Setting up a TDM system (by Audacity Works)

[David Nahmani]

Thanks to Audacity Works for this tip of the week:

 

SETTING UP YOUR NEW LOGIC TDM RIG

Apple supplies a TDM Guide with every copy of Logic Pro 7, which is greatly appreciated. It's crucial reading for anyone wishing to dive into a hybrid Digidesign DSP/native Logic solution. Unfortunately, it doesn't provide step-by-step instructions on how to set everything up, especially when dealing with ESB, HTDM, Epic TDM, and a multiple audio engine environment. In fact, I'm not aware of step-by-step instructions anywhere, so... here it is.

 

There's actually a Logic TDM environment included on the second installation DVD. You can either start with that, or build it from scratch yourself by reading on...

BEFORE YOU START

• This is important: INSTALL YOUR DIGIDESIGN HARDWARE AND SOFTWARE FIRST. Even if you have no intention of using the ProTools app, it still needs to be in your computer. Carefully follow the installation guides which came with your ProTools|HD or ProTools MIX system. The following instructions assume your Digidesign hardware setup and I/O configuration has already been taken care of. It's also a good idea to run DigiTest (~/Applications/Digidesign/ProTools/ProTools Utilites) to ensure everything is working properly.

 

• Go ahead and install Logic Pro 7.

 

• Open Logic and you should see the default template song. Under the Audio menu, select "Audio Hardware & Drivers".

 

• Click on the Core Audio tab. UNcheck "Enabled". Click on the DAE tab. Check "Enabled". Logic TDM won't let you use multiple bit rates simultaneously, so select your global bit depth. Figure out how many tracks you plan on recording. Let's say we never record more than 48, so we'll select "48 Tracks (1 DSP)" or "48 Tracks (3 DSPs)" depending on how hard you want to push your HD or MIX cards.

 

• Click on the Direct TDM tab. Check "Enabled". Make sure "Universal Track Mode" is checked. Close the preferences window.

 

You've now told Logic which two engines you want access to (DAE and Direct TDM). Note that while you certainly could run Core Audio simultaneously with a third-party interface (or your Mac's built-in I/O), it's not recommended, and indeed, isn't really necessary, unless you want to be a show-off.

 

 

BUILDING YOUR LOGIC TDM ENVIRONMENT

• Open your audio environment (double-click on an audio track in Logic's arrange window or press 3). Resize this window to fill up the entire screen. Logic probably built you 32 Audio objects (tracks), a handful of Aux objects, sixteen busses, a Master fader, and as many output objects as you configured in ProTools' I/O Setup.

 

• Select all these objects (COMMAND-A) and in the object parameter box (left side of the window), under "Device", select "DAE". Your cursor should briefly turn into a little TDM icon, indicating that Logic's successfully communicating with the DAE engine.

 

• The easiest way to make more tracks (we want 48, remember?) is to copy and paste existing Audio objects. Select faders 17 through 32, press COMMAND-C, and then COMMAND-V. When asked whether to replace existing selection, click "no". It looks like nothing happened, but Logic actually pasted sixteen new audio objects directly on top of the old ones. Without deselecting, move these new objects off to the right and place them directly behind Audio objects 1-32.

 

• Without deselecting, rename the first new object "Audio33". All your new objects should now be sequentially named/numbered.

 

• Even though they're named correctly, you still have to assign them to the correct tracks. Unless there's a new shortcut I'm unaware of, this is done manually, track by track. Select Audio object 33, and in the object parameter box, under "Channel", select "Track 33". Repeat this procedure for each of the new sixteen audio objects.

 

You now have 48 tracks with which to inflict audio chaos upon the masses. Next we need to build some objects for our native softsynths.

 

• Select any sixteen Audio objects, copy/paste them, and move the new objects below Audio object 1. You may need to change your screen's resolution to see two rows of faders— Mine's set to 1280 x 1084. Otherwise, plan on scrolling left and right a lot.

 

• Without deselecting, in the object parameter box, under "Device", select "DTDM". The objects are now subject to your computer's native processing.

 

• Without deselecting, name the first new object "Instrument1". This should sequentially name/number all your currently selected objects.

 

• Select the first new object, named "Instrument1". In the object parameter box, under "Channel", select "Instrument 1". For "Instrument2", select "Instrument 2", etc. Follow this procedure for all sixteen Audio Instrument objects.

