Logic Pro 10.7.5 is out!

[David Nahmani]

What if you try that behavior in a new user account on your Mac? 

[rafesco]

30 minutes ago, David Nahmani said:

What if you try that behavior in a new user account on your Mac? 

I just tested it using Guest User and it behaves normally in there... welp. Now this is a bit concerning, I guess

[polanoid]

22 minutes ago, rafesco said:

I just tested it using Guest User and it behaves normally in there... welp. Now this is a bit concerning, I guess

Not concerning at all, this just means you have some preference set differently from the default that causes the behaviour you're seeing.

[polanoid]

58 minutes ago, rafesco said:

Link to video:

 

That looks like its happening upon stopping, not upon starting playback, so maybe you have "Stop and go to last locate position" enabled for the Stop button?

[David Nahmani]

35 minutes ago, rafesco said:

I just tested it using Guest User and it behaves normally in there... welp. Now this is a bit concerning, I guess

Either you've changed some settings as @polanoid said, or you have a corrupted preference file. You could always trash your preferences, however that would reset them all to the default factory preference file. 

The file to trash is ~/Library/Preferences/com.apple.logic10.plist

[polanoid]

or rather, ~/Library/Preferences/com.apple.logic10.plist

[David Nahmani]

Just now, polanoid said:

or rather, ~/Library/Preferences/com.apple.logic10.plist

Yes, that's what I said. 😜 

j/k I just corrected it. That's what I get for copy/pasting some older post. 

[polanoid]

10 minutes ago, David Nahmani said:

corrupted preference file

To me, the "corrupted preference file" is a myth... I have yet to come across a preferences file that is really corrupted. In my experience, every "strange" behaviour is caused by some particular preference (or "setting" as it is called nowadays 😉 ), it's only often not easy to find out which one. Prove me wrong 😉

 

Edited November 9, 2022 by polanoid

[David Nahmani]

Just now, polanoid said:

To me, the "corrupted preference file" is a myth.

It really isn't a myth. You should see how many times it's resolved an issue for me, my clients, or on this board alone. What happens is: 

1. When you open Logic Pro, the preferences are loaded in RAM. 
2. While Logic is open, anything you change under Logic Pro > Settings > ... is changed in the RAM copy of com.apple.logic10.plist. The com.apple.logic10.plist that is on your disk is unchanged.
3. When you quit Logic, first the RAM copy is used to rewrite the com.apple.logic10.plist file that is on your disk, then Logic quits. 

That's why the file can get corrupted quite easily, for example when Logic crashes during the quitting process, leaving a preference file on disk that is not fully rewritten. 

When any odd behavior having to do with Logic Pro settings that are written into that preference file occur, that don't happen in a fresh, new user account (that uses a fresh, new default preference file), and assuming the troubleshooter has double-checked that all settings/preferences were set as expected, then that often points to a corrupted preference file. 

[polanoid]

1 minute ago, David Nahmani said:

It really isn't a myth. You should see how many times it's resolved an issue for me, my clients, or on this board alone. What happens is: 

1. When you open Logic Pro, the preferences are loaded in RAM. 
2. While Logic is open, anything you change under Logic Pro > Settings > ... is changed in the RAM copy of com.apple.logic10.plist. The com.apple.logic10.plist that is on your disk is unchanged.
3. When you quit Logic, first the RAM copy is used to rewrite the com.apple.logic10.plist file that is on your disk, then Logic quits. 

That's why the file can get corrupted quite easily, for example when Logic crashes during the quitting process, leaving a preference file on disk that is not fully rewritten. 

When any odd behavior having to do with Logic Pro settings that are written into that preference file occur, that don't happen in a fresh, new user account (that uses a fresh, new default preference file), and assuming the troubleshooter has double-checked that all settings/preferences were set as expected, then that often points to a corrupted preference file. 

Please send me one of those corrupted preferences file once it happens to you (BTW this might be very off topic, so, maybe worth a separate thread?)

Edited November 9, 2022 by polanoid

[fisherking]

1 minute ago, polanoid said:

Please send me one of those corrupted preferences file once it happens to you

if you scan thru this forum, you'll see that deleting a corrupted preference file has fixed a lot of issues, for a lot of people. even apple will suggest this sometimes.

just saying, not sure why it would be a myth, when there's enough evidence to support that preference files can get corrupted (& this can happen for other apps too).

[David Nahmani]

Just now, fisherking said:

even apple will suggest this sometimes.

In fact this article, which suggests deleting your preference file, was written by Logic developers: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT200260

[polanoid]

4 minutes ago, fisherking said:

deleting a corrupted preference file has fixed a lot of issues, for a lot of people.

That doesn't prove the file was really corrupted. Could as well be what I wrote above (some pref that causes a certain behaviour, unexpected by the user). As I said, show me a corrupted prefs file and I'll rest my case (after all it's a plist so it can easily be checked e.g. in Xcode)

5 minutes ago, David Nahmani said:

In fact this article, which suggests deleting your preference file, was written by Logic developers: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT200260

That article does not state a prefs plist can get corrupted

[polanoid]

7 minutes ago, David Nahmani said:

was written by Logic developers

or by some poor support person who was getting tired of checking all possible combinations of preferences that may lead to a certain behaviour...

