After save project file size comes too large

[Frans Lemaire]

LPX 10.4.8.

I have sufficient memory on my iMac .

I work on project for a while and saved and loaded normally .

At a certain phase , the save unexpectedly goes slower, and also the upload . The file size becomes significant larger .

doing attempts do save with other names , clean project ...does not help .

I recently saved packages instead of folders .

Files from 400 MB becomes unexpectedly around 1,2 GB .

What do I wrong ?

[Frans Lemaire]

LPX 10.4.8.

I have sufficient memory on my iMac .

I work on project for a while and saved and loaded normally .

At a certain phase , the save unexpectedly goes slower, and also the upload . The file size becomes significant larger .

doing attempts do save with other names , clean project ...does not help .

I recently saved packages instead of folders .

Files from 400 MB becomes unexpectedly around 1,2 GB .

What do I wrong ?

[Atlas007]

Have you tried decreasing the number of alternatives backups and undo steps?

[Atlas007]

Have you tried decreasing the number of alternatives backups and undo steps?

[Frans Lemaire]

SOLVED AND DONE . How can i do this ? Edited July 3, 2020 by Frans Lemaire

[Frans Lemaire]

SOLVED AND DONE . How can i do this ? Edited July 3, 2020 by Frans Lemaire

[Frans Lemaire]

SOLVED and DONE : How can we show in our comments our imac configuration ? I dont find this option Edited July 3, 2020 by Frans Lemaire

[Frans Lemaire]

SOLVED and DONE : How can we show in our comments our imac configuration ? I dont find this option Edited July 3, 2020 by Frans Lemaire

[Frans Lemaire]

Great thx for the tips.

OK, I have seen the links in your answer now for backups and undo steps . I will try this. thx

[Frans Lemaire]

Great thx for the tips.

OK, I have seen the links in your answer now for backups and undo steps . I will try this. thx

[Frans Lemaire]

I have Two recent projects with that save issue . What I try to do is start from scratch and copy/paste my regions and see if the save now is stable.

I save as Folder

I have limited the backups to 3

I have limited the undo to 3

 

Its stil strange . I use on this iMac Logic Pro X since 2017 and I never had problems. It happened in my last 2 projects. And I did not change significant updates or tools.

It was the first time I used KONTAKT and ARTURIA plugins.

[Frans Lemaire]

I have Two recent projects with that save issue . What I try to do is start from scratch and copy/paste my regions and see if the save now is stable.

I save as Folder

I have limited the backups to 3

I have limited the undo to 3

 

Its stil strange . I use on this iMac Logic Pro X since 2017 and I never had problems. It happened in my last 2 projects. And I did not change significant updates or tools.

It was the first time I used KONTAKT and ARTURIA plugins.

[triplets]

I save as Folder

 

What additional elements in the save window do you check the first time you do it?

[triplets]

I save as Folder

 

What additional elements in the save window do you check the first time you do it?

[Frans Lemaire]

I did this trial

Crated a new template with the 20 tracks , no regions : File about 3MB

Copied from the problem project all the regions/data into the new template and saved : About 400 MB

Started editing , quantize , added effects and saved : From then on I detect the save triggers the turning icon and the file becomes 412 MB

I do nothing and save again with a new name = ' old name backup ' ==> File becomes 751,3 MB and the save takes maybe a minute . And after safe when I start working the icon again starts turning and I can't work for 1 minute again.

After this , Finder shows the file with now 764 MB

I safe again without doing something and take the standard name again : it takes minutes toi save an file is 1,2 GB

I really don't know what is happening

[triplets]

Have you ever used the Delete Unused and Project Clean Up functions?

[Frans Lemaire]

Yes , i do this regularly . And years aho , i detected that after vleaning , the paperbag of OSX should be cleaned to .

This all seems to not impact my too large file size

[triplets]

I save as Folder

 

What additional elements in the save window do you check the first time you do it?

 

So?

