How do you Start a Song??

i hear songs playing in my head that i want to produce. I am very new at this so i have relied on only one tactic so far....I record a track playing the melody on the piano. The left hand will also record a simple rhythm, quite often 4-4 time.

I dont use drum tracks, just rely on the rhythm created by the piano track.

However, i am kind of bogged down when I try to strategize adding vocals and strings, etc. Would anybody like to share with me their way to "crack' a song and get it started?

Thank You.

Every song is different, unfortunately.

Yeah. I wish all songs were the same.

Christian

You can try to adapt vocals to the melody. You're going to immediately encounter the balancing act all songwriters encounter where you want to keep the lyrics you like and the melody you like, but one (or both) will have to give a little.

One of the coolest things about being a songwriter today is that you can take that melody you recorded and literally just cycle through different types of instruments using just the stock logic virtual instruments, and see how it sounds best.

And then of course there's a million other ways to take a simple idea and go crazy with it (literally and figuratively).

How do you Start a Song??.

I usually start like this:

... A one and a two...

I usually start like this:

 

... A one and a two...

That totally made my morning.

Every song is different, unfortunately.

Yeah. I wish all songs were the same.

 

Christian

you (and Shivermetimbers for that matter) crack me up (pretty much everytime too)

:lol:

I'm primarily a guitar player and I always write on acoustic... from there... the song basically tells me if it's going to be a heavy rocker or a simple ballad or something in between.

Sometimes I write on piano...that usually always ends up being a ballad..

Lyrics are always last... I have the hardest time writing music for lyrics...

I usually start with a basic melody but sometimes drum programming.

One thing which kinda works for me is to start a melody with scale degrees only (no chords allowed!) and once you have your simple ringtone melody, build chords out of it, or, build chords by using other instruments, for example have the bass on C1 - the root note - the keys on E 3 - third degree - and strings or something on G3.

I find that using chords for one instrument helps you to run out of space very early.

Also, try flicking through synth patches but always be listening for glitches that can inspire a groove <----- I can't tell you how many glitches I've made tunes out of.

Last but not least, invest in a s#!+ sound card - It's glitches will also give you ideas.

The last one is true but probably not advisable! lol

Sometimes it is a Collection Of Words than end up being a seed for the lyrics, and usually while figuring out the lyrics a rhythm comes to me and that leads to a tempo and groove which I then figure out on the drums/rhythm section...

And more often then not I just sit down at the keys (piano, accordion, Hammond) and start letting my hands move on their own... that leads to a groove and I quickly toss in a basic drum groove and words start flowing into my head (and I ignore the ones about killing my mother) and away I go.

And once in a while it all arrives together and I skip breakfast and lock myself into my "studio" (whichever room it might be in on that particular day) and a few hours later there is a finished demo ready to go.

I'll say this: I'm still amazed and somewhat humbled when the Primary Creative Facilitating Mechanism Of The Universe sticks that 1/4" jack connected to The Source into my brain and heart and CRANKS UP THE CURRENT.

Man... I could be writing LEGAL DRAFTS or something, but I'm not. Yay Creative Flow and Flowing Beer (not necessarily in that order! )

In electronic music a hell of a lot of people start with the drum beat! I know a lot of professionals do it that way and there is a lot to be said for that because building a melody, a groove or a bassline around a drum beat is much easier than the other way around. It also makes your work flow very fast as you already have your groove.

SINCE WRITING THE ABOVE POST OF MINE, I AM A DRUM PROGRAMMING FIRST CONVERT. WROTE AN ENTIRE TRACK IN 2 DAYS, NOT BAD.

In electronic music a hell of a lot of people start with the drum beat! I know a lot of professionals do it that way and there is a lot to be said for that because building a melody, a groove or a bassline around a drum beat is much easier than the other way around

Is it easy to run into a dead stop this way? - I'm a beginner and have found that if I start with a beat, add a bassline, then melody I often run into a situation where I can't think of a melody to go with the bassline/beat. If I start with some idea of a melody/bassline then work from there I have more success. To fix some of the frustrations I've had with "dead stops" I'm going back to school in September to learn more about Dance Music (hopefully that will help).

Andy

In electronic music a hell of a lot of people start with the drum beat! I know a lot of professionals do it that way and there is a lot to be said for that because building a melody, a groove or a bassline around a drum beat is much easier than the other way around

 

Is it easy to run into a dead stop this way? - I'm a beginner and have found that if I start with a beat, add a bassline, then melody I often run into a situation where I can't think of a melody to go with the bassline/beat. If I start with some idea of a melody/bassline then work from there I have more success. To fix some of the frustrations I've had with "dead stops" I'm going back to school in September to learn more about Dance Music (hopefully that will help).

 

Andy

I hear what you are saying there as I used to think the same thing - that is before I realised that instead of just laying down some drums, you should actually get the groove right using velocity sensitive drums and ghost notes.

Also, melody is alot easier to play in with midi keyboard than by sticking notes to the timeline, maybe you do that already but if you don't it might help.

... that if I start with a beat, add a bassline, then melody I often run into a situation where I can't think of a melody to go with the bassline/beat.

One of the challenges I can see that you potentially have here is that you are trying to THINK of a melody. I can only speak from my experience (and that of most of the other songwriters I've worked with) but THINKING is highly over-rated in "pop" or "dance" music. It is like trying to THINK about how to move your body to a song on the dance floor... great way to look GEEKY!

