Why does Smart Snap act dumb sometimes?

[Tarekith]

Anyone else ever have issues where Smart Snap forces regions to weird offset values? Sometimes I'll go to drag a region to an even bar, and unless I zoom WAY in, I can't get it to snap to just that bar, It always snaps to some weird offset values. Happens no matter what snap mode I use actually, and holding CTRL doesn't help. I need to zoom really far in to get it right at the bar line.

 

Is this just me?

[David Nahmani]

Smart works fine here. As you get closer to the Bar, it ends up snapping to it. Do you have View > SMPTE enabled? Otherwise, try trashing your preferences.

[editbrain]

Tarekith,

 

I usually always keep No Overlap selected. Sometimes whether it is Smart or whatever I cannot get the region to snap to the x x x 1.

 

i don't know what to tell you. I have the same experience. that is if this is what your experiencing.

[David Nahmani]

Or as a workaround you could just hold both Control-Shift to get the Region to behave, but really I can't remember ever having that issue...?

 

Oh one more question: where is your song start marker? Right on 1 1 1 1 or somewhere else?

[Tarekith]

Edit, that's exactly the issue I'm having, it'll snap to x x x 41, or x x x 008, etc. If I zoom really far in, then it'll snap to x x x 1, but when zoomed out where you'd expect it'd snap to bars easier, it doesn't. Frustratingly, the offset is usually really small too, so i don't notice that my regions aren't always lined up until it require a lot of work to fix.

 

David, I don't have SMPTE view enabled, and my start marker is at 1.1.1.1.

 

What does CTRL + Shift do? I can't select any clips with that key command held.

[David Nahmani]

Let me ask you: so what you mean is that it snaps at 5 1 1 41, and then as you drag toward the left, the next value it snaps at is 4 4 4 211, and no matter how slowly you move the mouse, you just can't let go on 5 1 1 1? Just want to make sure I understand you correctly. I've never, ever seen that! BTW did you try with a fresh preference file?

 

Click-hold the region, then hold move it, and hold control for more precision, and then hold both control and shift at the same time for tick precision (all the time holding down the mouse click).

[JPZ]

I get the same behavior. Drives me nuts unless I'm zoomed in. Hey David, on a similar note I hace a question regarding copy/paste and please forgive me for using Pro tools as an example. In PT for speed I copy/paste regions based on bars or more often, beats. In Logic this is a pain because as far as I can tell the only way to do this is by typing the number into to the display on the transport which is time consuming and most of the time I don't even know the bar/beat number. In PT you just put it grid mode, click relatively close to the beat with the I beam(selector) tool on the destination track and command v. It's all quick and visual. Clicking in the bar ruler Logic doesn't snap the SPL to an exact beat and moving the SPL around manually is inaccurate as well. Is there a better way to do this?

[Tarekith]

Let me ask you: so what you mean is that it snaps at 5 1 1 41, and then as you drag toward the left, the next value it snaps at is 4 4 4 211, and no matter how slowly you move the mouse, you just can't let go on 5 1 1 1? Just want to make sure I understand you correctly.

 

>>>Yes, that's exactly what happens. Whatever that weird random little offset is, it always applies that to where ever I drag the region. What's weird is that this is something that will happen to all regions on that track (and I don't have any offsets applied in region parameters), but not all regions in a project. Sometimes closing and reopening Logic will make everything fine too. <<<

 

I've never, ever seen that! BTW did you try with a fresh preference file?

 

>>>Yes, I've trashed my pref's file so many times in the last two months since I got Logic, trying to solve my core audio warnings, and it always reappears. Random too, I can't reproduce 100%.

 

If I switch to bar snap mode, still happens, only the offset is always applied to multiple of bars, ie 1.1.1.41, 2.1.1.41, etc.

