Potential Logic user

Hello

I'm deciding what recording program to get and would like to ask you guys for advice. I have an MPC and probably will get another rackmount sampler to go with it. I'm not sure if I will record the tracks as audio or if I should sync the MPC and the recording program together by MIDI. I like using the pads on MPC. At the same time I know that people who use hardware samplers sometimes record only a few bars of a beat and finish composing the song in the software.

Two programs that have been suggested to me were Logic and Live. I assume that Logic is capable of more things and the learning curve would be pretty steep.

For what I want to do (recording my samplers, editing the samples, applying different effects, etc), do you think that Logic would be a good choice?

Also, would a PowerBook be sufficient to run Logic or is desktop a must? G4 or G5? Would I limit myself with a laptop? I guess I could only use Firewire interfaces and not PCI cards with standalone A/D converters.

I know it's a lot of questions, but any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you.

I use a laptop and have had no problems so far. At home I plug it in to my 20" display and it works like a dream.

In terms of a sequencer, that depends on your style of working. I know lots of MPC converts who are totally happy with Protools. I have been a Logic user for the past six months and yes, the learning curve IS steep! I am still uncovering all sorts of hidden features and if you are a looking to start making music right out of the box, be prepared for many sleepless nights, poking around with the Environment and other features that seem highly ilLogical to me.

Live is a LOT of fun to compose with...and the audio warping features are killer. Only problem I have with this program is the implementation of virtual instruments. I use lots of softsynths and Live doesnt handle them as snappily as Logic. It also is lacking many of the tools that come standard in Logic. It's a great tool to have, but ultimately limiting.

I recently played around with a copy of Cubase SX 3 and was pleasantly surprised by how intuitive, fast and easy-to use this program is. It also sounds AWESOME! If I had not invested so much in Logic I would probably choose Cubase....but like I said...a sequencer is a highly personalized thing and what works for one guy may be a total nightmare for another.

Best advice is to demo this software and see which one fits your workflow. Currently you can download Live for tryout. Right now you only get Cubase demo from retail shop (no download) and I am not sure but it seems Logic doesnt offer demos at all. ( a serious oversight in my opinion) I think Apple stores have Logic workshops every once in a while...check your local shop and schedule for details.

Logic Pro, Cubase (better on the PC than Mac) and Digital Performer are all terrific apps with various pros and cons. All are dealing with midi, audio, loops, and everything so all have a learning curve. Think of it as learning a musical instrument. Is it rally much easier to learn any to play really well than any other?

Logic is the most complete package, the only one IMHO that if you owned no other plug-ins would be the most ready to make good music with. But there are certainly things in Cubase and DP that I wish Logic had or emulated. And Cubase and DP users if they are honest would no doubt say the same thing about Logic.

You reaally can 't gpo wronmg with any of them. Live 5 is a totally different beast than these 3 with its own strengths and weaknesses. It would not be good for a traditional composer like me but for a rap/hip-hop guy it is viable and worth considering.

ProTools HD is terrific but PT LE is cpu inefficent and just has too many limitations to seriously consider as an alternative IMHO.

Thanks for your advice guys,

Ashermusic, could tell me, what are the major differences between Live 5 vs the other programs (Logic, Cubase, DP)?

I figured it's not as capable as the others, but I don't know the proper terminology and if you could tell me in a "newbie language", that would be great.

Thanks for your advice guys,

 

Ashermusic, could tell me, what are the major differences between Live 5 vs the other programs (Logic, Cubase, DP)?

 

I figured it's not as capable as the others, but I don't know the proper terminology and if you could tell me in a "newbie language", that would be great.

It is a totally different paradigm and too complex for me to get into here. Visit Ableton's website and you can learn as well as dowenload a demo version.

I don't have any audio interface and my powerbook is pretty "underpowered" for audio aplications, from what I've read, so I don't think it would make sense to download the demo.

I'll go to their website and check it out though. I'll see if I understand the tech jargon there...

Thanks.

What powerbook do you have?

Logic is the most cpu freindly Mac DAW, I've used it succesfully on a G3 iBook/700, and a G4/400.

Live doesn't contain any Alti-vect optimistion, so your milage will vary based on your hardware.

8)

My powerbook: 256MB, 550MHz G4, OSX 10.2.8

I'm not really computer savvy at this point, but I'd like to learn.

I'm not sure what that thing you said about Live means

It just means Live doesn't take advantage of everything the processor has to offer as it comes to speed/efficiency and is therefore a bit slower.

Why? becouse it's not an easy thing to do... Hence my thoughts on why the move to Intel is good for Apple. Consider this thread hijacked.