To be clear, I'm talking about letting that bass line and drum groove run for a bit while (maybe) you dance around the living room, for example. Clear the old head of prejudices and preconditions. Don't TRY to do ANYTHING except let the groove get inside you. Oh, and start humming or whistling or whatever... Don't worry about WHAT you are humming or whistling... let it come out and don't sweat it if it sounds like a three week old turd falling down 200 foot deep toilet. All of a sudden you'll zone in (hopefully) and the groove will tell YOU what the melody is gonna be. You'll start humming a cool bit here, a funky bit there... keep on... don't stop. At some point CLUNK! You'll know you've got something cool because you'll have goosebumps and you'll feel real high (and it won't be the cough medicine )

Anyway - that is Reinier's Rant on NOT THINKING. Hope you think (er, um... LET THIS IN) about this and give it a try.

Cheers! And don't give up. Ever. Unless, of course, your song sucks. Then you should stop.

Yep, I agree - I think this is more to do with a lack of understanding on the structure of Dance Music than anything else. Going to school @ PointBlank should help a lot.

And I hope my above post doesn't make you think that I think school is a bad idea... it is great and you should go for it. But the brain will only get you so far with music... (old guy talkin' here )

Anyway - that is Reinier's Rant on NOT THINKING. Hope you think (er, um... LET THIS IN) about this and give it a try.

Very good advice! - Thank-you!

One thing I have done is saved the tracks that I have "hit a wall on" and plan to go back to them later with new ideas / learnings etc. I guess that happens a lot?

Andy

And I hope my above post doesn't make you think that I think school is a bad idea... it is great and you should go for it. But the brain will only get you so far with music... (old guy talkin' here )

Not at all - I was replying to BlindSummit's post....your advice is much appreciated too!!

btw: Vancouver rocks! - I'm well travelled and find Vancouver to be one of the best places I have ever visited....

Anyway - that is Reinier's Rant on NOT THINKING. Hope you think (er, um... LET THIS IN) about this and give it a try.

 

Very good advice! - Thank-you!

 

One thing I have done is saved the tracks that I have "hit a wall on" and plan to go back to them later with new ideas / learnings etc. I guess that happens a lot?

 

Andy

Perfect, my fellow Canuck! (insert moose or beaver emoticon here)

I have a separate folder for "Potential Ditties" and if the magic doesn't happen today, I'll dump the working logic file in that folder and on some future day when I can't get a new groove happening, I'll dig through that folder and see what catches my interest.

Anyway - that is Reinier's Rant on NOT THINKING. Hope you think (er, um... LET THIS IN) about this and give it a try.

 

Very good advice! - Thank-you!

 

One thing I have done is saved the tracks that I have "hit a wall on" and plan to go back to them later with new ideas / learnings etc. I guess that happens a lot?

 

Andy

I have plans to do that very thing! All producers whether pros or amateurs, beginners or experts have partial tunes that they intend on going back to - NEVER EVER WASTE OR DELETE ANYTHING!

I have so many things that I've hit brick walls on but one day I'll hear a vocal or a tune that I think would sound good with it, perhaps a remix idea or perhaps with more experience a groove or melody will pop into my head. When you hit the wall, leave it immediately - don't play it out until you never want to hear it again! EVER! I have a few of those too lol

When you hit the wall, leave it immediately - don't play it out until you never want to hear it again! EVER!

If this advice was followed by every artist in the world. There would be no art.

Song writing is so personal, and hi all, just popping in here for the first time. My wife and I are a long time songwriting team now, over 22yrs at it. I have been writing songs for about 40 yrs. I began on guitar originally and worked my way through piano, keys and drums also.

Lately I have been torn between picking out the guitar and making songs, and sitting down at the keys and making one. Here's the cool part, there is no set way to do it . Leigh, my wife, makes lyrics in a syllable based method and puts numbers along side. Sometimes I can look at the lyrics, sit down and within moments get a musical phrase happening for them.

Music to me is about what you feel, as a result I have personally a VERY diverse collection of originals. Shameless plug, you can hear some of them on my Soundcloud site. I do not claim to be a god of writing, but I think some of what I achieve is listen worthy.

Tony

The problem I sometimes have in writing songs is feeling an emotional connection with the music.

I find that if I have the story of the song first, then I can match the mood of the music to the story of the song.

Whatever it takes

It's easy to start songs -- hard to finish them. That's what separating amateurs from professionals.

Any song should have some kind of idea of a beginning, middle and end. Various forms of music have formulas, usually silly but needed for the consumer to accept the song -- style breakdowns in dance music or the verse-chorus-verse-chorus-bridge-chorus in pop songs.

Best to sit down and listen to the music you want to produce and learn the patterns. And after that break the rules!

And after that break the rules!

I think I've prbably broken every rule with the dins I make...!

And after that break the rules!

 

I think I've prbably broken every rule with the dins I make...!

Good! I think it's time to break a lot of rules in order to be noticed in this current massive ocean of music released every minute.

You can try to adapt vocals to the melody. You're going to immediately encounter the balancing act all songwriters encounter where you want to keep the lyrics you like and the melody you like, but one (or both) will have to give a little.

 

One of the coolest things about being a songwriter today is that you can take that melody you recorded and literally just cycle through different types of instruments using just the stock logic virtual instruments, and see how it sounds best.

 

And then of course there's a million other ways to take a simple idea and go crazy with it (literally and figuratively).

It really useful for me. Thanks you for the reply.