 

Ironically, the VERY first time I moved a region in Logic when i first got it this happened, and I was like WTF, how does this work!?!?! <<>>I'll try that next time I see this. I had been trying to hold CTRL for finer precision, but that had not worked either. Thanks for the ideas, Logic is by far the most fiddley app I've ever used. <<<

[Tarekith]

I get the same behavior. Drives me nuts unless I'm zoomed in. Hey David, on a similar note I hace a question regarding copy/paste and please forgive me for using Pro tools as an example. In PT for speed I copy/paste regions based on bars or more often, beats. In Logic this is a pain because as far as I can tell the only way to do this is by typing the number into to the display on the transport which is time consuming and most of the time I don't even know the bar/beat number. In PT you just put it grid mode, click relatively close to the beat with the I beam(selector) tool on the destination track and command v. It's all quick and visual. Clicking in the bar ruler Logic doesn't snap the SPL to an exact beat and moving the SPL around manually is inaccurate as well. Is there a better way to do this?

 

Amen, that's how ALL other DAWs I've used are too, this one always gets me as well in Logic. Usually if I drag REALLY slow in the ruler, i can watch the transport and eventually the SPL will snap to where i want. But it's not automatic like you'd expect.

[David Nahmani]

I get the same behavior. Drives me nuts unless I'm zoomed in. Hey David, on a similar note I hace a question regarding copy/paste and please forgive me for using Pro tools as an example. In PT for speed I copy/paste regions based on bars or more often, beats. In Logic this is a pain because as far as I can tell the only way to do this is by typing the number into to the display on the transport which is time consuming and most of the time I don't even know the bar/beat number. In PT you just put it grid mode, click relatively close to the beat with the I beam(selector) tool on the destination track and command v. It's all quick and visual. Clicking in the bar ruler Logic doesn't snap the SPL to an exact beat and moving the SPL around manually is inaccurate as well. Is there a better way to do this?

 

Zoom out so your SPL snaps to the beat. At least it's faster.

 

I've assigned the period '.' to "Go to Position". I find it even faster that way to put the SPL on any bar. But I don't like copy-pasting in Logic because it creates an Alias (for Audio Regions), not a copy. I'm a big Option-dragger.

[David Nahmani]

If I switch to bar snap mode, still happens, only the offset is always applied to multiple of bars, ie 1.1.1.41, 2.1.1.41, etc.

That's "normal" behavior. I was kinda bummed by this too, but that's how it was intended. Snap to Bar, in Logic, means move by a whole Bar. Very useful at times, but usually not what you'd expect.

 

The help tag is your best friend.

 

Oh and know that you can also quantize the position of your Regions in the event list. Or keep an event float open, select the region, and type the bar number in the event float. Or position the SPL and use Pickup Clock. Or.... ok I know, those are all but workarounds.

 

I guess I've worked with Logic for so long I know what to do to get the work done, so I don't even see the flaws anymore. But I do remember being very frustrated when I first discovered those things.

[JPZ]

But I don't like copy-pasting in Logic because it creates an Alias (for Audio Regions), not a copy. I'm a big Option-dragger.

 

Sadly I discovered this too late. Option drag seems slow compared to the way I'm used to working. Thanks for your response

[David Nahmani]

I'm sorry! BRAIN FART. I was thinking that you were starting with Regions that are aligned to the Bar, and when moving them, you couldn't align them to another Bar.

 

But if the region is not exactly on a Bar, then you might not be able to place it exactly on a Bar using Control alone.

 

In that case, use control-shift, and the help tag. So: Start dragging, get it as close as you can, then while dragging, hold control-shift, and use the help tag to line it up on X 1 1 1.

[editbrain]

all this is good and all, David, but it just started to happen. It is a workflow killer for those who have used logic for a long time, and seems to be killing work flows of new adopters as well.

 

it is a royal pain in the ass. because now i have to completely resort to a new workflow, and also these issues should be addressed.

 

if it weren't for the instruments....

 

 

i think i am getting tired of the hush, hush, behavior from Apple. I apologize for taken this thread there, guys and gals.

[Tarekith]

Yeah, already discovered the need to option drag too, slow, but it's the only way.

