problem mapping akai mpk88 to smart controls [SOLVED]

[TheAlienDog]

Hello.

 

I'm having a hard time mapping the knobs on my Akai MPK88 control keyboard to Logic's Smart Controls, and I'm hoping someone can help.

 

Using the "Learn" function in the Smart Controls "i" window, I've managed to map the knobs on my controller to the Smart Controls for plugins on my Main Output -- I turn the knobs on the controller, the Smart Controls move, great (controlling all 3rd party plugins, for what it's worth).

 

But when I switch to another channel strip, the controller knobs don't do anything -- the Smart Control knobs are unaffected -- they just work for the output plugs and nothing else. And I can't even program the other unassigned controller knobs to the smart controls using the Learn function and have it successfully do anything -- I can only assign the knobs to those Smart Controls for my Output, not any other channel strip. I see the new assignment reflected in the "External Assignment" feedback window, but turning the knob doesn't make the controller move -- just for the one channel.

 

So why am I a dumdum? What am I overlooking? Do I need to set something up differently on the Akai, which in currently basically just spitting out MIDI controller data from its knobs? Or configure the Controller Assignments differently in Logic?

 

I also have a Behfinger BCF2000 control surface acting as a Logic Control, used for mixing and such. Could this be conflicting with the ability of Logic being able to learn controller assignments from the Akai? (Note: It behaves this way whether or not the Behringer is connected)

 

Mostly: I just want to be able to use the knobs to control the Smart Controls.

 

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

 

Logic 10.2.2

[Eric Cardenas]

The knobs on the MPK88 should have been auto assigned by Logic Pro X.

Choose Preferences > Control Surfaces > MIDI Controllers and make sure that your AKAI is enabled.

[TheAlienDog]

Ah, the automapping they just introduced. I've been reluctant to set it up because I feared that it would kill the remaining controller assignments I currently have on the Akai.

 

If I just want to use the knobs on the Akai for the smart controls, but I want to preserve the faders for things like MIDI CC 1, 7, 11, 10, etc. and AQA, will I be able to configure that (or maintain that) if I use the automapped controllers?

 

Thanks for the response.

[Eric Cardenas]

I see.

Well then you should be able to deselect that preferences and MIDI learn the smart controls to your knobs.

Use a selected channel strip instead of your Output when you assign those knobs.

[TheAlienDog]

Thanks -- but right, that doesn't seem to be working. No matter what I do, even if I delete all the controllers mapped to the Smart Controls and they read "unassigned," I'll "learn" the knobs to the Smart Controls, but it doesn't seem to stick -- they only seem to attach to my outputs for some reason. Even if I delete those assignments.

[Eric Cardenas]

Can you post a screenshot of your Controller Assignments window?

With one of the Learned parameters selected.

[TheAlienDog]

Not sure what I did differently, but several restarts and one more attempt at getting the SCs to learn the knobs seems to have done the trick -- the assignments stick as they should have in the first place.

 

I guess the lesson is: never underestimate the power of a good bunch-of-restarts.

[David Nahmani]

I guess the lesson is: never underestimate the power of a good bunch-of-restarts.

It's the digital age equivalent of slapping your TV.

[Eric Cardenas]

I'm glad you got it working.

It was probably due to the hot sausage in your flying saucer.

[TheAlienDog]

Spoke too soon. Reattached my BCF2000 and it all stopped working again.

 

In an attempt to troubleshoot this, I've decided to start from scratch -- deleted and disconnected all my controllers except for my Akai, and even by itself it continues to give me grief. It only seems to accept the knob mapping on my output channel -- no other channels will have their Smart Controls move.

 

The knobs on the Akai are currently spitting out MIDI data into Logic as follows:

 

Knob 1 - CC3

Knob 2 - CC9

Knob 3 - CC14

Knob 4 - CC15

Knob 5 - CC16

Knob 6 - CC17

Knob 7 - CC18

Knob 8 - CC19

 

Do you see any problems with this?

 

I'm attaching 4 screenshots -- in 1A and 1B you'll see my output channel and the Smart Controls affecting an SSL Bus Compressor and the ARC 2 I have on my output. These work mostly fine. But the knobs continue to affect this channel even when other channels are selected -- they don't automatically shift to the new channel.

 

In screenshots 2A and 2B, you'll see an instrument channel with the autofilter inserted, and the SCs seem to map correctly (if I manually turn the knobs on the screen, the controls in the plugin move). But the hardware knobs do diddlysquat to the selected channel, BUT they affect the output.