 

• Click and hold the input box on any of these objects. You should see a list of all available softsynths. Click and hold the output box. Under "output", you should see four options: "ESB 1-2", "ESB 3-4", ESB 5-6", and "ESB 7-8". These are bridges spanning the native and TDM realms. Assign them all to ESB 1-2 or you can sequentially assign them, so Audio Instrument 1, 5, 9, and 13 go to ESB 1-2; 2, 6, 10, and 14 go to ESB 3-4; etc. This way, if you're only going to use four synths in a particular song, each one gets its own stereo bus. Before we can hear these objects, however, we need to build the other side of the bridge.

 

• Select any eight DAE Audio objects, copy/paste them, and move the new objects down, just to the right of your new Audio Instrument objects. Leave a space so you can keep them separate.

 

• Without deselecting, name the first new object "Aux 1". This should sequentially name/number all your currently selected objects.

 

• Because 95% of the time, your synths will be in stereo (and since most third-party synths ONLY instanciate as stereo), we'll go ahead and turn these eight mono objects into four stereo objects by clicking the little button under Aux 1, 3, 5, and 7's meters.

 

• In the object parameter box, under "Channel", assign Aux 1 to "AuxStereo 1-2", Aux 3 to "AuxStereo 3-4", etc.

 

• Assign the input of Aux 1 to "ESB 1-2", the input of Aux 3 to "ESB 3-4", etc.

 

Essentially, what you've done is built a native mixer INSIDE the DAE mixer. Each Audio Instrument object (softsynth) is routed out any of four stereo busses into the DAE mixer via ESB. It's mighty flexible, though for those of us who mix outside the box and would like dedicated outputs for more than four stereo synths, eight stereo ESB busses would've been ideal.

 

Note that DTDM objects don't have to be Audio Instrument objects. They can also be audio tracks, auxes, or busses, so your native mixer could potentially be much more elaborate. Plus, they can utilize Audio Unit plugins or if you implement the FXpansion wrapper, VST plugs.

 

What's nice is that DTDM tracks/synths can be processed natively and then when bussed via ESB to a DAE Aux, be further manipulated by TDM plugs. It's the best of both worlds.

EVEN MORE FLEXIBILITY

If you're one of the lucky few to own Epic TDM and the HTDM Enabler (now discontinued), you can run many of Logic's plugins and softsynths on the TDM engine instead of Direct TDM, opening up even more native horsepower. This is also how TDM-based synths, such as the Virus Indigo, McDSP S1, and Apple's own EXS24 TDM are utilized. In fact, if you only plan on using EXS24, you could probably get away with not enabling DTDM at all.

 

Setting up TDM synths is completely different than in the above example, however.

 

• Simply out of convenience, I like to put my TDM synths down by my DTDM Audio Instrument (native synth) objects, so all my synths' faders are together. So let's move our bottom row of objects over and build (copy/paste/change name and assignment) a stereo DAE Aux object to the left of them.

 

• Unlike the Audio Instrument objects, where synths are assigned via the object's input, TDM synths are pulled up as an insert. In this case, let's load up an instance of Virus Indigo.

 

• Now the only way to trigger the Indigo is if our MIDI environment sees it. So let's open our MIDI environment (in the Arrange, hold down CONTROL and double-click a MIDI track), and under the "New" menu, select "Instrument". A little keyboard icon should appear. In the MIDI object parameter box (left-hand side of the window), under "Port", you should see "Indigo 1a". Select it. Name the object "Indigo". Close the environment window.

 

• In the Arrange, click-hold a track, and under "MIDI Instruments", "Indigo" should show up. Select it, and play away!

 

Because it's kind of a pain to do this every time one wants to trigger a TDM softsynth, I've simply left two TDM Indigos and a couple of ESX24 TDMs open in my Autoload.

 

Now you're ready to make tracks with almost TOO much power at your fingertips.

Edited March 2, 2010 by David Nahmani

[ns10]

Hi!

Why is it important that the DTDM tracks are in universal trackmode?

I have a G5 2.5Mhz watercooled 3GB mem, that crashes a lot. I use both DAE and DTDM, but i have not enabled universal trackmode. Can that cause problem?

/ Johan

[mactechla]

Hi!

Why is it important that the DTDM tracks are in universal trackmode?

I have a G5 2.5Mhz watercooled 3GB mem, that crashes a lot. I use both DAE and DTDM, but i have not enabled universal trackmode. Can that cause problem?

