Best Way to Commit Flex Time Audio?

Doing some flex audio on a track and I am not sure at the best way to commit this to the audio file.

 

(1) Bounce in Place the track?

 

(2) Consolidate/merge the region?

 

(3) Other that I don't know about - I haven't found a commit or flatten button anywhere and it's not really listed in the manual either.

 

Any opinions on this would be appreciated. I thought I had read somewhere in the forum at one time that Bounce in Place wasn't retaining all of the flextime edits, but I could be wrong.

 

Thanks.

This:

 

1) Select the region(s) in the arrange area.

2) 'Audio' --> 'Convert regions to new audio files'

 

Or does that not do the job for you?

 

Wilbert

No. This only creates an audio file identical to the source file and adds flex in the arrangement.

 

Bounce Regions In Place is the way to go.

 

Christian

Thanks Christian - I guess I am just looking for the best way to commit the flex audio.

 

- Bounce Regions in Place doesn't commit the flex edits as Christian says.

 

- Bounce "Track" in Place makes another track and mutes out the track leaving an extra track to hide that retains the original flex edits if you need to go back.

 

- Bounce "Region" in place basically does the same thing, but lets you select just the regions you want to replace. It also retains the edits on another track.

 

- If you "merge" the regions that are flexed, you don't get another track with the muted part, but it commits the flex audio, then re-analyzes the track again for flex audio with the newly committed edits.

 

I guess I was just wondering if there was any reason against merging regions versus bounce track or region in place and it looks like you can go either way depending on if you want that extra muted track with your original edits in place.

 

In protools, when you turn off elastic time for a track (ie. the logic equivalent is changing a track from polyphonic to "off") it will ask if you want to commit or abandon the elastic audio edits. I was just looking for some kind of the same commit button or menu choice.

 

Cubase has a flatten button.

 

Logic always gives you many ways to accomplish the same task.... Never ceases to amaze me..... Ha ha.

I use Merge. But first I option-drag the regions to a subtrack (New with same channel strip instrument) and then merge them. If I have only one region, I'll snip it somewhere first so that I can do the merge.

It's got me fooled, but I'm glad I chimed in, 'cause obviously I have to try out all these options myself to see what works for me. Sorry for any confusion/irritation I may have caused, and thanks for setting me straight and pointing out so many ways of doing this 'right'.

I seem to remember that most of those methods still leave the flex markers in place and don't commit the changes (I'll have to experiment). What I do, and I think I read it here somewhere, is use the glue tool. But, the audio has to be cut up and "changed" on the track somewhere, or, I have to record a tiny snippet of new audio at the end or top of the track to glue the flexed file to. Then it glues and prints everything in place. But, that's just the way I like to work coming from using DP forever and being able to print fx like this.

I don't get it? Why don't you bounce regions in place?

I don't get it? Why don't you bounce regions in place?

For me it's just a matter of not wanting "extra" tracks. I know I could delete the original flexed track, or keep it in case I think I might need it. But, sometimes I just want to fix something and leave everything where it is. That' just me though.

I don't get it? Why don't you bounce regions in place?

just looking for the best way to commit the flex audio... Logic always gives you many ways to accomplish the same task.... Never ceases to amaze me..... Ha ha.

Ok, I just did a search on "merging a flexed track", and found this thread... I have already, simply, merged a flexed track... now, after reading through this "thread", I'm wondering if I'm ok (in this instance), or should I go back to a previous "project backup" (before I merged), and bounce the track instead.

 

It sound ok (merged), but will a gain anything by going back and using a "bounce" approach Is that the best way. or is it just a personnel work flow thing 8)

Edited October 15, 2012 by rone2him

I don't get it? Why don't you bounce regions in place?

Ok, I just did a search on "merging a flexed track", and found this thread... I have already, simply, merged a flexed track... now, after reading through this "thread", I'm wondering if I'm ok (in this instance), or should I go back to a previous "project backup" (before I merged), and bounce the track instead.

 

It sound ok (merged), but will a gain anything by going back and using a "bounce" approach

 

IME, bounce in place doesn't always preserve the flex changes you've made, which is why I recommended earlier in this thread to glue the regions rather than using BIP.

So "camillo jr", you use to be "daveyboy"

...use the glue tool. But, the audio has to be cut up and "changed" on the track somewhere, or, I have to record a tiny snippet of new audio at the end or top of the track to glue the flexed file to. Then it glues and prints everything in place.

I have never used the "glue tool", will have to read up on it... in any case, the explanation quoted above seems convoluted and tangled... there has to be a simpler fool-proof way, as EricB wrote (can't believe BIP doesn't accurately bounce a "flexed" region, although I couldn't find any reference in "the Manual", specifying that it did also work on "flexed" regions)

 

I guess I'll just try some experiments (as I've salvaged the un-merged, flexed regions), and try to judge for myself

 

Damm... thought I was going to lay a Bass tract today... now I'm back to Sunday hehe

So "camillo jr", you use to be "daveyboy"

 

Go back two posts.....

Merging flexed regions

Ok, I tried both "Bounce Region in Place" & "Bounce Track in Place", and at least to my diminutive ears I'd peradventure to say both sounded at least as good, and perhaps even a little better then the merged tracks, that I compared (bearing in mind my diminutive ears)

 

At this time, I didn't venture to get any glue on my fingers, or for that matter, in my ears (as I do tend to stick them there often like 'foot in mouth' )... anyway, I thank all previous posters, as I do like learning and growing, and this is a good place to learn & grow; listening to the suggestions of others

 

In researching it all, I found a neato little tidbit on flexing (which will suit my work-flow well 8) ): Snapping Flex Markers to Transient Markers

 

Again Thanks All! Off to the Basses... I mean races

I use Merge. But first I option-drag the regions to a subtrack (New with same channel strip instrument) and then merge them. If I have only one region, I'll snip it somewhere first so that I can do the merge.