[fuzzfilth]

A couple of thoughts:

 

- I have had the issue of rapidly growing projects (without audio files, of course) for a while, years ago. It turned out to be a bug in Logic which created huuuge amounts of redundant automation points on top of each other, when moving lots of Regions with Automation, say, 500 at a time. This showed as steps of 10MB in the Undo history (which should only be like 10kB or so) and also in the project file growing rapidly, despite deleting the Undo history. This slowed everything down to a crawl and made editing/mixing almost impossible. Even just selecting a range of Automation points on one track could trigger the "Too much data, can't go on" message. It vanished from one Logic version to the next.

 

- There once was a version which didn't delete Undo steps correctly if the Undo history was filled up too quickly. Like, if you select 500 regions and hit "Nudge forward by one frame" quickly ten times in a row. All of these actions were available as Undos, however, not all were listed in Logic's "to be deleted once the Undo history exceeds x steps" list and thus were never deleted. This problem too ceased to exist a couple of versions later.

 

Did you ever look inside a Logic project from the Finder ? Right-click it and select "Show Package Contents". You will see the inside of the special type of folder that a Logic Project actually is. You will find three folders:

- Alternatives

- Media

- Resources

 

If you save as Folder (as opposed to as Package) there should be no audio files in Media.

 

In the Alternatives folder there should be one or more folders 000, 001,etc., containing the actual Alternatives you saved. Check their sizes.

 

Inside each 000, 001, there are several files/folders, with only three of interest here:

- Project File Backups (these are entire projects which get backed up every time you hit Save)

- ProjectData (this is like 1MB on a new, empty project, and can grow to 100MB with multiple Regions and much Automation going on)

- Undo Data.nosync (this contains any destructive edits in the Audio File Editor so they can be undone later)

 

Check this on the project you mentioned above and report where the big chunks of data hide.

[Atlas007]

A couple of thoughts:

 

- I have had the issue of rapidly growing projects (without audio files, of course) for a while, years ago. It turned out to be a bug in Logic which created huuuge amounts of redundant automation points on top of each other, when moving lots of Regions with Automation, say, 500 at a time. This showed as steps of 10MB in the Undo history (which should only be like 10kB or so) and also in the project file growing rapidly, despite deleting the Undo history. This slowed everything down to a crawl and made editing/mixing almost impossible. Even just selecting a range of Automation points on one track could trigger the "Too much data, can't go on" message. It vanished from one Logic version to the next.

 

- There once was a version which didn't delete Undo steps correctly if the Undo history was filled up too quickly. Like, if you select 500 regions and hit "Nudge forward by one frame" quickly ten times in a row. All of these actions were available as Undos, however, not all were listed in Logic's "to be deleted once the Undo history exceeds x steps" list and thus were never deleted. This problem too ceased to exist a couple of versions later.

 

Did you ever look inside a Logic project from the Finder ? Right-click it and select "Show Package Contents". You will see the inside of the special type of folder that a Logic Project actually is. You will find three folders:

- Alternatives

- Media

- Resources

 

If you save as Folder (as opposed to as Package) there should be no audio files in Media.

 

In the Alternatives folder there should be one or more folders 000, 001,etc., containing the actual Alternatives you saved. Check their sizes.

 

Inside each 000, 001, there are several files/folders, with only three of interest here:

- Project File Backups (these are entire projects which get backed up every time you hit Save)

- ProjectData (this is like 1MB on a new, empty project, and can grow to 100MB with multiple Regions and much Automation going on)

- Undo Data.nosync (this contains any destructive edits in the Audio File Editor so they can be undone later)

 

Check this on the project you mentioned above and report where the big chunks of data hide.

Thanx for your detailed and very informative reply. Really appreciated!

OTOH, you mention that problem had vanished in more recent versions... However, according to the OP signature, he runs a more recent version than the one in your signature...

[fuzzfilth]

Yes. As mentioned, that's just things coming to my mind which might be related or not. Still it would be interesting to know what exactly in the project file causes the inflation.

