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prencaudio
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Imported midi automatically snaps to grid

Thu Feb 13, 2020 6:42 pm

I've got midi created in pro tools of a live drum performance. Notes are not on grid. But when importing the midi into logic, it moves all notes to grid. I've tried all import methods and its all the same. Both daws are in max zoom

Screenshots show first note off grid in PT, Note on grid in logic

image-1.png
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image-2.png
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David Nahmani
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Re: Imported midi automatically snaps to grid

Fri Feb 14, 2020 2:41 am

It's possible that the visual resolution is such that the note appears on the grid even if it isn't. Try to click-hold the note to see its exact position in the help tag:

Note-Position.png
Note-Position.png (21.09 KiB) Viewed 426 times
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prencaudio
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Re: Imported midi automatically snaps to grid

Fri Feb 14, 2020 7:02 pm

I printed a spike with it and it is definitely 100% on grid vs its waveform counterpart. Very odd behaviour
 
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David Nahmani
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Re: Imported midi automatically snaps to grid

Sat Feb 15, 2020 2:14 am

MIDI Files have a limited time resolution called PPQ (Parts Per Quarter Note) and measured in "ticks". In Pro Tools there's a clock that measures time in samples, which is a much higher resolution. It's possible that a note that is off by a few samples in Pro Tools snaps to the nearest tick once exported to a MIDI file. To determine if that's what is happening, find out the exact MIDI position of your note in ticks in Pro Tools.
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prencaudio
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Re: Imported midi automatically snaps to grid

Sat Feb 15, 2020 6:18 pm

I dont think i can find the exact tick but here's screenshot with samples listed in the top tab

MIDI-Note.png
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Could it be possible that i have some weird setting enabled in logic? Here's a link to the midi if anyone wants to see if they have the same issue

https://www.dropbox.com/s/bv2z287z4de91 ... T.mid?dl=0
 
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volovicg
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Re: Imported midi automatically snaps to grid

Sat Feb 15, 2020 10:29 pm

In logic your note is not snapped to the grid - the period after the last 2 indicates it starts after the first tick but before the 2nd tick - I haven’t downloaded your file yet - but if you zoom all the way in on the start of that note you will see it is the same as protools - you are just zoomed out too far to see it -
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David Nahmani
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Re: Imported midi automatically snaps to grid

Sun Feb 16, 2020 12:28 am

That's the reason I suggest you click-hold the note to find out its exact position in Logic.
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volovicg
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Re: Imported midi automatically snaps to grid

Sun Feb 16, 2020 5:33 am

That’s your pic - I thought it was his :)
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volovicg
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Re: Imported midi automatically snaps to grid

Sun Feb 16, 2020 6:37 am

I have analyzed the attached file and it appears it is being imported correctly and the quantization is in the midi file.
When you export from protools there is an option called "write real-time properties" if you have that selected during the export - Protools quantization parameters are applied to the export. Did you have that option checked during the export? - can you try without it and see if that solves your issues.
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Fred B
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Re: Imported midi automatically snaps to grid

Sun Feb 16, 2020 11:21 am

You can view the midi file in text format using this online tool
http://www.flashmusicgames.com/midi/mid2txt.php

It shows a resolution of 9600 which is 10 times higher than Logic internally.
So strictly speaking, Logic's midi import is not correct.
But I wonder if it really matters in practice.
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David Nahmani
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Re: Imported midi automatically snaps to grid

Sun Feb 16, 2020 11:28 am

Fred B wrote:
You can view the midi file in text format using this online tool
http://www.flashmusicgames.com/midi/mid2txt.php

It shows a resolution of 9600 which is 10 times higher than Logic internally.
So strictly speaking, Logic's midi import is not correct.
But I wonder if it really matters in practice.

Great! Thanks for sharing this tool. I have been looking for such a tool for a while and couldn't find one.
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prencaudio
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Re: Imported midi automatically snaps to grid

Mon Feb 17, 2020 5:14 pm

Still no good. Despite the changes to the midi file, PT still imports it correctly.
 
prencaudio
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Re: Imported midi automatically snaps to grid

Mon Feb 17, 2020 5:28 pm

attached midi file with realtime unselected
Attachments
Alpha Wolf LP2 2.0.mid
(83.13 KiB) Downloaded 4 times
 
Fred B
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Re: Imported midi automatically snaps to grid

Tue Feb 18, 2020 7:03 am

Again, here is an example demonstrating the issue.

In the midi file a note of "KICK MIDI" starts at 729601 ticks.
With resolution 9600 we can calculate: 729601 modulo 9600 = 1,
meaning that the note starts 1 tick after the beat.

However, in Logic with lower resolution 960 this corresponds to 0.1 ticks,
which must be converted to an integer, i.e. truncated/rounded to 0.
Thus in Logic the note starts exactly on the beat.

The time interval of ticks in Logic is about 1 ms at 60 bpm.
So in this example the timing error on import would be 0.1 ms.
Generally the error due to rounding will be in the range +/- 0.5 ms.
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