/ Johan

 

Universal Track Mode allows you to use stereo interleaved files. Stereo DAE audio tracks can only play back split files. You don't necessarily have to enable Universal Track Mode on the DTDM engine, but it's better to enable it when using AppleLoops on stereo DTDM audio objects. AppleLoops can only be played back from the DTDM audio engine when using DAE.

 

In regards to your Logic system crashing under DAE, your experience is fairly normal. Older TDM system were more stable than HD based systems, but they will both crash. It is a very complex integration, and both Logic and Digital Performer have stability issues when used as a front end for a TDM or HD system.

 

Some users have had improved stability using Logic, DAE and CoreAudio (not DTDM). Then they'll use additinal coreaudio hardware with ADAT I/O to send 8 channels from the native side into the TDM/HD hardware. It's like having a hardware ESB. And even this configuration will still crash.

[Aussie Mick]

Thanks David I have read your artical on the TDM Rig.

 

I am woulding if you can help me build the best configuration for my TDM rig using what equipemnt I have in my system.

 

I am running ProTools HD2 6.9 and Logic 7.1.

My Hardware is 1 x HD192 and 1 x HD96 interfaces.

I am using 16 in's and 16 out's analogue from the 2 boxers going to a 24 track inline mixing console. I also have a M-Audio 1814 Firewire interface if needed.

I am doing a lot of multi-track work.

My Computer is a Mac G5 2Gb Daul with 6Gb Ram, 2 x Hard Drives, OSX 10.4.3

 

If you need more information don't hesitate to contact me.

 

Many Tanks.

 

Aussie Mick

[Audacity Works]

I am woulding if you can help me build the best configuration for my TDM rig using what equipemnt I have in my system.

Your system should work just fine. Just remember to install and set up your ProTools rig first. As for configuring things, the walkthrough above attempts to do just that. What is it missing?

[David Nahmani]

Hey Audacity Works, now that we have file sharing, would you upload your Logic TDM template to the template section? I looked on the install DVD but couldn't find the TDM template you mentioned.

 

It would be helpful to be able to see the template while reading your instructions...

 

Thanks!

[miamimusicman]

Great Post! I got an HD Accel Rig a few months back and was actully considering selling it just cuz i can't stand Pro Tools software after using logic for the last 6 years.

 

Several weeks ago I started to use the system within logic as listed in this thread....(sure wish i seen this thread then) and i must say it is amazing. I only truly hope Apple & Digi get this gear working a bit better.....also the McDSP & Waves SSL GUI are both buggy....Yes Logic crashes way more than it used to.......Hope to see these bugs get fixed.........Whats up with no Stereo TDM tracks? thats such BS......RTAS Please give us RTAS!

[Doc Jerome]

I have a 2GHz Dual processor G5 running Logic 7.2.3 and PT HD Accel 3. I recently bought the digidesign Expansion|HD chassis only to find out that ESB is not supported in this type of configuration. Why not? Will it be in the near future?

 

I am currently running Logic using Core Audio; neither DAE or Direct TDM are enabled, but I can still use digi's 192 I/O to run Logic through, just without all of the benefits of TDM.

[dkgross]

out of curiosity (from another post), I decided to read this.

 

my brain just blew up.

 

[statique]

post relocated

[tigermaster]

• Click on the Direct TDM tab. Check "Enabled". Make sure "Universal Track Mode" is checked. Close the preferences window.

 

i personally use universal track mode off, it's more flexible with routing and lets me move audio track from dae to dtdm and viceversa easily.

 

TDM situation in logic and integration with NON tdm softwares and plug-ins is going worst every update tbh, in OS9 we had ESB and direct connect, so we route lot of stuff inside tdm using DC and stand-alone, was not the best tbh, but better than nothing.

In OSX they have removed DC, so only 8 mono out to route from all the native stuff and just a few stuff running in HTDM, WHY ONLY 8 ESB. WHYYYYYY , i'm working native a lot, and having only 8 esb it's a pain in the arse.

Now with PT7, that is required for latest logic they have removed HTDM aswell, THANK YOU!! now we have only that crappy 8 ESB outs.

And what about INS ? why i cannot go from digidesign to native! also lot of old HDTM plug-in has been moved to RTAS2 format, so you cannot use them anymore in TDM unless you use pro-tools.