 

As you'll notice, I've only mapped knob 1 in this shot to keep things simple -- but the same holds true with the other 7 knobs.

 

And yes, I did try to restart a few times. The Fonzie trick does not appear to be helping.

 

Any thoughts? Please?

 

Thank you!

 

[Eric Cardenas]

Start from scratch again.

 

Quit Logic and delete this file (or save it on your desktop):

~/Library/Preferences/com.apple.logic.pro.cs

 

Connect your two controllers and launch Logic.

Configure your behringer unit and quit and relaunch Logic to save its config.

In Logic create a audio channel strip with a compressor and EQ inserted just to create a bread and butter channel.

Open Smart controls and assign all 8 knobs via the Smart Control Learn button. When done click one the Learn button again to disable it.

Now create a software instrument track and insert a patch of your choice. Will that work?

[TheAlienDog]

Alas it does not -- nothing moving from the Akai. BUT, weirdly, turning knobs one and 2 on the akai (still CCs 3 and 9) are soloing and muting the Output when it's selected -- but not the other tracks.

 

Behringer seems to be working ok in Logic Control mode, though. But still no Smart Controls.

 

As a test, I also tried mapping some of the Akai faders on to the Smart Controls. Also failed.

 

Feeling like either the smart controls are not so smart, or maybe I'm not. Blergh.

[Eric Cardenas]

Not sure how to proceed here.

It works perfectly here on several systems.

 

Click this link to your signature and add your system information:

• Logic version and sub-version (e.g. Logic Pro X 10.2.2)

• OS X version and sub-version (e.g. OS X El Capitan 10.11.4)

• Computer (e.g. MacBook Pro, Mac Pro, iMac)

• Processor (e.g. 2.2 GHz Intel i7)

• Memory (e.g. 8GB)

• Audio interface manufacturer and model (e.g. RME Babyface Pro)

 

(most of that information can be found by choosing Logic Pro X > About Logic Pro X, and  > About This Mac)

 

Alas it does not -- nothing moving from the Akai. BUT, weirdly, turning knobs one and 2 on the akai (still CCs 3 and 9) are soloing and muting the Output when it's selected -- but not the other tracks.

 

I don't understand when it is that you encounter the problems.

Can you describe step by step what you are doing?

Is the first knob registering correctly at first when you are MIDI learning it?

[TheAlienDog]

All right, here goes. I appreciate your taking the time to do this.

 

1) Following your instructions, I quit Logic and moved ~/Library/Preferences/com.apple.logic.pro.cs to my desktop.

 

2) Connected controllers (both USB) and launched Logic. I have my BCF2000 set up as Logic Control. Looking in the “MIDI Controllers” preference pane, I see both my Akai and my Behringer. Both remain unchecked (remember that I wish to keep the Akai faders set aside for more common controllers like CC01, CC11, CC07, etc. and don't want to commit the Faders to being auto-assigned to anything, and just want to have the Smart Controls "Learn" the MIDI assignments manually.

 

In the Control Surface Setup window, I just see my BCF/Logic Control (running version 1.01, it says). Under that I see “CS Group: Control Surface Group 1” which was there even when all controllers were disconnected. It wasn’t deletable.

My Controller Assignments window is now filled with a ton of assignments.

The BCF works as expected, controlling the various pan/volume/EQ/etc parameters on screen perfectly.

 

3) I quit and relaunched Logic to save its config.

 

4) I created an audio channel strip with a compressor and EQ inserted (not in a stack) just to create a bread-and-butter channel.

 

5) I opened Smart Controls.

 

6) Note that this is the first time I’m touching the Akai now since hooking it up.

 

Without having touched it at all or otherwise assigning it, Knob 1 on the Akai (which is sending out CC03 according to the display on the Akai) is toggling the audio channel’s Solo functionality on and off (off on “0”), and Knob 2 on the Akai (CC09) is toggling the Mute functionality on and off of the selected channel (off on “0”).

 

7) I now go to assign the SCs to the knobs on the Akai. I press the “i” button next to the SCs and reveal the External Assignment section. The SCs are assigned to parameters for the compressor on the selected channel. I select the first on-screen Smart Control (assigned to Threshold) and note that there are 2 Logic Control parameters already assigned to that: Logic Control: VPot 1 (Zone: VPots, Mode: Smart Controls) and Logic Control: Ch. 1 V-Select (Zone: Vpots, Mode: Smart Controls). There is a 3rd entry there that reads “Unassigned.” Please note that my BCF continues to work as expected, as a Logic Control for Pan/Volume, EQ, etc.

