Zuzusmooth Posted July 1, 2022 Share Posted July 1, 2022 The classic latency issue Running logic 10.7.4 on a brand new MacBook Pro (16gb RAM / M1 Chip) with a Scarlet 2i2 interface... Buffer 128 and still seem to have 12.2 ms roundtrip latency?!?! Every time I try to record a vocal with a little bit processing, theres just too much delay to make the performance possible so I rely on "Low Latency Mode" which just sucks... I've even set my buffer size down to 32 and still above 7 ms...? WHAT AM I MISSING>!>!> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darude Posted July 1, 2022 Share Posted July 1, 2022 I'm not sure I understand... It could of course always be better, but for vocal recording going thru a DAW 12 ms is not really that bad of a number? Having strictly no latency you probably need one of those audio interfaces that has a direct-thru (or whatever it's called) feature, so you can monitor in (or as close as possible to) true real time. Anyone else? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JakobP Posted July 1, 2022 Share Posted July 1, 2022 (edited) If LLM helps, then that means your latency comes from plugins, and that latency is way higher than the roundtrip latency reported by the 2i2. You can hoover your mouse over the plugins with the "little bit processing" to determine what plugin is the culprit... Edited July 1, 2022 by JakobP 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darude Posted July 1, 2022 Share Posted July 1, 2022 The above. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fisherking Posted July 1, 2022 Share Posted July 1, 2022 why not record your vocals without processing, monitor direct thru the scarlett... no latency. then add any processing once the vocals are recorded.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chatka Posted July 1, 2022 Share Posted July 1, 2022 4 hours ago, darudevil said: I'm not sure I understand... It could of course always be better, but for vocal recording going thru a DAW 12 ms is not really that bad of a number? Having strictly no latency you probably need one of those audio interfaces that has a direct-thru (or whatever it's called) feature, so you can monitor in (or as close as possible to) true real time. Anyone else? It´s called hardware monitoring. Not sure if Scarlet 2i2 has it? Some budget interfaces has it, for example Presonus 26 c and truly excellent MOTU M2. But I agree with you that 12 ms roundtrip latency is definitely not an issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chatka Posted July 1, 2022 Share Posted July 1, 2022 4 hours ago, Zuzusmooth said: The classic latency issue Running logic 10.7.4 on a brand new MacBook Pro (16gb RAM / M1 Chip) with a Scarlet 2i2 interface... Buffer 128 and still seem to have 12.2 ms roundtrip latency?!?! Every time I try to record a vocal with a little bit processing, theres just too much delay to make the performance possible so I rely on "Low Latency Mode" which just sucks... I've even set my buffer size down to 32 and still above 7 ms...? WHAT AM I MISSING>!>!> There must be something else wrong. 12 ms latency simply can´t cause your problem. With 128 buffer, 12. 2 ms roundtrip latency seems to me perfectly normal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darude Posted July 1, 2022 Share Posted July 1, 2022 1 hour ago, Chatka said: There must be something else wrong. 12 ms latency simply can´t cause your problem. With 128 buffer, 12. 2 ms roundtrip latency seems to me perfectly normal. I think it’s just whatever processing is on the channel(s) is causing the latency and is unavoidable with those plugins. Nature of DAW production workflow. Solutions are hardware monitoring with compatible audio interface (with or without low-latency processing on its DSP) or lighter plugs (temporarily for recording only, if processing is needed for singer’s comfort or confidence) or low-latency mode ie. dry recording to keep the latency as low as possible. I bounce an instrumental to be imported in a specific recording project where I have nothing else than maybe Channel EQ, Comp and some stock delay & verb, if the singer want a bit for vibes. Never had bad latency issues that way. Singers, even good ones can be off 50 or even 100 ms with their ‘t’, ‘k’ etc hard consonants, so 12 ms definitely is not the bottleneck here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zuzusmooth Posted July 2, 2022 Author Share Posted July 2, 2022 5 hours ago, darudevil said: I think it’s just whatever processing is on the channel(s) is causing the latency and is unavoidable with those plugins. Nature of DAW production workflow. Solutions are hardware monitoring with compatible audio interface (with or without low-latency processing on its DSP) or lighter plugs (temporarily for recording only, if processing is needed for singer’s comfort or confidence) or low-latency mode ie. dry recording to keep the latency as low as possible. I bounce an instrumental to be imported in a specific recording project where I have nothing else than maybe Channel EQ, Comp and some stock delay & verb, if the singer want a bit for vibes. Never had bad latency issues that way. Singers, even good ones can be off 50 or even 100 ms with their ‘t’, ‘k’ etc hard consonants, so 12 ms definitely is not the bottleneck here. Hey mate, Thanks for the input...I'm not fully against LLM or Direct Monitoring through my interface but I DO want some reverb and warmth on my vocal whilst tracking! Currently I'm using native Logic plugins & pre-sets on vocal channels and the latency is REALLY noticeable to the point I can't track vocals. LLM does solve the timing issue of the latency (which is only in the monitoring of the signal, the actual recording isn't late against the grid) but surely there MUST be a way to have some reverb on whilst tracking that doesn't cause my issue? Whats interesting to me is that this issue really only happens for me when tracking vocals with a mic...I don't have any issues with Guitars (Mic or Direct) so is it something in the Logic presets for Vocals potentially? Just seems really odd to me...I mean, in a true Professional studio running Logic, if a singer needs verb while tracking I can't imagine this issue comes up? Or maybe they use outboard gear to solve it? Any insight appreciated! Thank god I found this website! