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Last insert slot automation bug


Danny Wyatt

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Anyone experience this?

I was trying to write some automation using the Latch option on the last available slot (apparently Logic "only" allows 15 inserts). It seems that the Latch doesn't work for that slot, only for 14th and below.

(before you murder me asking why in hell would I have 15 inserts, I don't. I was testing something and ended up with this issue haha).

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That's on a software instrument channel strip right? Does it work as expected on an audio channel strip?

 

Yes to both questions.

I also noticed that when the plugin is on that slot, it doesn't even show up on the list of automation. And if I move the plugin from 14th to 15th, all the automation becomes "Unused"

1366849891_ScreenShot2021-09-23at9_26_56AM.png.a28bf9abf305464d5e93a6959e3b717b.png

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Ok that's a bug: insert slots are numbered 1 through 15 however on software instruments, insert #1 is the instrument slot, leaving only 14 numbers to list effect slots in the automation parameter pop-up menu. I shall report it. :)

 

Oh I see. So technically Logic only allows 15 inserts and since software instruments use the instrument itself as an insert, the 15th becomes 16th, correct?

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Exactly, yes:

 

Screen Shot 2021-09-23 at 10.34.52.png

 

Cool :)

 

This goes back to something I’ve already talked about here on the forum and some people made comments as if my point of view was non-sense and that is: insert slots on both Software Instruments and Audio tracks should be numbered the same way. The Software Instrument shouldn’t be seen as an insert. The first slot of real inserts (delay, compressors, etc) should be the first on both types of tracks. That way if I have a delay on the first slot of a software instrument and copy that automation to an audio track also with a delay on the first slot, it doesn’t copy it to the second slot. It never made sense to me. Apparently it does to some people though haha

(End of rant)

 

Thanks for clarifying that! :)

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Yes that would make sense from a user point of view.

 

From a developer point of view, that's the way Logic was engineered. I remember when they first introduced software synthesizer plug-ins in Logic 4 or Logic 5 I believe, and that was a brand new concept. Back then, all channel strips looked the same and the only way to add plug-ins of any kind was the "Insert" section. So you would insert your instrument plug-in in the first insert of the channel strip, at the same place where you would insert your first audio effect plug-in on an audio channel strip. Insert #1. Then at some point they must have realized that it was odd and gave the instrument slot its own location, next to the input pop-up menu on an audio channel. But internally, the numbering stayed the same.

 

I'm not sure what it would require to renumber those internally but my guess is, it would be probably easier to renumber only what the user sees.

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Yes that would make sense from a user point of view.

 

From a developer point of view, that's the way Logic was engineered. I remember when they first introduced software synthesizer plug-ins in Logic 4 or Logic 5 I believe, and that was a brand new concept. Back then, all channel strips looked the same and the only way to add plug-ins of any kind was the "Insert" section. So you would insert your instrument plug-in in the first insert of the channel strip, at the same place where you would insert your first audio effect plug-in on an audio channel strip. Insert #1. Then at some point they must have realized that it was odd and gave the instrument slot its own location, next to the input pop-up menu on an audio channel. But internally, the numbering stayed the same.

 

I'm not sure what it would require to renumber those internally but my guess is, it would be probably easier to renumber only what the user sees.

 

Yeah, what happens behind the scenes is not important to the user. But for our workflow, it doesn't make much sense, because we never refer to an instrument as an insert. After all a MIDI instrument is that: an instrument (like a guitar or vocals and should be treated like that). It's not an effect. Oh well... ;)

Now I know there's 15 slots, but in reality there's 16 when it comes to software instruments. Go, Apple developers!!! hahaha

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Yes that would make sense from a user point of view.

 

From a developer point of view, that's the way Logic was engineered. I remember when they first introduced software synthesizer plug-ins in Logic 4 or Logic 5 I believe, and that was a brand new concept. Back then, all channel strips looked the same and the only way to add plug-ins of any kind was the "Insert" section. So you would insert your instrument plug-in in the first insert of the channel strip, at the same place where you would insert your first audio effect plug-in on an audio channel strip. Insert #1. Then at some point they must have realized that it was odd and gave the instrument slot its own location, next to the input pop-up menu on an audio channel. But internally, the numbering stayed the same.

 

I'm not sure what it would require to renumber those internally but my guess is, it would be probably easier to renumber only what the user sees.

 

And you actually skipped one "magical and brilliant step": when the software instrument was actually at the bottom, next to the output menu, remember? So that made even less sense. So you go from insert 1 at the bottom, to then have insert 2 at the top... hahaha

 

logic-studio-7.jpeg.68e050dfad59987e42e2601f3a172e19.jpeg

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