 

8 ) So then, selecting Threshold and then ticking “Learn” next to External Assignment — Note that before I even move a knob, the assignment in the Feedback window that formerly read Logic Control: VPot 1 (Zone: VPots, Mode: Smart Controls) now reads Logic Control: No message received yet (Zone: VPots, Mode: Smart Controls).

 

I twiddle the Akai’s knob and now it says: Logic Control: Learned (Zone: VPots, Mode: Smart Controls). I note that as i move, the now-red-highlighted SC1 is moving as well — feels promising! I unclick Learn — no more red on the screen, as expected. The threshold knob no longer turns. The “Solo”-toggling behavior on the channel is back.

 

9) Just for kicks, I try to get Knob 2 to learn now. SC2 is assigned to Ratio on the compressor. Moving the on-screen SC moves the ratio in the plug-in, as expected. In the feedback window I see 2 assignments: Logic Control: VPot 2 (Zone: VPots, Mode: Smart Controls) and Logic Control: Ch. 2 V-Select (Zone: Vpots, Mode: Smart Controls). And a 3rd reads “Unassigned,” as with SC1.

 

The same exact thing happens with Knob 2/SC2 — no success, the Mute-toggling behavior is back. Neither of the behaviors sticks.

 

—

I could certainly go on, but things seem like they’re already off the rails at this point.

 

Is something obvious sticking out to you here? My knowledge of the ins & outs of controller setup is admittedly not the most expert, but I guess that’s why I’m here.

 

Thank you!

[Eric Cardenas]

1)

2)

3)

4)

5)

6)...

 

So far so good.

 

7) I now go to assign the SCs to the knobs on the Akai. I press the “i” button next to the SCs and reveal the External Assignment section. The SCs are assigned to parameters for the compressor on the selected channel. I select the first on-screen Smart Control (assigned to Threshold) and note that there are 2 Logic Control parameters already assigned to that: Logic Control: VPot 1 (Zone: VPots, Mode: Smart Controls) and Logic Control: Ch. 1 V-Select (Zone: Vpots, Mode: Smart Controls). There is a 3rd entry there that reads “Unassigned.” Please note that my BCF continues to work as expected, as a Logic Control for Pan/Volume, EQ, etc.

 

The assignments you are seeing under Smart Controls are for User 6 mode that is a pre-mapped Smart Control assignment layer.

I'm not sure how to change the assignment to User 6 from the BDF but it is Shift - Instrument on the Logic Control/MCU.

 

Without having touched it at all or otherwise assigning it, Knob 1 on the Akai (which is sending out CC03 according to the display on the Akai) is toggling the audio channel’s Solo functionality on and off (off on “0”), and Knob 2 on the Akai (CC09) is toggling the Mute functionality on and off of the selected channel (off on “0”).

 

This tells me that you probably are working from an old template or project.

Choose File > Project Settings > MIDI > General and uncheck Control Change 7/10 controls Volume/Pan of channel strip objects.

I would start again from your step 7 but on a new empty template to see if it behaves differently.

 

I twiddle the Akai’s knob and now it says: Logic Control: Learned (Zone: VPots, Mode: Smart Controls). I note that as i move, the now-red-highlighted SC1 is moving as well — feels promising! I unclick Learn — no more red on the screen, as expected. The threshold knob no longer turns. The “Solo”-toggling behavior on the channel is back.

 

This appears to be the breaking point!

Very strange behaviour.

[TheAlienDog]

Thanks again for the reply, Eric. I will try it in a blank template later tonight. You are correct in assuming that i'm using a template of my own -- I score to picture most of the time, so the template is a must for me, and whatever changes I make will need to be incorporated into this template in order for me to consider using it.

 

One question before I test this all on a new template later --

 

The assignments you are seeing under Smart Controls are for User 6 mode that is a pre-mapped Smart Control assignment layer.

I'm not sure how to change the assignment to User 6 from the BDF but it is Shift - Instrument on the Logic Control/MCU.

 

Is there a reason I *need* to change this on the BCF2000? As mentioned, the BCF2000 is seemingly working totally fine, all functionality as expected -- it's the Akai MPK88 controller keyboard (and onboard knobs/faders) where the assignments are getting screwy. Would the BCF assignments be interfering with things working correctly on the Akai? You'd think there'd be a way of rerouting things in the controller assignments window so that the Akai knobs take precedence over the BCF to control the Smart Controls (which the BCF doesn't appear to be doing anyway).