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zuzusmooth Posted July 2, 2022 Author Share Posted July 2, 2022 11 hours ago, fisherking said: why not record your vocals without processing, monitor direct thru the scarlett... no latency. then add any processing once the vocals are recorded.. Well the reason I don't enjoy recording that way is that the vocal has NO vibe whilst recording it! It's just dry and lame...not inspiring to listen to. Surely there must be a way with such powerful software and a brand new machine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zuzusmooth Posted July 2, 2022 Author Share Posted July 2, 2022 7 hours ago, Chatka said: It´s called hardware monitoring. Not sure if Scarlet 2i2 has it? Some budget interfaces has it, for example Presonus 26 c and truly excellent MOTU M2. But I agree with you that 12 ms roundtrip latency is definitely not an issue. Hi! The interface has "Direct Monitoring" but when using it, there is no reverb, warmth or vibe to the track. Sometimes I use delay or other effects to achieve the result I want so how could I record only the dry signal if the timing effect is required to hear during tracking? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triplets Posted July 2, 2022 Share Posted July 2, 2022 6 minutes ago, Zuzusmooth said: Currently I'm using native Logic plugins & pre-sets on vocal channels and the latency is REALLY noticeable to the point I can't track vocals. Do you have an Adaptive Limiter, Multipressor or Linear Phase EQ anywhere in the project? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zuzusmooth Posted July 2, 2022 Author Share Posted July 2, 2022 (edited) 2 minutes ago, triplets said: Do you have an Adaptive Limiter, Multipressor or Linear Phase EQ anywhere in the project? NOPE! When I select LLM, the things that get turned off are the Sends (which seems REALLY weird to me) And these sends are what gets set up automatically by Logic in the default set, so shouldn't be too tasking on machine>!? Edited July 2, 2022 by Zuzusmooth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zuzusmooth Posted July 2, 2022 Author Share Posted July 2, 2022 (edited) Also...was wondering if its my lack of understanding around the "Software Monitoring" (Green in control bar) & "Auto Input Monitor" (just to the right of Green button) Buttons in the control bar... Anyone have a good method for using these / understanding their function? I thought I understood but maybe I'm way off... Specifically the Software Monitoring...maybe thats causing my issue? I've mucked around with as many combinations of buttons as I can and still can't seem to find the solution without LLM or direct monitoring Edited July 2, 2022 by Zuzusmooth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mania Posted July 2, 2022 Share Posted July 2, 2022 I have an M1 Air and using the 2i2 just like you. I have 11.6ms latency but can not notice it while recording guitars or vocals. (The 2i2 has a DIRECT MONITORING switch by the way.) Try going into preferences and set the input/output to Macbook speakers and back to 2i2. Restart your computer, restart Logic. I had some cases where i used an adaptive limiter or other latency inducing plugins on the stereo out and even when removing them, the processing got stuck, like it's still there. 12ms latency should not be an issue. Try an empty new project? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redased Posted May 7 Share Posted May 7 Hello I have the same issue with a brand new Mac Mini M2 (16Go of RAM and ,512Go SSD) i have a very low CPU (Buffer size of 32) and still experience high latency when recording and when hearing myself with input monitoring i only have like 4 plugins (compression, EQ) and some sends (reverb, delay) it used to work perfectly fine but now I have latency. please can someone help? Did you find a solution already?? Thanks in advance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
des99 Posted May 7 Share Posted May 7 If you hit low latency mode, or remove (not bypass) those plugins, does the latency go away? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redased Posted May 7 Share Posted May 7 Yes it does in both cases But it doesnt go away when I just bypass them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
des99 Posted May 7 Share Posted May 7 Then it's caused by the plugins you are choosing to use, which require latency. Use low latency mode, or use different plugins that don't induce latency (or no plugins at all while tracking). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redased Posted May 7 Share Posted May 7 Ok thank you! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darude Posted May 7 Share Posted May 7 Like I said before, I most often bounce a “complex” project to instrumental audio, then open my vocal recording template project, import it there, set the bpm correct and set the stock delay and platinum verb for the singer, if they want it. I have an adjustable mix of separate instrumental, dry vocals & the wet send going to a little mixer in the booth, so the singer can set those to taste. No latency issues. I often comp in that project as well, and when done I import those comps via the project/channel strip import function either dry or with effects, if I took a liking to them. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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