How to get you song levels up and clear

[Lippeth]

it wasn't intended as a personal attack on you as a human being. There are forums where some top notch producers explain some of the complicated methods for getting a nice mix only to get a response like "Ya, whatever ... so do I set my limiter to -0.3 or what?"

 

forum |ˈfôrəm|

noun ( pl. forums )

1 a place, meeting, or medium where ideas and views on a particular issue can be exchanged

 

Because of you and Ski I'm definitely taking a second look at tastefully raising my mix level without degrading the sound too much. You raise excellent points, the only thing that got me was that you only told me that my method was bad, not why it was bad. I like to be as helpful as I can, but I try to keep an open mind when someone has more useful information. Key word, 'try', I'm only human.

[shivermetimbers]

You raise excellent points, the only thing that got me was that you only told me that my method was bad, not why it was bad.

 

I didn't say it was bad.

 

Getting it loud is the easy part, the issue is what is wrong with the material before you get it loud.

 

Your peaks want to push the meter into the red, limiting these peaks and raising the overall level is what you want to do, but it doesn't mean you limit at - 0.3 and push the gain up.

 

You're pushing up all the frequencies which includes the low end, the mud, and the irritating highs. The low end is really powerful and eats up your headroom, whereas the middle part of the spectrum is what you really want to be working with. You can get a louder mid level, then easily reshape the low thumpy-ness and tastefully add it back in ... the same goes for the airy highs.

 

There is way more to it than that, but give it some thought.

[Lippeth]

You can get a louder mid level, then easily reshape the low thumpy-ness and tastefully add it back in ... the same goes for the airy highs.

 

I hope I don't sound thick-headed, but reshape and add it back in with what? EQ, or something more clever? I try to take care of bad or overpowering frequencies early on, and while the highs are rarely a problem for me the lows can be a challenge to tighten up. I could be getting off topic but I will be grateful for any information you have on the subject.

 

it doesn't mean you limit at - 0.3 and push the gain up.

 

If I ever said gain then shame on me, but I leave the gain alone and push the output fader to around 0.0. This could still be wrong or bad but it gives me a nice volume with almost no audible degradation and absolutely no clipping. Don't be afraid to put me in my place if I'm cheating myself with bad mixing logic.

[m.bot]

Thanks for all the input and discussion...

 

So I adjusted the plugin strip by putting the eq before the compressor and added a limit to the tracks that didn't have. I had make changes to the eq and compression when i did this..but it sounds clearer. But I'm having a hard time with my bass, my bass doesn't stand out as much as i'd like it to..all my other instruments are panned except for the the bass and kick. I put a high shelf on my bass to cut the highs and cut the lows for it so it doesn't sound muddy...hmm seems like I gotta adjust the compression or tweak the instrument settings...

 

Oh also to make the kick stand out more I just used the side chaining technique and it made a significant difference.

[shivermetimbers]

If you could, post a screen shot of your mixer screen.

 

Let me ask this ... how do you have your bass and kick grouped or separated within the mix?

[m.bot]

If you could, post a screen shot of your mixer screen.

 

Let me ask this ... how do you have your bass and kick grouped or separated within the mix?

 

I'll post it when i get home..

 

What do you mean by group or separated?

[shivermetimbers]

Some people let everything (all tracks) go straight to the stereo output.

 

Grouping or subgrouping like things into separate buses will allow you to process those grouped instruments separately from the rest of the tracks.

 

So grouping your bass and kick both into a separate buss will allow you a bit more control over the frequencies you need to isolate as well as control the levels of both at the same time.

[m.bot]

Ah i see, well in that case all of my tracks are just going straight to the stereo output.

[m.bot]

Here's the screen shot of my mixer.

[shivermetimbers]

So save that version and then remove all the processing/effects plug ins and do a simple mix for levels and panning.

 

Group as many like things together so that you can process that group separately from the other groups. For example, you may have five synths with the levels and panning set up. You can set their outputs to a specific BUS and then process on that one bus. Now you may have one bus with the five synths, and another bus with the low end bass and kick. Your low end buss may want to sit in a specific frequency range and you may need to collectively subtract that range out of the five synths bus until they both shine thru the mix. Even if you had those sounding nice, a third bus could be tweaked to totally ruin the work you put into the first two buses.