 

Logic should support rtas plug-ins if you have a TDM hardware, that would be the solution, i don't mean support for all users, i mean support only for pro-tools hd users.

 

In the meantime i have just spent 600€, i've got an old adat bridge and an old motu2408mk1, it has 2 adat out, i want to try enabling core audio and route to tdm using adats, i want to keep also ESB opened so i will have 24 outs to TDM and 16 IN from TDM, i'll get all the stuff next week and i'll try, i'm trying to save my TDM hardware, it's becaming unused.

I'll let you know if everything works as expected, i have also to manage some latencies, hope everything works fine and sample accurate as before!!

 

the latest tracks i've done are 90% native, i use ESB as premasters, esb1-2 to TDM master out and dry, esb 3-4 to premaster with TDM sidechain compressor, esb 5-6 has reverb, and 7-8 there is the main synth with his own plugs.... a couple of exstdm and a couple of audio track tdm, that's all, this is not how i want to use tdm.

 

Also i don't want to use pt, i don't like it, the other solution is abandon TDM and stay native, but if i stay native i don't know if i keep staying on MAC, time to learn Cubase?

 

I'm so sure that enabling 32 ESB out instead of 8 is a matter of minutes, i'm SO SURE, the question is why they keep it so crap with only 8 outs.

 

I know also that esb and exs24 are shared, the total is 32, if you use 8 esb you should insert a maximum of 24 mono EXS or 12 Stereo, why they don't just give us the option to get more ESB and less EXS ? it's years i ask that but they really don't care about tdm users, we are too few.

 

bb.

[tigermaster]

[Hi!

Why is it important that the DTDM tracks are in universal trackmode?

I have a G5 2.5Mhz watercooled 3GB mem, that crashes a lot. I use both DAE and DTDM, but i have not enabled universal trackmode. Can that cause problem?

/ Johan

 

many,many,many,many crashes in the past, from Logic 6 pro to logic 7.2? or 7.1? can't remember, anyway they have fixed most of that crashes, it has crashed so many times that i recognize it was about to crash before it crashes lol, now instead of crash it reloads your dtdm, dunno if you have notices that, i see it cause i see kontakt2 reloading its samples, on older version that was a crash.

[XIONG]

The older version I have tolerance for a very long time, I just want to say that I am about to give up.

[tigermaster]

even now with 8.0.1 i have major issues with NI kontakt 3

Also sometimes i still have the old fashion crash when doing stuff in arrange, int this case it saves the (crashed) song, but when it crashes because of a plug-in it doesn't save at all..

i've lost my work 3 times this week, lot of hours trashed for redoing the stuff again...

[minddead]

Any chance this could be updated for Logic Pro 8.0.2, or is that unnecessary?

[Gregorious]

Yes could we get an updated version for 8.02 ???

[120bpm]

Yes could we get an updated version for 8.02 ???

 

+1

[fader8]

You should have all the info needed between what's written here and:

[sunbiz]

I've just upgraded to Logic Studio 9 from Logic Studio 8

 

My issue:

 

Now my Digi TDM synth Indigo does not work properly.

 

I can insert the plug in the channel strip but I get no sound outputting from it.

 

When I insert an instance of the TDM ESX 24 on the same channel strip, no problem.

 

In my previous Environment under Logic Studio 8 - the Indigo works properly (using the Audacity Works guide for setting up a TDM environment)

 

I have tried creating new instruments on the Midi Environment page from scratch and routing them to the appropriate channel as indicated in this fourm

 

"• Now the only way to trigger the Indigo is if our MIDI environment sees it. So let's open our MIDI environment (in the Arrange, hold down CONTROL and double-click a MIDI track), and under the "New" menu, select "Instrument". A little keyboard icon should appear. In the MIDI object parameter box (left-hand side of the window), under "Port", you should see "Indigo 1a". Select it. Name the object "Indigo". Close the environment window. "

 

But currently this method is unsuccessful for me.

 

Makes no sense why the TDM ESX 24 will will work but not the Indigo ?

 

I've checked the Environment page and nothings is different (that I can see...)

 

Any advice ? Thanks in advance.

 

 

System Specs:

 

Mac Pro ( Quad Core Intel Xeon / OS 10.5.8 / RAM 4 Gigs DDR2 )

Protools 8.0.1 (HD 2)

Digi 96 i/o

Digi C/24 control surface

Logic Studio 8 & 9