advice for firewire hard drive

[gglendon]

Looking to increase my disc storage via an external firewire drive. Possibly the 250 gig lacie d2. My internal drive has a paltry 30 gigs.

 

Has anyone used this drive? I am wondering if it will be fast enough to be used as the primary disc for the media in Logic.

 

Would like to save all loops, projects, files, etc. on this drive. I believe the software has to remain on the computers internal hard drive.

 

Any comments appreciated.

 

Thanks,

 

Gord

[jazzman88]

Hello,

 

I just recently purchased a Power Mac G5 2.0 dual processor and I have the LaCie 250 Gig firewire drive. I store all my samples on it and it works really great.

 

This drive has a triple interface-it can be hooked up through firewire 400, firewire 800 and usb. I have it hooked up through firewire 800 and again it's really great.

 

Hope this helps you out.

 

Cheers,

 

Norm

[gglendon]

Very helpful thanks.

 

A couple of questions from a newbie if you don't mind.

 

Can I save my song related files on the drive as well? Specifically the entire "project" files or do these need to be located on the same drive as the application files.

 

Thanks a bunch,

 

Gord

[jazzman88]

Hi Gord,

 

You can save your song files to the external drive too...also if you decide to save the "project" i.e. samples, ir's, etc...you can save the whole project to the external drive.

 

These drives are very handy and if you end up working with somebody else with a logic setup..you can just bring your drive with you with all your work on it and plug into their system and continue working on your song.

 

Cheers,

 

Norm

[David Nahmani]

Yes, definitely save the whole projects (logic sessions and all related files - audio, samples, reverb IR, settings...) in one place, like your external firewire drive for example.

 

However, you might be able to have a better system if you simply install a 2nd internal drive. What computer are you using and do you just have the single 30g drive inside?

 

Then you could use the firewire drive for both backup and transportation to other studios.

 

One last question: why not make your own firewire drive? Are you a little tech savvy? You could save yourself some money.

[Mr Bean]

I have a G4 Powerbook and use the 150GB La Cie ext. drive without any problem BUT you mentioned Apple Loops.

 

I have 1000's of 3rd party Apple Loops saved on the external drive but the Garageband Jam Packs won't for some reason. I tried but got a pop up message saying that the loops must be located on the same drive as the application.

 

Unless, of course, there's a smart way of doing it that goes beyond a novice like me

[gglendon]

Thanks for the tips.

 

My computer is a dual g4 450 power mac. I only have 512 mb of ram. Will be adding more to make up 1228 mb this weekend. It is presently running logic surpisingly well. I have to be careful with the number of effects and total instruments but I actually think it runs smoother than garageband.

 

I 'll bite. How do I create my own fire wire drive?????

[pantomimeHorse]

why not make your own firewire drive? Are you a little tech savvy? You could save yourself some money.

 

Don't forget the 5/95 % rule with audio drives - It makes a big speed difference. Format in 2 partitions, the top one 5% of drive capacity, the bottom one the rest. Only use the 5% one for your audio streaming.

 

[David Nahmani]

How do I create my own fire wire drive?????

 

Just buy a Firewire enclosure, something like this:

 

http://www.xpcgear.com/52535usfirco.html

 

And then buy the drive you want, place it in there, voila!

[pantomimeHorse]

Alternative is:

 

http://www.analogic.co.uk

 

who do some nice enclosures. We have several of theirs and they're cool.

 

A Maxtor IDE 160GB drive is now so cheap as to be unbelievable. The last one we bought here cost only €90, about $102 ! ! !

 

Firewire enclosures for SATA drives are still harder to find and the speed benefits are negligible anyway. Don't forget 5/95 rule (I know I sound like an old worn-out record here, but it really *does* make a difference !)

 

[gglendon]

This is really helpful.

 

Not to sound like a dunce but I am not sure I fully grasp the 5/95 rule. I think I understand partitioning as dedicating a specific area of your drive to specific elements such as Logic or photos or video as an example. I think this is so that the drive has less physical space to traverse while working on like munded tasks. Is this right?