[David Nahmani]

1 minute ago, polanoid said:

That article does not state a prefs plist can get corrupted

That's because Apple does not like to state that things can get corrupted, or crash, etc... so they avoid using these words. They'll say things like "quit unexpectedly". But if the file wasn't corrupted, there would be no need to go through that much pain to describe to a user how to delete said file, they could simply choose Logic Pro > Settings > Reset All Settings Except Key Command Assignments. 

[polanoid]

1 minute ago, David Nahmani said:

But if the file wasn't corrupted, there would be no need to go through that much pain to describe to a user how to delete said file, they could simply choose Logic Pro > Settings > Reset All Settings Except Key Command Assignments. 

Maybe. Or maybe not.

[polanoid]

12 minutes ago, fisherking said:

there's enough evidence to support that preference files can get corrupted

If deleting the prefs fixes a particular issue a user has, it's not evidence that the prefs file was "corrupted", because, as I wrote above, it could also be that some preference (or, even worse to analyze, a combination of preferences) from a non-corrupted prefs file actually caused that behaviour.

[fisherking]

12 minutes ago, polanoid said:

If deleting the prefs fixes a particular issue a user has, it's not evidence that the prefs file was "corrupted", because, as I wrote above, it could also be that some preference (or, even worse to analyze, a combination of preferences) from a non-corrupted prefs file actually caused that behaviour.

not sure what you're point is, but if deleting a preference file fixes an issue, then that's evidence... that deleting a preference file fixed the issue. and other developers (adobe, in my case some years back, for example) will sometimes suggest deleting a preference file... that might be corrupted.

 

[polanoid]

8 minutes ago, fisherking said:

that's evidence... that deleting a preference file fixed the issue

Indeed. My claim is though that the issue can always be fixed by changing some particular setting (or maybe multiple settings) and is not caused by any sort of "corruption".

[fisherking]

8 minutes ago, polanoid said:

Indeed. My claim is though that the issue can always be fixed by changing some particular setting (or maybe multiple settings) and is not caused by any sort of "corruption".

but what is this statement based on? theory, assumption? or do you have something more concrete to base it on?

anyway, not meaning to argue. just curious, as many of us have seen our logic projects get corrupted, have fixed issues by deleting logic's preferences, and there's evidence this happens in other apps as well. if corruption can happen in a logic project, why is that not possible in a preferences file?

[analogika]

Are you saying that IN THIS CASE, it was a setting that had been changed, or are you saying that it's impossible that a preference file gets corrupted?

Software bugs happen, you know — and they have in the past been known to affect actual files on disk, including preference files. 

[polanoid]

29 minutes ago, analogika said:

Are you saying that IN THIS CASE, it was a setting that had been changed, or are you saying that it's impossible that a preference file gets corrupted?

Software bugs happen, you know — and they have in the past been known to affect actual files on disk, including preference files. 

I'd be curious to know how logic would even be able to open and read such a "corrupted" file. Keep in mind this is just a plist, i.e. a linear list of keys and values, with no relation between the individual entries. I totally fail to see how some kind of "corruption" could make its way into it without making it totally unreadable. But, as stated multiple times now, send a corrupted file and I'll stand corrected 8but also I will have learned something, namely how this can happen at all.

[des99]

I think people are using corruption in this context as a general term - ie, something funky is going on with your preferences which resetting them to known defaults can fix, rather than a specific file or data corruption/garbling issue has occurred (though it would include that, it it can happen).

So read corruption as a more general "something weird is happening" with app behaviour relating to the prefs file, rather than a specific reading of that term in one context.

If what you're getting at is "I don't think the file is corrupted on disk to become unreadable", I'd generally agree with that - it's not that likely to happen on a typical system, but it's not really what's being referred to in the use of the "trash your prefs" thing.

Edited November 9, 2022 by des99

[polanoid]

Nothing wrong with trashing your prefs because it's usually much easier than trying to find out which particular combination of settings causes your funky behaviour, but, as I said, you can learn much more about Logic's inner workings from trying to actually analyze the problem until you find the real reason

Edited November 9, 2022 by polanoid

[fisherking]

Just now, polanoid said:

Nothing wrong with trashing your prefs because it's usually much easier than trying to find out which particular combination of settings causes your funky behaviour, but, as I said, you can learn much more form trying to actually analyze the problem until you find the real reason

and, as it's been shown many times (check the adobe forums, for example) the real reason could very-well be a damaged preference file. why does this seem so impossible? any file on a computer can get corrupted, damaged....

[polanoid]

1 minute ago, fisherking said:

check the adobe forums

I don't know in which format Adobe store their preference files, so I don't think this is a valid conclusion.

[fisherking]

1 minute ago, polanoid said:

I don't know in which format Adobe store their preference files, so I don't think this is a valid conclusion.

not sure this conversation is happening on 2 threads now (this, and the one you started about this), but i responded there...

[des99]

Let's keep it (t)here (in the other thread), as I'm not sure the 10.7.5 update people are super fascinated about the definition of the word "corruption" as we are... 😝

Edited November 9, 2022 by des99
Fixed my not-keeping-track-properly-ness

[fisherking]

5 minutes ago, des99 said:

Let's keep it here, as I'm not sure the 10.7.5 update people are super fascinated about the definition of the word "corruption" as we are... 😝

uh, did you mean keep it 'there'??...

[polanoid]

Now I caused a bit of confusion... sorry about that!