 

Using a guitar and vocal as an example. Both are recorded, but need the Eq adjusted somewhere. Adjusting the EQ on the guitar can actually brighten up the Vocals, or a Vocal adjustment could change the way the guitar sounds.

 

There are no set rules, but your project will determine which rules will apply. Your first priority is getting the project CLEAN and CLEAR.

You can do all this and keep your peaks at around -18dB to -12dB. Remember that you can also work at these levels if you turn up your speaker volume, better yet to work at lower output levels if you can.

 

There is nothing magical about this part of the process. Simply a nice, clean, not so loud mix.

 

Getting the loudness of a commercial recording is a bit more involved than simply setting the Ad Limit to -0.3dB and slamming the gain.

[m.bot]

So save that version and then remove all the processing/effects plug ins and do a simple mix for levels and panning.

 

Group as many like things together so that you can process that group separately from the other groups. For example, you may have five synths with the levels and panning set up. You can set their outputs to a specific BUS and then process on that one bus. Now you may have one bus with the five synths, and another bus with the low end bass and kick. Your low end buss may want to sit in a specific frequency range and you may need to collectively subtract that range out of the five synths bus until they both shine thru the mix. Even if you had those sounding nice, a third bus could be tweaked to totally ruin the work you put into the first two buses.

 

Using a guitar and vocal as an example. Both are recorded, but need the Eq adjusted somewhere. Adjusting the EQ on the guitar can actually brighten up the Vocals, or a Vocal adjustment could change the way the guitar sounds.

 

There are no set rules, but your project will determine which rules will apply. Your first priority is getting the project CLEAN and CLEAR.

You can do all this and keep your peaks at around -18dB to -12dB. Remember that you can also work at these levels if you turn up your speaker volume, better yet to work at lower output levels if you can.

 

There is nothing magical about this part of the process. Simply a nice, clean, not so loud mix.

 

Getting the loudness of a commercial recording is a bit more involved than simply setting the Ad Limit to -0.3dB and slamming the gain.

 

Thanks for the tip man....What's the typical procedure for getting it loud? Is it all in the mix or all in the mastering?

 

Also when starting a project do you guys mix the songs as you go? Eq'ing and compressing the sound then sequencing that sound in your song or do you just find the closest sound you're after then mix it after?

 

 

Here's the song that I was trying to work on...the mix is ah...critiques welcome.

 

 

http://soundcloud.com/enock-1/look-ma-no-metronomes

[Rev. Juda Sleaze]

What's the typical procedure for getting it loud? Is it all in the mix or all in the mastering?

 

Also when starting a project do you guys mix the songs as you go? Eq'ing and compressing the sound then sequencing that sound in your song or do you just find the closest sound you're after then mix it after?

 

The mix has a lot to do with it if loudness is your goal.

 

Carving-out frequency niches for instruments, minimising crossover, cutting sub frequencies etc.

 

Mixing as you write can be a waste of time IMO. You can't know how to best mix something until you have the context in which it fits. Even if you have all the instruments you want in a section, it's too easy to spend all your creative juice mixing when you should be writing. Then you end up with a hard drive full of intros that sound great, but no finished tracks.

[m.bot]

Ahh, ok, I gotcha. I can see how working on a sound to sound right will distract you....

 

Also regarding what shivers said about grouping tracks....

 

When you group them you group them by their frequency range? or by instrument like drums, guitars, synths, etc etc.

[shivermetimbers]

I would do it by instruments. Edited September 3, 2012 by shivermetimbers

[Rev. Juda Sleaze]

Ahh, ok, I gotcha. I can see how working on a sound to sound right will distract you....

 

It's not just about distraction, mixing is all about context. All instruments could sound awful when solo'd, it doesn't matter if they sound great when put in context of a mix. You won't know how something will fit until all the parts are there to mix.

[m.bot]

Roger dat......Thanks guys!!!