Brilliant and easy solution. This is working perfectly here. Thanks for the tip!

OK, merge=glue effectively, one is a process command, the other a tool that enables regions (allowing one to selectively merge regions, even when they are on different tracks, in the arrange area) to be merged, I thought they were totally different processes

 

Questions remain:

Would still like to hear a definitive answer to the "bounce in place doesn't always preserve the flex changes" issue... true or false?

 

And another question, still, on my mind... does merging or bouncing flexed regions reduce CPU processing power utilization?

does merging or bouncing flexed regions reduce CPU processing power utilization?

It reduces CPU and RAM use, and increases HD use.

Thanks David, a complete answer there, basically what I thought

 

Would still like to hear some definitive answer to the "bounce in place doesn't always preserve the flex changes" issue... true or false?

It WILL haunt me in my sleep hehe

Thanks David, a complete answer there, basically what I thought

 

Would still like to hear some definitive answer to the "bounce in place doesn't always preserve the flex changes" issue... true or false?

It WILL haunt me in my sleep hehe

I've personally never had that problem.

Not saying I don't believe those who have had the problem.

 

I just did a quick test.

 

I played up & down a C scale in quarter notes using an EXS24 piano and recorded a MIDI region.

 

Then, I quantized it to spot on quarter notes.

 

Then, I Bounced in Place and got an audio file.

 

Then, I enabled Flex and flexed "the living snot" out of the audio region. (Totally farked up the timing)

 

Then, I Bounced in Place that "Farked Flexed" region and got another audio file.

 

Then, I inserted a Gain Plug-in on the channel strip of the 2nd BIP "Farked Flexed" region and Phase Inverted the left and right sides.

 

With both the original Flexed region and the BIP of that region playing at unity gain, I got...the sound of silence.

 

So, at least in this quick test, Flex did survive BIP.

Edited October 18, 2012 by redlogic

I've personally never had that problem.

Not saying I don't believe those who have had the problem.

 

I just did a quick test.

 

I played up & down a C scale in quarter notes using an EXS24 piano and recorded a MIDI region.

 

Then, I quantized it to spot on quarter notes.

 

Then, I Bounced in Place and got an audio file.

 

Then, I enabled Flex and flexed "the living snot" out of the audio region. (Totally farked up the timing)

 

Then, I Bounced in Place that "Farked Flexed" region and got another audio file.

 

Then, I inserted a Gain Plug-in on the channel strip of the 2nd BIP "Farked Flexed" region and Phase Inverted the left and right sides.

 

With both the original Flexed region and the BIP of that region playing at unity gain, I got,,,the sound of silence.

 

So, at least in this quick test, Flex did survive BIP.

 

And this, people, is how proper testing is done. And described.

 

Nice one RL!

I would have gone more in depth...but, ski still has my slide rule.

+1

Thanks, distinctly outstanding work "redlogic"... I have heard people use this approach for other purposes, but it did not occur to me to use it, to do my own experiments... yes!

 

I will certainly use this technique, to empirically run some more checks myself, at least for the next several instances of my flexing tracks; reporting back if I get different results, then "redlogic" did

 

Sleep will not elude me!

 

Thanks again... for sharing the tools to enlightenment

You're welcome!

 

Happy experimenting and music making!

I've personally never had that problem.

Not saying I don't believe those who have had the problem.

 

I just did a quick test.

 

I played up & down a C scale in quarter notes using an EXS24 piano and recorded a MIDI region.

 

Then, I quantized it to spot on quarter notes.

 

Then, I Bounced in Place and got an audio file.

 

Then, I enabled Flex and flexed "the living snot" out of the audio region. (Totally farked up the timing)

 

Then, I Bounced in Place that "Farked Flexed" region and got another audio file.

 

Then, I inserted a Gain Plug-in on the channel strip of the 2nd BIP "Farked Flexed" region and Phase Inverted the left and right sides.

 

With both the original Flexed region and the BIP of that region playing at unity gain, I got,,,the sound of silence.

 

So, at least in this quick test, Flex did survive BIP.

 

And this, people, is how proper testing is done. And described.

 

Nice one RL!

 

+1 on that testing procedure!

 

All that being said, I HAVE had BIP ignore some of my flexings. My test was my ears, as in, "WTF, that doesn't sound right!!" So I tried gluing/merging and found that it did what I wanted without fail. Don't know why BIP doesn't always work for me. It did sometimes on most flexed files but was just flaky enough that for this purpose, I abandoned it as a method for rendering flexed files. And sometimes I'll do a regular bounce too. That works fine as well.

+1 on that testing procedure!

 

All that being said, I HAVE had BIP ignore some of my flexings. My test was my ears, as in, "WTF, that doesn't sound right!!" So I tried gluing/merging and found that it did what I wanted without fail. Don't know why BIP doesn't always work for me. It did sometimes on most flexed files but was just flaky enough that for this purpose, I abandoned it as a method for rendering flexed files. And sometimes I'll do a regular bounce too. That works fine as well.

I wonder if tempo changes have anything to do with it?

My test above was at a constant tempo.

I've had some strange Flex behavior when there were tempo changes involved.

I wasn't Bouncing in Place though.

Thanks all for this long discussion.

I can confirm that "Bounce Regions in Place" (ctrl+b) does commit the flex changes, as Christian said (using logic pro 10.5),

and you probably want to check the "Bypass Effect Plug-Ins" checkbox before doing so, so that your plugins are copied to the new track.

And then delete your flexed track to clean your project up.