Hardware Channel Strip? > REWORDED

[trebor99]

Major Reword/Edit to the original:

 

Ok.. I like this forum a lot.. and I know many of you here are very knowledgeable about subjects that I want and need to learn about.. @LPH I've been mostly a student and occasionally a teacher/helper.. so I want to tackle my question again but from a different angle.. but first let me ask a basic question:

• 1. when you have an audio interface that has pretty decent preamps like my MH can you benefit from using a hardware preamp before the interface for your instruments and mics? (when talking about the hardware preamp I'm referring to a good one like the UA 610)
  2. if the answer to 1. is yes then can you recommend one or two based on your experience? (of course let's include Hardware Channel Strips in the discussion too)
  3. is pre into pre overkill (like a 610 into the MH pres)? and if yes should you try to avoid it by bypassing (somehow) the pre built into the audio interface.

 

sorry about my whine-post below.. hopefully this is a better way for me to get your input.. I know your valuable help is out there.

 

Cheers and HNY!

Bobby

[redlogic]

Although not related to you question...

 

...for guitar parts I typically run my guitar through a Line 6 TonePort DI then into my Metric Halo Mobile I/O ULN2 +DSP interface.

Since the Mobile I/O has controls for instrument (guitar) input, why do you use the TonePort DI in the chain?

 

I track the dry guitar signal into Logic and insert an amp sim plugin afterwards.

 

Do you know that you can record the dry guitar signal into Logic while hearing the amp sim sound? I couldn't imagine trying to "get a vibe going" with just the DI guitar sound...unless it was a clean strat disco "chicka-chicka" thing.

[trebor99]

since the Mobile I/O has controls for instrument (guitar) input, why do you use the TonePort DI in the chain?

 

Do you know that you can record the dry guitar signal into Logic while hearing the amp sim sound? I couldn't imagine trying to "get a vibe going" with just the DI guitar sound...unless it was a clean strat disco "chicka-chicka" thing.

 

c'mon man.. of course I know the MH has controls for instrument inputs and I can't imagine getting a vibe either without a cranking amp sound.. but I run through the TonePort DI for the EXACT reason of hearing the Line 6 amp sims while I'm tracking.. I instantiate a stand alone version of Pod Farm (outside of Logic) and listen to that through my hardware mixer and monitors while I track.. the Direct out of the DI goes into the MH and into Logic for recording.. but the Analog Stereo outs of the DI go to the mixer and that's what I listen to while tracking.. there's near-zero latency.. and I can adjust the levels independently.. I can change amp sounds to whatever suits my needs.. and don't need to wear cans.. and I NEVER use Software Monitoring in Logic for guitar tracking.. don't need to.

 

so what say you? got any thoughts about a hardware channel strip?

 

Cheers..

Bobby

[David Nahmani]

Actually Bobby, I'm with redlogic on this one, your setup sounds overly complicated, and you want to add something more to it? If the final result is going to be a DI'ed guitar into an amp sim plug-in, that's how you should track it: direct into the ULN2, while listening to your amp sim plug-in (software monitoring on). I do that a LOT and I've never ever heard a guitar playing complain about latency. I mean when you think about it, if you're standing, playing a guitar that's plugged into a small 1x12" combo amp sitting on the floor 3 feet from you, you're experiencing a 10ms acoustic latency, which is about 3 times what you'd get from recording straight into Logic (with headphones).

 

The Line 6 is the weak link in your signal chain, and the chain can only be as strong as its weakest link. Get rid of it. Plug straight into the ULN2.

 

Also I believe that you should listen to the sound you're going to use during the mix. As a guitar player you'll play off of the sound of the amp, so if you change the amp later, it may sound ... not as spontaneous. I understand the need for further tweaking/adjusting the amp though, but you can still do that since Logic will always be recording the dry guitar sound.

 

So IMO, you've got everything you need to get the best DI guitar sound you can get. Then, if you want to experiment further, I would consider a real amp, real mic, real mic pre, and most importantly a great sounding room to put the amp cabinet in. But that may or may not be feasible depending on your situation, budget, etc...

 

My 2 cents!

[redlogic]

.. I instantiate a stand alone version of Pod Farm (outside of Logic) and listen to that through my hardware mixer and monitors while I track..

Ahhh...so that's why you run through the Toneport DI.

 

Do you have the Pod Farm plug-in?

If you do, you could skip running through the Toneport altogether. Just use it as a dongle to get to the Pod Farm plug-in.

 

Think about it...there's no way the guts and specs of the Toneport are as good as the Metric Halo.

 

Toneport into Metric Halo is like eating a spoonful of cold bacon grease before tasting a fine chocolate.

 

NTTATWWT......if you like greasy bacon-flavored chocolate.

 

Regarding a hardware channel strip...If your room, monitoring and every other link in the chain aren't top notch, I doubt you would notice a big difference. I know that's not what you want to hear, but it's true.

 

But...hardware channel strips are out there...and you can spend as much as you want on them.

[David Nahmani]

Hey, why not.

 

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3401/3420231570_a2bedc1226.jpg

[redlogic]

 

I should've known better.

 

Do they make a buttermilk and anchovy version?

[trebor99]

yep.. I have the plugin version.. but the reason why I run through the TonePort DI is to use the Analog Stereo Outs to my mixer.. that way I have discreet control over the POD Farm in my mix with Logic playing back.. so I hit record and go.. besides sometimes I just like to jam and I'll load up POD Farm and Superior Drummer in their standalone verisons and have at it.. if there's a way to still do all that without going through the DI then I'm game..

 

all this aside:lately I've been going old school and mic'ing up my 2x12 cab (amped with either Prophecy II or Boogie) with the 57 and/or the condenser mic and getting decent results there.. but with everything I hear about how this preamp or that compressor really sweetens up the sound of a mic I've been leaning towards getting something like a good channel strip for the front end of my studio.. and for sure it would help the vocal tracking too.. and that's a big part of my reason for the post..

 

seems like everyone is trying to analyze my setup but no one has really given me any input as to what Hardware Channel Strip they would recommend based on their experience.. get an Avalon VT 73.. or a UA 6176.. or no you need a Joe Meek OneQ.. or how about the ART Pro Channel?

 

I probably should not have said a word about my setup and just posed the question straight forward.. am I whining.. yes! guess I should just fuggetaboutit.. who am I kidding?.. I don't have the money for an Avalon or a UAD.. heck not even a lowly ART.