[Frans Lemaire]

Dear Atlas007 and FuzzFilth

Thx for all your recommendations. I will analyse them all with respect and appreciation. I have done today the next changes in my Logic Pro X and I could work as never before. I can't explain but it might be helpful :

 

After an new attempt to build up my file again , I changed in LPX and on my iMac the following issues

(1) LPX Preference , GENERAL, Project Handling, Auto Backup on " Last 3 alternative versions ", Recent items on " 5 "

(2) LPX Preference, Audio, Audio file Editor , Number of undo steps changed on " 3 "

 

Saved

In the problem project file in LPX I spend

(1) FILE , Project Management, Clean up

(2) and I did change from ' Package ' save to ' Folder ' save

Closed and saved my project

 

Result was that again the file was saved, took minutes long but was saved as a 1,2 GB file ...

 

I closed the LPX project and cleaned the trash on My iMac and I used CleanMyMac to make operational memory free (I have 16 GB and 6 GB was free)

Now I open the latest LPX project file and checked the save options

I deleted the option " include Apple Sound Library Content "

And I saved the project again

 

And guess .....

 

The files saved much faster and I looked into Finder :

 

The File, that runs on my LPX now completely correct with all regions, effects, ... really compete is .... 78,2 MB with Audio folder and Impules responses folder included

 

And all works fine .

[Frans Lemaire]

I had recently 2 projects with this problem .

So my last project is now OK ... although to be honnest I still don't undertstand.

I tried to do the same with my Previous corrupt file :

Created a new file and made the tracks and assigned MIDI and instruments etc .

I copy/pasted from the corrupted file the content into the new file . I cleaned all Project parameters , but it did not help until now. But I have a bounced version of that project with an almost finished mix ...

Edited July 4, 2020 by Frans Lemaire

[fusbur]

Guys we think perhaps he's saving all assets?

[triplets]

So my last project is now OK ... although to be honnest I still don't undertstand.

 

I asked you twice about what you're checking when saving and you never answered my question. That could have saved us some time.

And now we finally realize you're saving all the samples! No wonder your projects get that big.

ONLY check Audio Files and your projects will stay small.

[fusbur]

Guys we think perhaps he's saving all assets?

 

Yep.

[Frans Lemaire]

Guys we think perhaps he's saving all assets?

 

Yep.

 

Dear helpers,

The size of the Audio file is not relevant here with this problem. In the Problem folder and the Restored project folder the Audi folder file is exact the same.

It is the LogicProfile that is the Devil .

At the end what I changed is :

Save as a folder and not anymore as a package

Don't use the option " " include Apple Sound Library Content "

 

In theory saving all assets is not indicated in any Logic Pro help or documentation document as bad !

I am very thankful for your help but I don't understand the remarks " Guys we think perhaps he's saving all assets? " .

[triplets]

I don't understand the remarks " Guys we think perhaps he's saving all assets?

 

Because you're checking almost everything except Movie and Library Content.

[Frans Lemaire]

I don't understand the remarks " Guys we think perhaps he's saving all assets?

 

Because you're checking almost everything except Movie and Library Content.

 

I think i am completely lost : do you Recommend to click flag all the assets to save or not ?

[Frans Lemaire]

Since years i work with logic and i had only 2 recent cases with the problems in this ticket .

The answers or reactions i have here confuse me as i tried to give my answers . I am sorry if somewhere ingave bad information .

I read that i gave not the answers . ??

 

I saved many projects and had no problems .

Now that i had problems , I studied better the options and all remarks descri bed in this ticket .

 

The main difference in my recent work is that i use more Vst Like KONTAKT and ARTURIA V7 and Korg Legacy . And switched to save ‘ packages’ ,

I think i better swich back to save ‘ folders ‘

I will also save regularly with another name so that i can recover previous version ( although te ‘ revert to ‘ function should do this ? )

i just have due to the answers here a confusion about the save assets : should i click all ? In the past i did and had no problems ?

Edited July 5, 2020 by Frans Lemaire