I looked at different computers at apple.com

The powerbooks are in $1500-2500 range and the iMac G5's go for $1300-1700.

I think I'd prefer to have a laptop, but would iMac G5 be much much better for Logic? I assume the powermac G5 would be the best, but I don't think I can afford one.

What would you guys say are the minimum requirements (processor, RAM and/or anything else) to run Logic smoothly?

That really depends on what you'd be doing with it. Personally I run it on my G4 867 PowerBook. For the most part it is fine but every once in a while I get to a point where I really need something more powerful. If you really want a smooth experience, a G5 would be a good way to go, although for future versions, I'm willing to bet that an Intel based Mac will be even a better way to go. Myself I'm going to wait for an Intel based one to be released before upgrading my hardware. Till then, Logic for the most part runs just fine.

Personally I rarely use any MIDI stuff, I mostly just record audio and clean it up. I'm not a fan of effects or anything of the like. My stuff is generally very mellow and very straight forward, kind of like Nick Drake, Duncan Sheik, some of Jeff Buckley's stuff... etc.

what are the major differences between Live 5 vs the other programs (Logic, Cubase, DP)?

Most programs use the classical "left to right" sequencer, where the line travels across the screen,triggering audio and MIDI data that you arrange to your liking. While it does include a standard sequencer mode, Live breaks new ground with its concept of "parts". You can build various stages of a song (verse, chorus, bridge, etc) and trigger any them with the click of your mouse. Even if you click on a part prematurely, Live will drop the transition in right on time. It is a blast for live performances or coming up with different arrangements on the fly. Live also has an impressive timewarp feature that will automatically adjust any loop you drop into it to the tempo of a song...very handy!

I have seen quite a few performers use Live for their gigs, but when they go home and make records, they use Logic, Cubase, PT etc..

What would you guys say are the minimum requirements (processor, RAM and/or anything else) to run Logic smoothly?

Processor:

Get the fastest one you can find. The more plugins and audio you load into your songs, the more CPU load you will have. Also keep in mind that Logic Pro is optimized for G5 processor and you will notice a significant speed bump on iMac. I settled on a powerbook because I spend a lot of time on the road. So far I have not been disappointed with the performance at all, but this is mainly because at 1.67MHz, my processor kicks serious ass! IMHO, dont settle for anything under 1GHz for production.

Memory:

OS X will use 512MB of your RAM without blinking. Logic will use all the memory you can throw at it. My machine came with 1 GB and it was enough for me to do some serious production. NOt too long ago, I found a great deal online for RAM and decided to upgrade my book to 2 GB. The difference is substantial! I can open way more plugins, effects and have more audio tracks loaded into my projects. OS X also runs more snappy and I get my other work done faster. This is a great time to upgrade your RAM because it is cheaper than ever! For Powerbooks, 1 GB will run you $167, for iMacs $130.

Here is the link... http://www.macgurus.com/productpages/ram/mgram.php

Minimum RAM for smooth Logic? At least 1 GB.

Thanks a lot guys. Your answers are really helpful.

The timewarp feature in Live .... is it something that is exclusive to Live or can I find a similar function in Logic?

The iMac G5 is a single processor vs the PowerMac G5 which is dual, right? You're saying that even with a single G5 processor, it is much faster than 1.67 MHz in a PowerBook. The portability is something that I'd like a lot, but I don't want to be kicking myself a few months later for not getting an iMac.

Is it a must to only have Logic installed on a computer or could I also use it for email and internet browsing?

I appreciate the link for the memory.

Is it a must to only have Logic installed on a computer or could I also use it for email and internet browsing?

Email clients and Internet Browsers won't be a problem. However, it's when you start adding printer drivers, digital camera drivers.. actually any drivers since they all want to talk to the kernel, so that might be a problem.

It's easy to have a couple of different starting drives, one with Logic + Internet only, the other with everything your home/office might possibly need.

Email clients and Internet Browsers won't be a problem. However, it's when you start adding printer drivers, digital camera drivers.. actually any drivers since they all want to talk to the kernel, so that might be a problem.

 

It's easy to have a couple of different starting drives, one with Logic + Internet only, the other with everything your home/office might possibly need.

Interesting. I am a part time designer and i have lots of other drivers and graphic software installed. Do you think it would be wise to create different User accounts on my OS (Graphics, Audio)? I am thinking that if I restart and login on an account which only has audio software installed, it may give me a speed boost. Haven't had any complaints so far, but wonder if I can eek a little more performance out of my machine with this technique. Hmm

Not more performance, only less conflicts. If you do not experience Kernel panics, then it will not help, and I don't recommended messing with it.

If it ain't broken, don't fix it!