 

I should also say, I am very strongly considering at this point just ditching the BCF altogether, as it is kind of a pain with no great onboard visual feedback, and just using the Akai knobs for the Smart Controls -- in fact, somewhere in my travels I tried just assigning the Akai without the BCF attached, and it still gave me grief -- though I may try it again. The BCF feels ancient at this point, but I haven't come across something that seems like a modern, awesome-seeming tactile realworld controller with lots of onboard feedback like the Ableton Push for Live. Something like Logic Remote but with realworld knobs and faders. But I guess maybe I'm in the market if such a thing exists...

[Eric Cardenas]

No, you don't need to change anything.

I just thought that you might be interested in using the encoders on your BCF with Smart Controls too.

[TheAlienDog]

Ah! Ok, thanks. Yeah, since I theoretically have both surfaces at my fingertips, my thought is that I'd use the BCF for mixing, etc, and use the knobs on the Akai for Smart Controls -- if I can actually get it to work.

 

In the meantime, doing a bit of research on Push for Logic and Maschine for the same...

 

Thanks again.

[Eric Cardenas]

You're welcome.

[TheAlienDog]

All right, as of now it seems like the issue is somewhere with the Akai, or the interpretation of its controllers.

 

I've started fresh again, NO behringer, just the Akai. When I go to "learn mode" in the controller assignments window, I can click on almost anything -- volume, pan. plug-in paramters, etc -- and they will easily be controlled. I click on the parameter and then it appears instantly in the "Parameter" column in the Controller Assignements window -- then I twiddle one of the Akai knobs, and everything works great.

 

But this doesn't work for Smart Controls. When I try the same with SC, either via Learn Mode in the Controller Assignments window or via the "i" window right in Smart Controls, it does NOT work. In fact, the parameter doesn't show up at all in the Controller Assignments window at any time -- I just see a little dash there, as if "no" parameter is learning. And, of course, the knobs don't work once they're done "learning."

 

It basically seems like in the most stripped-down way, the Smart Controls are not assignable to physical knobs, though almost everything else is.

 

I feel like this is totally ridiculous. Why is this suddenly so impossible?

[TheAlienDog]

Ok, new info.

 

This topic helped a bit -- specifically the zipping of my controller file:

 

viewtopic.php?p=625395#p625395

 

The smart controls are finally now working correctly on several of my tracks.

 

However -- if I have a track in a stack (summing or folder), the smart controls will not be controlled by the knobs. I just get blanks when I select the track-within-the-stack and try to fire a controller. The tracks must be outside the stacks in order to be controlled.

 

Any way to control the smart controls via knob while in a stack?

[Eric Cardenas]

zipping of my controller file

That shouldn't be needed in your case since you are using 10.2.2 which provides the option to bypass those assignments from the MIDI preferences.

 

However -- if I have a track in a stack (summing or folder), the smart controls will not be controlled by the knobs. I just get blanks when I select the track-within-the-stack and try to fire a controller. The tracks must be outside the stacks in order to be controlled.

 

Any way to control the smart controls via knob while in a stack?

 

This is "normal" behaviour, meaning it is how it works at the moment, and is in my opinion an implementation restriction.

If you changing the Mixer to All view will allow you to access Smart Controls on the child tracks.

 

10.0.7 track stacks lose smart controls external assignments

[TheAlienDog]

That is a bummer about the track stacks! But ok, I'll use the "All" setting in Mixer View for the moment.

 

For future readers who might have a similar problem:

 

My guess is that there is some conflict between the BCF2000 being used as a Logic Control and the Akai. I was only ever able to map the Smart Controls onto my Akai by completely deleting and disconnecting the BCF. Since I was only just starting to use the BCF as a Logic Control, and wasn't all that thrilled with the implementation, I'd rather just keep it disconnected and use the Akai for smart controls, AQA, etc, for the moment.

 

(looks like my BCF will be up for sale sometime soon...)

 

Time to start researching alternate mixing control surfaces -- hopefully one that won't seemingly interfere with the Akai Smart Control mapping, or can make the Smart Control knobs more immediately accessible.

 

Thanks again for your help in this matter, Eric.

[Eric Cardenas]

You're welcome.

[Eric Cardenas]

One last thing to try.

I created a custom MPK scripted MIDI controller for you that you could use.

It has the smart control mappings intact but I excluded the faders.

Delete all custom mappings again before you try it out.

 

Place it in:

~/Music/Audio Music Apps/MIDI Device Scripts/Akai/

 

You will have to create the two last folders yourself.

Unzip this file and put in the Akai folder you created.

 

Akai MPK88.device.zip

 

Launch Logic and enable the MPK88 in Preferences > MIDI > Control Surfaces.