 

And David, I WAS referring to regions that were previous dead snapped to an even bar position. It's when trying to move these perfectly snapped regions to a new location, that I run into this weird offset issue. I'll try the CTRL+Shift method next time I see this though, hopefully that helps.

 

Funny, but so many people I know kept going on and on about how easy and fast Logic was, that I just had to try it when I got the chance. I don't think these people have used any other DAW in so long, they don't know what they're missing! It does put into perspective for me why so many people seem so eager for news of Logic 8, there's a lot of room for improvement compared to the way other DAWs function. I couldn't understand why there are so many posts all over the net about the wait for the upgrade

 

Gotta love those awesome sounding instruments though, Sculpture and Ultrabeat alone were worth the price I paid for my used copy of Logic

[guavadude]

when this happens to me, I just hit "F" for the float bar and then I type in the exact location and get on with my life.

[David Nahmani]

I'll try the CTRL+Shift method next time I see this though, hopefully that helps.

It does! I find it to be the fastest way. You don't even have to let go of your mouse. Just press another modifier (shift) and there you go, you can move your region to any precise position.

[putte]

.. i am having this problem since .. since .. well, since ever. (started with version 4.0)

 

putte

[Tarekith]

I'll try the CTRL+Shift method next time I see this though, hopefully that helps.

It does! I find it to be the fastest way. You don't even have to let go of your mouse. Just press another modifier (shift) and there you go, you can move your region to any precise position.

 

Thanks again fro your help David!

[wip]

regarding the making of alias when you copy and paste regions in Logic, i sometimes copy and click 'audio'->'convert regions to new regions'.

ofcourse doing this will make the audio window pile up very quickly with regions but it's one way to go.

[woodenboy]

Or position the SPL and use Pickup Clock.

I wouldn't have discovered this... thanks! I've had the same problem trying to get regions to snap to bars and beats, this helps a lot... although ctrl-shift is good too.

[JPZ]

regarding the making of alias when you copy and paste regions in Logic, i sometimes copy and click 'audio'->'convert regions to new regions'.

ofcourse doing this will make the audio window pile up very quickly with regions but it's one way to go.

 

Didn't I read somewhere in the manual that there was a way to have aliases become unlinked from the original region or am I hallucinating?

[David Nahmani]

regarding the making of alias when you copy and paste regions in Logic, i sometimes copy and click 'audio'->'convert regions to new regions'.

ofcourse doing this will make the audio window pile up very quickly with regions but it's one way to go.

 

Didn't I read somewhere in the manual that there was a way to have aliases become unlinked from the original region or am I hallucinating?

Well that's the way wip described.

[JPZ]

regarding the making of alias when you copy and paste regions in Logic, i sometimes copy and click 'audio'->'convert regions to new regions'.

ofcourse doing this will make the audio window pile up very quickly with regions but it's one way to go.

 

Didn't I read somewhere in the manual that there was a way to have aliases become unlinked from the original region or am I hallucinating?

Well that's the way wip described.

 

So this just creates new regions not audio files unless you specifically do that correct? If that's the case at least there's a work around although clunky. I get the whole alias of regions thing. In theory it's great - edit one region, edit them all but in use it's really not that often called for.

[donnie darko]

yea i have this problem too, when i notice it isn't going to snap to where it should do, i just leave it in the wrong position and then undo it with apple z, and then drag it again then it usually snaps 2 the right place

[David Nahmani]

So this just creates new regions not audio files unless you specifically do that correct?

correct.

[camillo jr]

I get the thing with the region not snapping precisely sometimes. I don't know what causes it but it didn't used to do it and then one day it was there and this was between upgrades. I've got Logic set to smart snap and overlap.

 

Regarding the copies issue, there's always Audio>Convert Regions to New Regions which has the same effect as option-drag - creates an independent region but uses the same audio file.

 

But like David I prefer to use Option-drag and I also use it with "Go to position". I use the Marquee tool to select a section and then option-drag the new region to somewhere nearby like an adjacent track. Then I cut the region, Go to Position and paste. I find that very fast. All I have to do is remember the bar number of where it was I wanted to paste which I've got into the habit of doing.