best summing mixer for dance music

[logicproguy]

Gang what are some really great summing mixers for producing dance music, a friend runs off a mackie and creates cool stuff whats your thougths?

[David Nahmani]

A summing box for dance music? Isn't that kinda like using a digital sampled guitar for blues?

 

Honestly AFAIK most dance music producers do it ITB, usually in Logic. I know at the very top some like to sum stems with an SSL, but that's a bit expensive.

 

Using a Mackie as a summing box when you own Logic is, to me, like using a Honda Civic to tow your Porsche. Just saying. There may be some "cool things" he can do because of the signal routing, or the hardware effects he's using, or something? But as far as the summing, I wouldn't replace Logic with a Mackie.

[logicproguy]

Hi Dave, great music can be fully produced in the BOX, but with that said; it still does not mean that all music is created, even the professions who make all entirely in the box. I think it depends on what you are seeking, but there are many resources out there where some people will sum out of logic and mix analog as well. Every producer will have a different way of achieving their sound but if everything was entirely digital, why would companies spend millions of dollars created stuff like this;

Anyone in here that has experiencing mixing and summing digital to analog and back into logic like to express their experience? What are your thoughts on the subjects; can you achieve great music from it?

[Holger Lagerfeldt]

Anyone in here that has experiencing mixing and summing digital to analog and back into logic like to express their experience? What are your thoughts on the subjects; can you achieve great music from it?

Gear doesn't have a big influence on whether the music is great or not

 

Here are some comments on the subject:

http://www.logicprohelp.com/viewtopic.php?t=65947

[fader8]

if everything was entirely digital, why would companies spend millions of dollars created stuff like this;

Because there are still a LOT of studios and sound stages that still have large analog consoles. As long as we still need microphones to record acoustic instruments and people (I don't see that trend ending anytime soon) and these studios still want to use those consoles for mixing, (many of these consoles have a really great sound) then there will continue to be a need for conversion.

 

With that said, the conversion has to be really, REALLY good, and that's expensive to do. If you have several hundred thousand dollars invested in a console and outboard gear, then it makes sense to support that investment. But if ALL you want to do is sum 16 or 24 channels through a passive summing box and record that stereo signal, then you're not going to see any real "benefit". Any change that would occur to the signal in this case could be replicated in the digital domain anyway, so what's the point?

[logicproguy]

You all make very great points and your ideas and thoughts are always appreciated.

[CarlosUnderground]

I'd say, if you like his setups sound, ask him to let you use it one day with you're sessions to see if it works for you. It can't hurt.

[Rev. Juda Sleaze]

If you're really desperate to spend money on analogue summing, these guys will happily take your cash from you: http://www.analogsumming.com/index.asp?zona=1

 

I'm sure there's more companies out there with a similar service.

[logicproguy]

rather learn myself.

[Rev. Juda Sleaze]

rather learn myself.

 

Well, if you've got $20,000 to spend, cool!

[shivermetimbers]

Anyone in here that has experiencing mixing and summing digital to analog and back into logic like to express their experience? What are your thoughts on the subjects; can you achieve great music from it?

 

Presumming you have an eight output interface ...

 

 

If you were to get an eight channel summing box, you would have to somehow group your tracks to some combination of mono and stereo channels all designated to those eight channels. In the end, the eight channels all be summed to a stereo output.

 

ITB, you can easily do all this.

OTB, it can get slightly complicated, but doable.

 

http://www.logicprohelp.com/viewtopic.php?t=77197&highlight=

 

So with 40+ tracks, you will have to group them into the eight Sub-channels and those eight sub channels would exit the interface through the individual outputs.

 

The immediate gratification here is that you do not have the 'in the red' problem like you do staying ITB and trying to keep everything loud.

 

On the other hand, you could stay ITB and mix everything at a lower level and send the stereo out to some analog device, process it, and send it back into Logic just under '0'dB.

 

 

 

So are you looking to play your dance music live straight out of the interface and into a P.A system, or are you looking to press a CD and use that out live?

[route-electrique]

Go for it, and not only summing .

[weaver123]

Hi,

 

i hope someone can help, i produce mainly ITB for dance music but have been looking into outboard gear to improve the sound.

 

i went ahead and purchased both a neve 8816 summing amp and crane song hedd 192 second hand for a really good price.

 

although i haven't set them up yet, i have been looking on the forum here and i can see that people have been recommending the API 2500 compressor as a must have for dance music which I'm gutted i didn't see that before blowing my cash!

 

so my questions are....

 

is the API 2500 marginally better than the waves API 2500 software plug which i have?

should i get rid of any/all the equipment i have, and get some different pieces? for e.g., sell the neve and crane song and buy an API2500?

would an analogue desk be better? like an A+ H, Toft or Venice Midas?

Does the neve 8816 summing mixer really make a difference?

 

Whatever equipment i buy or swop, i would also need to upgrade my sound card to facilitate the hardware too as i only have a USB focusrite scarlett right now. I have seen the fire face as a good recommendation and also an antelope orion 32. (i run a mac mini so i can't use MADI - only usb, firewire or Tbolt)

 

i only use soft synths and soft plugs through logic, and i'm looking to get a nicer warmer sound and separation (with whatever equipment it takes to do that!)

 

as a side note, and i know this is software based - but does anyone have any experience with the Slate digital Vcc's, or the SSL Xlogic 16 channel summing desk?

 

Thanks

brad

[stardustmedia]

I don't think the difference of just summing OTB to a good ITB-mix, even with a high end unit (like Neve, Dangerous, etc.), is worth the money. You can do great mixes ITB.

 

A bigger difference is when you mix OTB, with a real mixer, EQ, compressor, great effects... all on the higher end side, not Behringer and stuff. Those gear will impart a unique sound that is still different to ITB.

 

Don't get me wrong, it won't be a day and night difference. And the difference is not "better" just because it's analog, I'd just say it's different.

 

Definitely true: If your ITB mix still is no good, your OTB mix won't be any better. Probably even worse and noisier, because you haven't thought about proper connections, gain staging, etc. The end result: You frustrated big time and you spent money big time So be prepared to go thru some deep emotional valleys in the beginning 8)

 

Don't get me wrong again, I love to work analog. It's more fun, for me it's more intuitive to tweak knobs and faders, when everything properly gain staged driving the gear hot is just more intuitive and less badly (digitally) distorted (compared to most plugins).