple issue.

 

either way, if i were experiencing this, i'd still look for common denominators, and test everything, until i found the culpit. anyway, you have way to deal with it, and that matters most.

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I hope you can experience the problem and then solve it for all of us, you will be my hero!

 

right, but i am not experiencing it. none of my collabs have reported it. and there's a whole community of logic users (on this forum, and in the 'real' world) who don't experience it.

 

better to deal with the issues you have, than to wait for it to crop up for someone like me (who will, for better or worse, move heaven and earth to solve a problem... or... find a workaround). good luck!

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great for you! why are you wasting time polluting this thread with your inexperience in this area?

 

The issue I have here, is bugs in either LPX or CoreAudio. Sorry if this offends you, your comments here are helpful to no one. Just because you haven't experienced the noise blast of death yet, or you haven't read about it from other people, does not mean it isn't happening. It is actually happening, to mself and others, and there was a surge of postings on various different internet forums in the past few months related to this. This kind of problem could easily be related to a particular version of OSX or any number or things...very hard to diagnose and even harder to do anything about it...and trust me...if it does happen to you you will be wishing you had put ice9 on your master bus.

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I had this happen, I can't remember which version of Logic or which plugin I was using at the time though I think it was probably 6 months or so ago and I usually have the latest version of Logic installed. I also had my headphones on at the time and nearly fell off my chair.

 

Since then I always have a limiter on the master bus.

 

Thanks for ice9 Dewdman42, I had looked for it at the time but came up empty.

 

Also I notice Reaper has an option built into it whereby it will auto mute any track when it reaches a user defined db, I think it defaults to something like 18db or around there.

 

Thanks,

 

Andrew.

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Just a data point, I've had this happen. Extremely rarely, maybe once or twice a year, not enough to start looking for details or report it, feels like a freak accident, but, it happens, and more than once, I recognize this.

 

Last was maybe half a year ago. When it happens its a super cruel deafening blast of übermax white noise, out of nowhere, happened twice on headpones while working with small details on low levels, that was a massive shock, I can still recall the shock. Not that it isn't gruesome in the room too. Indeed would be great for this never ever to happen.

 

FWIW, I'm also working on RME hardware, multiple models of Firefaces or Babyfaces over the years. No idea if RME is the culprit, I find that hard to believe, but also find it hard to believe it could be Logic, but that's the data... I tend to use mostly NI Kontakt, u-he plugins and then internal plugins, with a lot of intricate flex audio region editing. Never happened in Ableton Live or other audio programs I'm regularly using, but I'm working in LPX probably 80% of the time, and the other audio apps a distributed maybe 3-4% each, so statistically if it happens, it would most likely happen "while working in LPX".

 

PS. Using a more descriptive topic subject title would probably get more relevant replies and we could possibly see a pattern between everyone who experinces this? At first I thought this was a topic on app security. Only when it got multiple replies I wondered what that could be.

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