JoshJ Posted February 22, 2022 Share Posted February 22, 2022 When I hit play/stop Logic is super laggy and slow to react. I do have quite a large project running but thought with the below settings/readings, latency shouldn’t be as much of an issue as it is?; Buffer: 256 CPU: 60% Drive usage Monitor: low I’m running a Mac mini M1 16GB ram. Focusrite 3rd Gen 4i4. Around 80 tracks. 5-10 plugs per track. Running iZotope Neuton plugins on most tracks (read iZotope might be the offenders but not sure) If the CPU meter is only at 60% and buffer at 256, why am I still experiencing latency and would getting a more powerful machine even fix the problem then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrayHill Posted February 22, 2022 Share Posted February 22, 2022 Do you have "Low Latency Monitoring Mode" enabled? On your toolbar: Record -> Low Latency Monitoring Mode This might fix the issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mania Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 Probably a third party plugin incompatibility? Have you tried running Logic under rosetta? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshJ Posted February 23, 2022 Author Share Posted February 23, 2022 Yes I’ve tried Low latency mode. It doesn’t resolve the issue. And yea I’m already running Logic in Rosetta. As I mentioned it feels like a laggy project due to high cpu usage but my CPU monitor is only showing around 60% Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzfilth Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 Three things come to mind: - 80 tracks times 8 plugins = 640 plugins. Imagine the scale of recording studio you'd need to hire if you asked for that in hardware, just to get a grip on what you're asking the computer to do. Just because you can pile up 16 plugins on every track does not mean you should. I have no idea about your mixing skills, but there's actually only two scenarios to think of. a) You're a seasoned pro and know exactly how and why every single plugin with it's exact setting got in the spot it is right now. But then you would not expect 640 plugins to run smoothly right away. b) You're a beginner and you're loading channel presets that have nice names like "Warm Vocal" on every track that may or may not need it. In the second case I'd seriously rethink the approach to 'mixing'. I write this in quotes because this isn't mixing, just like throwing a couple ingredients into a hot pot isn't cooking. Learn how to actually work the tools and you'll find that you easily get down to 3 plugins per track, if at all. I have no idea what's actually on the tracks so I'll shut up now. - Not an expert on this but if Rosetta is emulating an older environment just so older plugins can run at all, I'd assume the total load on the computer to be much higher than what Logic's CPU meter shows. Have you checked the native CPU meters in Utilities> System Activity ? - 3rd party plugins can be problematic in such a situation and especially iZotope plugins are notorious for high CPU load and high latency, depending on the type of processing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Nahmani Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 To add to Christian's remarks, you mention latency, which is an issue only during recording, and hundreds of plug-ins including Izotope neutron which leads to think of a mixing scenario. Perhaps you need to rethink your workflow and not use that many (or those) plug-ins during recording sessions, and integrate them only later in your workflow when you're in the mixing stages? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshJ Posted February 23, 2022 Author Share Posted February 23, 2022 I changed the "Process Buffer Range" to "Medium" (usually have set to "Large") and the amount of track playback that occurs after I hit pause was prolonged. Might it have something to do with this setting then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshJ Posted February 23, 2022 Author Share Posted February 23, 2022 integrate them only later in your workflow when you're in the mixing stages? Thanks David. I am not recording. I am in the mixing stage. The main issue with the project (and previous large projects as the project grows) is the general sluggishness of the software - in particular when hitting my spacebar for play/pause - the response of the software to play/pause is super slow. (Though also trying to record midi in this project would currency be a nightmare). Again, my CPU is reading below 50% so Im not sure why this is occurring at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzfilth Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 my CPU is reading below 50% so Im not sure why this is occurring at all. Quite possibly because of the three things I suggested ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Nahmani Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 Thanks David. I am not recording. I am in the mixing stage. Got it. I got sidetracked by your use of the word latency, which in DAW parlance is used to describe the delay between when you're playing/singing live and hearing yourself in your monitoring chain during recording tasks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JakobP Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 Have you tried removing the Neutron plugins to see if those are the culprit ? Also, latency and cpu load aren't related, really. A latent plugin is always latent, no matter how powerful mac you're using... