Select Track via Midi-Controller buttons

[Fernando Galvão]

 

Dear:

 

 

am looking for a way to use the buttons of my Midi-Controller m audio oxygen pro 61 to select specific tracks(instruments) from buttons. I have a template session, where the track layout is always the same. f.e. Piano track#1... . It really would make my workflow faster. I couldn't find any solution so far. anyone? (Don't mean select NEXT track etc... .)

It would be: Button 1: track 1

Button 2: track 2

.....

Button 20: track 20

 

 

What I tried searching the internet:

Connect your MIDI controller to your computer and make sure it is properly configured and recognized by Logic Pro.

Open your project in Logic Pro.

Press the "X" key on the keyboard to open the "Mixer" window.

Select the track you want to control via MIDI controller.

Right-click on the track and select "Create New Smart Control Configuration" from the pop-up menu. This will open the "Smart Controls" window for that track.

Click the "Learn" button at the bottom of the "Smart Controls" window.

Press the button on the MIDI controller you want to assign track selection to. The button should flash to confirm it has been mapped correctly.

Save your project settings so they are retained for the next time you open Logic Pro.

 

it learns but nothing happens when clicking the buttons.

 

In ableton this is so simple... just click on midi (if using controller) or key if using the computer keyboard and that's it.

I already configured the boons as notes (I use this in Ableton), as program change but nothing happens.

 

 

 

 

[JakobP]

Unfortunately there's no easy way to do this in Logic, you would need to "hack" a control surface installation to make it work. The instructions you found makes no sense whatsoever, it's impossible to set up something like this using smart controls...

[Fernando Galvão]

I saw that it is easy to map fader, volume, pan and etc but the track is not. So how do keyboardists use logic on the live stage to change timbre quickly? use the mainstage?

[JakobP]

One way could be to switch midi channel on the keyboard, and either use a multi-timbral instrument, or have multiple tracks record armed listening to different channels, but there are several other ways to achieve this in Logic...

[des99]

1 hour ago, Fernando Galvão said:

So how do keyboardists use logic on the live stage to change timbre quickly? use the mainstage?

Yes - Logic isn't designed as a live performance tool. Mainstage is specifically designed for this - but as @JakobP says, there are other ways to achieve this in Logic that don't require changing the selected track.

Edited April 1 by des99

[gacki]

It's kinda possible using external tools like Keyboard Maestro. If you never have more than 20 tracks you simply have Keyboard Maestro press the "Arrow Up" key 20 times and afterwards the "Arrow down" key a number of times. It's not completely instant, though - but it works.

 

[gacki]

Another "hack" to speed the Keyboard Maestro macro up a bit: Put a track type you don't normally use (like a single MIDI track) at the top and use a key command to select that specific Track type (instead of having the macro press "Arrow up" 20 times); then press "Arrow down" as many times as you need.

(But in general I'm also in the Mainstage camp for this.)

[des99]

There are other ways you could do this in KM. For example, let's say you have 20 tracks with instruments you want to play. Give each track a unique icon in Logic, and learn those images into your KM script.

Now, when you want to play instrument 13, a KM macro can easily identify that icon position on screen, and select that track directly.

(Or you could just do something similar with unique track names, etc.)

Edited April 1 by des99

[Fernando Galvão]

15 hours ago, des99 said:

There are other ways you could do this in KM. For example, let's say you have 20 tracks with instruments you want to play. Give each track a unique icon in Logic, and learn those images into your KM script.

Now, when you want to play instrument 13, a KM macro can easily identify that icon position on screen, and select that track directly.

(Or you could just do something similar with unique track names, etc.)

As I'm new, can you show me where this km script is and how do I learn it by track name? each track has a unique name

[des99]

Your would need to make a macro to do this. It’s not difficult, but the exact script depends on your needs. You can always download the demo of KM and start working with it to see how KM works.

[gacki]

I attempted to do this with your "image" suggestion an it didn't work particularly well. Maybe some track icons work better than others.

I wonder if this could be done with a combination of AppleScript and KM?

 

[des99]

11 minutes ago, gacki said:

I attempted to do this with your "image" suggestion an it didn't work particularly well.

I do *extensive* macros involving image detection, and my experience tells me there would be no inherent problem doing this. You sometimes have to tweak the fuzz factor, but KM can show you whether it's matching the specified image or not, so you can easily tweak until your matches are reliable.

You would not need additional AppleScript to achieve this.