 

So please feel free to be a "worn ut record" since this is a new concept to me. For instance are you talking about application files/audio ratio?

 

Thanks in advance.

 

Gord

[pantomimeHorse]

I'll go through this mantra again, because it's vitally important to anyone who runs external (or internal) drives, and whose studio may be approaching the theoretical limit for streaming audio files in Logic (or any other sequencer app):

 

When you use the Disk Utility to create partitions on a new (or old) drive, there is a partition map. If you split the drive into two partitions (volumes), the one at the top of the map is written (formatted) on the outside tracks of each drive platter. The one underneath then occupies tracks that are closer to the centre of the drive.

 

The spin speed of the drive (7200 rpm if it's a decent one) remains constant during read/write operations. Therefore, closer to the periphery of the drive platter, there are a greater number of 256byte sectors passing under the drive heads per second, which equates to a faster data transfer rate.

 

If you have audio files on the outer part of the drive platter(s), they will be streamed quicker than if they were towards the centre of the drive. The difference is staggering - up to 80% improvement in some cases, compared with a single partition.

 

It means that you can reduce disc I/O buffer sizes accordingly, and reduce latency in your system, while maintaining unbroken audio streams (no crackles and pops etc etc )

 

The rule is simple: If you have, say, a 160GB drive, make the top partition only about 8GB and the bottom one for the rest. Only put the audio for your current project on the 8GB partition, along with the song file and any smples etc.

 

When you have finished the project for the day, move the entire shebang to the other partition as an archive. Wipe the 5% (8GB) partition clean using Disk Utility or TechTool, then move your next project onto it for work.

 

There will be almost zero fragmentation of your files and you will see the improvements immediately (to quote the Olay skin cream adverts)

 

8)

[Matchless]

Interesting read. I partitioned a drive into 5 different regions. Is that a bad thing?

I did it only because someone told me that's the way to do it.???

[gglendon]

pantomimehorse.

 

great advice.

 

thanks a bunch.

 

gord

[pantomimeHorse]

pantomimehorse.

great advice.

thanks a bunch.

gord

 

Glad to be of help, gord.

8)

[pantomimeHorse]

Interesting read. I partitioned a drive into 5 different regions. Is that a bad thing?

I did it only because someone told me that's the way to do it.???

 

Hi, Match. Not been in here lately because of gigs and practices

 

5 partitions is a bit *overkill*, don't you think ? ? ? ?

 

...... unless you need them for specific reasons, of course.

I can't tell from your setup summary. Have you only the one drive ?

[Eric Cardenas]

Nice and really clever stuff

How much do you gain in doing it this way? is it > or >than a 2:1 ratio

[pantomimeHorse]

Nice and really clever stuff

 

Well, thank you, sir !

 

How much do you gain in doing it this way?

 

You gain an awful lot in terms of streaming speed. We would not run a drive

here without this treatment, now. Disk access (seek) time is usually the critical

factor in determining how many tracks you can run in Logic.

 

8)

[Tuface]

So can I assume this method would be most beneficial in video editing as well?

[Eric Cardenas]

So can I assume this method would be most beneficial in video editing as well?

 

Should be the same but I think you'll have to have more of a 75/25 relationship between the partitions! Or you will otherwise get short on GB

[GORILLA]

pantomimeHorse, thanks for that 5/95 tip!!!!!

[pantomimeHorse]

So can I assume this method would be most beneficial in video editing as well?

 

Yes. Quite so.

 

But you will need a 250GB drive or better. The fast access partition MUST be kept

as small as possible with relation to the overall drive size. Eric's 75/25 theory

won't work because you are then forcing the partition map to look at cylinders

closer to the slower-moving segment of the surface.

 

Usually, in video, you're not wanting to stream a large sequence for RT effects

and so forth. Video is, in fact, far less demanding on the Mac than audio work.

How many video editors do you know who want to record from 3 live cams

while playing back twelve recorded layers, each with several filters on ........ ! !

 

8)

[Eric Cardenas]

... Eric's 75/25 theory

won't work because you are then forcing the partition map to look at cylinders

closer to the slower-moving segment of the surface....

 

It was a nice theory thou