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshJ Posted February 23, 2022 Author Share Posted February 23, 2022 (edited) Three things come to mind:a) You're a seasoned pro and know exactly how and why every single plugin with it's exact setting got in the spot it is right now. But then you would not expect 640 plugins to run smoothly right away. I've attached screenshots of my mixer. Not sure I'd consider this an overuse of plugins. But all necessary non the less. Basically has my mix chain on every track (vocals get some extra treatment). I've also attached screenshots of my Activity Monitor. It's roughly a 3 second delay between when I hit play/pause and playback actually responding. Mostly just Logic running and Wifi off. Edited February 23, 2022 by joshj Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshJ Posted February 23, 2022 Author Share Posted February 23, 2022 Have you tried removing the Neutron plugins to see if those are the culprit ? Also, latency and cpu load aren't related, really. A latent plugin is always latent, no matter how powerful mac you're using... Yes this is the next thing im going to try will report back.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triplets Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 Over 80 instances of Neutron/Nektar and you're complaining about sluggishness? All the Izotope stuff is taxing on the CPU. So no surprise there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JakobP Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 Yeah, and I believe the same goes for soothe2 and ozone... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshJ Posted February 24, 2022 Author Share Posted February 24, 2022 (edited) Over 80 instances of Neutron/Nektar and you're complaining about sluggishness?All the Izotope stuff is taxing on the CPU. So no surprise there. Neutron is just the Exciter plugin and Nectar just an instance of the de-esser. I don't understand though my CPU is at 40%. The project feels as sluggish as my old mac maxing out at 95% but this is a new machine. I was considering getting a more powerful mac but this doesn't seem to be a CPU issue. I'm wondering what spec machine could handle this size project. Edited February 24, 2022 by joshj Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xgman Posted February 24, 2022 Share Posted February 24, 2022 might try increasing your # of cores in settings if you haven't already. It does help the M1's. And how about using busses where you can, instead of the same plugin on so many tracks? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fuzzfilth Posted February 24, 2022 Share Posted February 24, 2022 Neutron is just the Exciter plugin and Nectar just an instance of the de-esser. I don't understand though my CPU is at 40%. As has been suggested numerous times, throw out the izotope stuff and see if that solves the issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Nahmani Posted February 24, 2022 Share Posted February 24, 2022 There isn't anything surprising or unexpected about the results you're getting, you're just trying to use more CPU power than you have available on your computer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshJ Posted February 24, 2022 Author Share Posted February 24, 2022 might try increasing your # of cores in settings if you haven't already. It does help the M1's. And how about using busses where you can, instead of the same plugin on so many tracks? Im already using all 8 cores Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshJ Posted February 24, 2022 Author Share Posted February 24, 2022 There isn't anything surprising or unexpected about the results you're getting, you're just trying to use more CPU power than you have available on your computer. Still not sure why Logic is saying saying I'm only using 40% CPU. Maybe i'm miss-understanding the relationship between Logics CPU meter and CPU usage in Activity Monitor? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JakobP Posted February 24, 2022 Share Posted February 24, 2022 I don't believe it's a cpu problem, rather a problem created by stacking several latent plugins serially... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoshJ Posted February 26, 2022 Author Share Posted February 26, 2022 I don't believe it's a cpu problem, rather a problem created by stacking several latent plugins serially... But the whole project is generally sluggish (copying tracks, moving regions etc). Not just playback. It “feels” like a cpu issue. Also, Low Latency Mode does not resolve this issue. So plug-in stacking couldn’t be the issue? Wondering is it the RAM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triplets Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 But the whole project is generally sluggish (copying tracks, moving regions etc). Not just playback. It “feels” like a cpu issue.Also, Low Latency Mode does not resolve this issue. So plug-in stacking couldn’t be the issue? Wondering is it the RAM Try the following: Make a copy of the project and remove all the izotope stuff (removing the plugin, not just turning it off) and report back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Nahmani Posted February 26, 2022 Share Posted February 26, 2022 I don't believe it's a cpu problem, rather a problem created by stacking several latent plugins serially... Apparently Josh was using the word latency to describe something that is not plug-in latency but interface sluggishness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeleN Posted March 1, 2022 Share Posted March 1, 2022 any „sidecared“ monitor/ipad ? any bluetooth gear ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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