Anyway, this is just one approach, and probably what I would do. There are other approaches I'm sure.

Edited April 2 by des99

[redgreenblue]

 

This can be set up, but the secret is to use one of the Logic Control Surface presets and tailor your controller to it, not the other way around. this is the only remotely reliable way to do it.

 

That being said, there are a couple of reasons why you don't want to set this up for live work the way you are thinking. From Logic 10.7.5 and later if you select a track by a controller that track *stays armed* after you move off of the track. This is why I haven't move up beyond 10.7.4. 

 

Another reason is that the in/out ports of your Controller Surface will likely get mixed up at some point, and then it won’t work until to re-assign them. If you do set this up the way I said earlier it is easy enough to do but are you *really* going to remember that before a gig?

 

The solution I found is that change your Main arrangement to put the tracks/parts you want to play in sequential order and then just scroll down with button on your controller or a foot switch. This will mean redundant tracks in the arrangement, but who cares? Then all you have to do hit one button to get to the next part/track. If you set up up and down buttons you can then choose which part/track you want easily but for songs with a fixed arrangement my way is the most reliable and fool proof way.

 

I do have to disagree with some of the other commenters, Logic is a *great* live tool if you put the work in to it. MainStage is absolutely better for 99.9% of users, but for me Logic us *essential* to my live show, which is very live and has less playback than people realize.

 

[des99]

6 minutes ago, redgreenblue said:

I do have to disagree with some of the other commenters, Logic is a *great* live tool if you put the work in to it.

Note that I didn't say Logic can't be used as a live tool - I said Logic isn't *designed* to be a live tool. There's a difference! 😉

Peter Gabriel seems to do fine running his live shows from Logic too...

Edited April 2 by des99

[Fernando Galvão]

On 02/04/2023 at 12:49, redgreenblue said:

Isso pode ser configurado, mas o segredo é usar uma das predefinições da superfície de controle lógico e adaptar seu controlador a ela, e não o contrário. esta é a única maneira remotamente confiável de fazer isso.

Dito isto, há alguns motivos pelos quais você não deseja configurar isso para trabalhar ao vivo da maneira que está pensando. A partir do Logic 10.7.5 e posteriores, se você selecionar uma trilha por um controlador, essa trilha *permanecerá armada* depois que você sair da trilha. É por isso que não subi além de 10.7.4. 

Outro motivo é que as portas de entrada/saída da superfície do controlador provavelmente se misturarão em algum momento e não funcionarão até que sejam reatribuídas. Se você configurar isso da maneira que eu disse antes, é fácil de fazer, mas você *realmente* vai se lembrar disso antes de um show?

A solução que encontrei é mudar o arranjo principal para colocar as faixas/partes que você deseja tocar em ordem sequencial e depois rolar para baixo com o botão no controlador ou um pedal. Isso significará faixas redundantes no arranjo, mas quem se importa? Então tudo o que você precisa fazer é apertar um botão para ir para a próxima parte/faixa. Se você configurar os botões para cima e para baixo, poderá escolher facilmente qual parte / faixa deseja, mas para músicas com um arranjo fixo, meu método é o mais confiável e à prova de erros.

Eu tenho que discordar de alguns dos outros comentaristas, o Logic é uma ferramenta ao vivo *ótima* se você colocar o trabalho nisso. O MainStage é absolutamente melhor para 99,9% dos usuários, mas para mim o Logic é *essencial* para o meu show ao vivo, que é muito ao vivo e tem menos playback do que as pessoas imaginam.

I really see that for live it is more for releasing VS or playback.  changing tracks is not at all intuitive like in ableton, studio one and it seems to me that I really have to use logic to trigger vs and mainstage to change tracks via controller.  having to use two sotwares is a bit annoying

[redgreenblue]

You definitely do not want to have MainStage and Logic running at the same time. 

[Fernando Galvão]

8 minutes ago, redgreenblue said:

You definitely do not want to have MainStage and Logic running at the same time. 

I wanted to have only logic to have only one daw running and it would be Logic.

[des99]

On 4/2/2023 at 4:49 PM, redgreenblue said:

From Logic 10.7.5 and later if you select a track by a controller that track *stays armed* after you move off of the track

Could you explain a bit more what you mean by this?

I'd have to dig out some archives for 10.7.4 or earlier to check the differences in behaviour to >10.7.5...

