Low cut and peak level

[theprodguy]

I've read online many posts about why volume raises when you cut very low frequencies.

I have a 25hz cut the bass, and it's peaking at -7dBFS, when I bypass the EQ it peaks at -12dBFS, so it's actually a lot of difference. However, I'd like to mix the bass louder but I can't turn it louder than it is now: I'm not "mixing by numbers", but I'm trying to make sure that the kick is the loudest thing in the mix, and mixing by ear my bass ends up being 3dB louder than the kick, unless I don't low cut it (which is not something I wanna do). How do you deal with this without limiting the bass (or using a linear phase eq, which I heard solves the problem)? Is this a problem, in a genre where the kick should be the loudest element?

[lagerfeldt]

I'd like to mix the bass louder but I can't turn it louder than it is now

You can easily turn up the bass: simply raise the level of the bass channel.

 

If this overloads the Stereo Output, then lower everything else first or simply lower the Stereo Output fader.

 

I'm trying to make sure that the kick is the loudest thing in the mix, and mixing by ear my bass ends up being 3dB louder than the kick,

I take it you actually mean "the bass peaks 3 dB above the peak level of the kick".

 

Loudness cannot be judged by peak level at all. If the relationship between the kick and bass sounds right, the balance is right.

 

The peak level of the bass is another matter which you can only "solve" by using or creating a different bass sound. You can use linear phase EQ to avoid the additional post filter ringing since the FIR EQ will "spread" the ringing to both post and pre impulse. This can create other problems though, especially on bass material. Use a 12 dB/Oct or 18 dB/Oct filter, no steeper.

 

Compression or limiting will likely not help very much because it will change the sound too much.

 

My guess is that your bass is or has a square wave component or comes from a rompler (like NeXus), not a real synth. Most rompler waveforms have been processed with severe limiting or clipping and will exhibit much more relative phase change and ringing when re-processed.

 

However, in the end trying to mix for loudness in this fashion doesn't really pay off. There are too many steps later in the process which will affect the sound (and phase) back again. Instead you should focus on arranging, producing and mixing what sounds good. This is not dogmatic advice, but based on experience.

 

I believe every producer or engineer goes through a cycle that sees them end up more or less where they started: focusing on musicality rather than the technical side. The only difference being experience in how to obtain the sound that provides this musicality. Ironically this not only leads to a better, but also a naturally louder mix.

[theprodguy]

Thanks, that's what I was looking for.

 

However, no, my bass is coming from a synth and it's a simple saw wave with resonance and distortion. Limiting actually helps with 3-4 dB of GR, but I prefer just turning it up.

[lagerfeldt]

Okay, then simply turn it up. There's notthing wrong with limiting, but in this case I recommend you stop when it's in any way audible.

[theprodguy]

Thank you. I really get frustrated for little things like that...

[lagerfeldt]

Sure, I understand. On the subject of loudness, take a look at this thread: http://www.gearslutz.com/board/music-computers/468170-loudness-when-producing-mixing-tips.html