Programming shuffle beats – Man Vs. Machine

[ornamov]

Hey all,

 

I've had the everlasting discussion with my friend about programmed grooves and their "feel" – one side (mine) says that computers will always have hard time mimicking a real drummer, especially when there's a shuffle groove involved. The other side (my friend, who composes mainly electronic music) says that high quality drum sampling and intensive beat programming can make a drummer not to tell the difference between the "live" recording and the programmed groove. I definitely don't agree with that.

 

So my question to you all is – have you ever heard a shuffle programmed beat that sound

so "lively", you couldn't tell the difference whether it's a computer or real drummer?

[shivermetimbers]

Hey all,

 

I've had the everlasting discussion with my friend about programmed grooves and their "feel" – one side (mine) says that computers will always have hard time mimicking a real drummer, especially when there's a shuffle groove involved. The other side (my friend, who composes mainly electronic music) says that high quality drum sampling and intensive beat programming can make a drummer not to tell the difference between the "live" recording and the programmed groove. I definitely don't agree with that.

 

So my question to you all is – have you ever heard a shuffle programmed beat that sound

so "lively", you couldn't tell the difference whether it's a computer or real drummer?

 

 

" • Why is a drum machine better than a drummer?

Because it can keep good time and won't sleep with your girlfriend."

 

A computer is not offended by 'Drummer jokes.' In fact, neither is a drummer because a drummer cannot figure out that he/she is the butt of the joke.

 

Very few drummers can compete with a computer and that is why a 'humanizing' feature is added to many computer based drum programs. Drummers on the other hand cannot be 'computerized' because they are too stu ... well, they just can't.

 

http://www.drumjokes.com/

[camillo jr]

So my question to you all is – have you ever heard a shuffle programmed beat that sound

so "lively", you couldn't tell the difference whether it's a computer or real drummer?

 

You mean, someone says to me, "Hey, these drums are fake! Can ya tell?" So then I'd know they were fake but I'd have to pretend that I didn't and say to myself "Damn, that sounds good." or "Crap drummer! No feel."

 

There's so many great drum plug-ins these days and they get better and better and there's so many ways of "copping a feel" from real drummers like stealing their groove via Flex or something else....... IOW, I think it's possible.

 

I've done it both ways, just using Logic's kits; playing it in, tweaking it with judicious Q settings and also using a real drum performance to make a groove template that I then use for the Q setting. Problem was, after I did it, I already knew they were fake but had put so much time into it that I thought it was great. But I'll have to ask myself, "Hey, these drums are fake! Can ya tell?"

[David Nahmani]

So my question to you all is – have you ever heard a shuffle programmed beat that sound so "lively", you couldn't tell the difference whether it's a computer or real drummer?

Yes. Many times.

[Nublu]

The great shuffle I heard was by a drummer playing my padKontrol, and Superior Drummer.

He wasn't mimicking anyone or "trying to tell the difference". He was playing the Digital Audio Workstation. It was Music. Period. And he was living it.

As far as programming goes it is an evolving subject. For me it is one more way (fascinating and cool) to "pluck the string" so to speak. Someone who is familiar and practiced with a DAW can easily get a live fresh feel. And like most things it gets better with practice. Programming is one option. We're not restricted to it.

The live drummer probably sat with his kit for years. What kind of focus and expectation is the computer getting. Ever hear an unpracticed drummer do a crappy shuffle?