[redgreenblue]

Sure. If I scroll through tracks with my controller each track is armed when I get to it and not when I scroll off of it. If I choose a track non-sequentially with my controller (I have the buttons on my SL61 programmed to behave like a Logic/Mackie control surface) that track stays armed if I then choose another track, when I play the keyboard both of them are now armed/in live mode. Total workflow killer for me. 
 

I would love to be wrong about this, if someone knows a no-input-work-around I’ll take it. 
The one that I have now is to program a ‘record off for all’ in Logic Remote. 

[des99]

7 minutes ago, redgreenblue said:

If I scroll through tracks with my controller each track is armed when I get to it and not when I scroll off of it. If I choose a track non-sequentially with my controller (I have the buttons on my SL61 programmed to behave like a Logic/Mackie control surface) that track stays armed if I then choose another track, when I play the keyboard both of them are now armed/in live mode. Total workflow killer for me. 

My real MCU's are packed away right now, and my little mixer controller is using HUI mode and I don't see that behaviour when I select non-sequential tracks. I have an XTouch One too which uses the MCU module, but you can only scroll up and down the tracks on that, rather than directly select a particular non-sequential track, so I can't directly do your procedure with that to check.

You're basically repurposing the MCU-installed controller assignments for track selection, I guess? (Ie, pretending your non-MCU controller is an MCU, and using it's buttons to send MCU track selection commands).

I'll have a look and see if I can replicate it (I'm not doubting what you say, I'm just interested in what's going on...)

[redgreenblue]

 

19 minutes ago, des99 said:

My real MCU's are packed away right now, and my little mixer controller is using HUI mode and I don't see that behaviour when I select non-sequential tracks. I have an XTouch One too which uses the MCU module, but you can only scroll up and down the tracks on that, rather than directly select a particular non-sequential track, so I can't directly do your procedure with that to check.

You're basically repurposing the MCU-installed controller assignments for track selection, I guess? (Ie, pretending your non-MCU controller is an MCU, and using it's buttons to send MCU track selection commands).

I'll have a look and see if I can replicate it (I'm not doubting what you say, I'm just interested in what's going on...)

Yes, that is what I'm doing, that was the only way I could see to have Bank Up/Bank Down buttons on my controller. (why oh why is this not available as a keyboard/Logic Remote command?!?!?!?!?!!?) My arrangements always have a ridiculous # of tracks and being able to bank up/down is essential for me. I want to reach for my mouse/trackpad as little as possible and do not want to have to manually disarm a track. 

Same issue as this thread
 

 

Edited April 4 by redgreenblue

[des99]

16 minutes ago, redgreenblue said:

that was the only way I could see to have Bank Up/Bank Down buttons on my controller. (why oh why is this not available as a keyboard/Logic Remote command?!?!?!?!?!!?) My arrangements always have a ridiculous # of tracks and being able to bank up/down is essential for me. 

It's because the fader bank value is a property of the control surface module - without a control surface defined, there is no fader bank property maintained (and hence no control surface bars in Logic to indicate the current set of tracks the fader bank covers etc).

It's these kinds of things why it's often preferable, as you mention, to repurpose an MCU for your own controller, to be able to get access to these kinds of features, than just manually learn assignments with a regular dumb MIDI controller.

As far as the live mode stuff in that thread (live mode is different to track arming, and yes, it's confusing!) -  I remember looking at it. This isn't anything to do with the MCU selecting tracks, it's Logic's current behaviour. I can reproduce those things just with mouse clicking, so it's not a controller selection, or MCU bug as such. To be honest, I'm not completely au fait with Logic's behaviour here in this regard. When it's funky, I just fix it, but I'm often switching tracks on my controller and it always just triggers the desired instrument for me for live playing - I don't have situations where I select a different track, and now I'm playing two instruments at once, at least, not that I can remember...

I'll have a little look into that thread again later and see if I can make sense of it...

Edited April 4 by des99

[redgreenblue]

1 minute ago, des99 said:

It's because the fader bank value is a property of the control surface module - without a control surface defined, there is no fader bank property maintained (and hence to control surface bars in Logic to indicate the current set of tracks the fader bank covers etc).

It's these kinds of things why it's often preferable, as you mention, to repurpose an MCU for your own controller, to be able to get access to these kinds of features, than just manually learn assignments with a regular dumb MIDI controller.

As far as the live mode stuff in that thread (live mode is different to track arming, and yes, it's confusing!) -  I remember looking at it. This isn't anything to do with the MCU selecting tracks, it's Logic's current behaviour. I can reproduce those things just with mouse clicking, so it's not a controller selection, or MCU bug as such. To be honest, I'm not completely au fait with Logic's behaviour here in this regard. When it's funky, I just fix it, but I'm often switching tracks on my controller and it always just triggers the desired instrument for me for live playing - I don't have situations where I select a different track, and now I'm playing two instruments at once, at least, not that I can remember...

I'll have a little look into that thread again later and see if I can make sense of it...

Re-reading that thread I see that it is unclear, but I think that the person who boldy states there is no problem is using a mouse to change tracks, that isn't what I'm talking about. My original post was this one, and again, the other user isn't trying to use a controller to choose the track.
 

 

[redgreenblue]

Quote

It's because the fader bank value is a property of the control surface module - without a control surface defined, there is no fader bank property maintained (and hence to control surface bars in Logic to indicate the current set of tracks the fader bank covers etc).

But the Logic Remote *is* a control surface!!! As such it should allow that for a command. 

[des99]

Ok, I see what you mean. I only ever select an instrument track, which implicitly arms the R button (full red). Selecting a different track, arms the new tracks R button, and deactivates the previous track. Simple, and consistent for me.

However, with one track selected and R armed, if I click the R button on a second track (not changing the track selectiong) - like in the animated gif in the thread link above, the second one arms, along with the first one - this is I believe desired behaviour, as you may well want to record arm multiple tracks with the record arm buttons.

So on your controller, you should target an instrument track for playback with the track select command, not the record enable command.

I'm in the middle of some things at the moment, I'll try to digest this stuff a bit later on, and fully read the linked threads and try to see what I can make of it.

5 minutes ago, redgreenblue said:

But the Logic Remote *is* a control surface!!! As such it should allow that for a command. 

Yes, that's different, and implemented differently. I don't really use it much - you can't bank up and down? Oh, I think like Logic, it just always displays all channels, which you can scroll through, therefore no bank up/down needed. Banking is only needed for controllers with a fixed set of physical controls that much be paged through to access more tracks than they otherwise could. Logic Remote is not in that category, it's not a physical control surface and doesn't have the same constraints, hence why it doesn't implement banking.

 

Edited April 4 by des99

[redgreenblue]

10 hours ago, des99 said:

Ok, I see what you mean. I only ever select an instrument track, which implicitly arms the R button (full red). Selecting a different track, arms the new tracks R button, and deactivates the previous track. Simple, and consistent for me.

However, with one track selected and R armed, if I click the R button on a second track (not changing the track selectiong) - like in the animated gif in the thread link above, the second one arms, along with the first one - this is I believe desired behaviour, as you may well want to record arm multiple tracks with the record arm buttons.

So on your controller, you should target an instrument track for playback with the track select command, not the record enable command.

I'm in the middle of some things at the moment, I'll try to digest this stuff a bit later on, and fully read the linked threads and try to see what I can make of it.

Yes, that's different, and implemented differently. I don't really use it much - you can't bank up and down? Oh, I think like Logic, it just always displays all channels, which you can scroll through, therefore no bank up/down needed. Banking is only needed for controllers with a fixed set of physical controls that much be paged through to access more tracks than they otherwise could. Logic Remote is not in that category, it's not a physical control surface and doesn't have the same constraints, hence why it doesn't implement banking.

I'm pretty sure I have it configured to 'select', not to record, it still happens. I have buttons setup for record/arm as well. It would be nice if there were an option to go back to the previous behavior.

[Fernando Galvão]

On 04/04/2023 at 22:32, redgreenblue said:

Tenho certeza que configurei para 'selecionar', não para gravar, ainda acontece. Também tenho botões configurados para gravar/armar. Seria bom se houvesse uma opção para voltar ao comportamento anterior.

really very complex to use logic for daw and live on stage.  you have to have the mainstage and even then, ableton you make everything very simple.  thank you all.

[redgreenblue]

Yes, the setup is more complicated than applications that are geared for live work. MainStage is a great option for most people and countless touring acts (big ones!) and broadway pits rely on it every single day. Ableton is great too, my brain doesn't like its workflow but that is a preference thing, as an application it is a great tool. My live needs are unique and I've spent a lot of time setting up Logic to work for me. If someone isn't as interested in getting deep in the weeds of the Environment, Logic is not the natural choice.