Disk I/O Overloads LPX

Okay so, I thought I fixed the problem I was having with system overloads in Logic, but of course, it has surfaced once again.

 

I'm working on a remix, chopping up audio, and the files were 24 bit. Nothing to crazy. But I figured they were the culprit for my workflow crippling overloads in LPX.

 

So I bounced everything to 16-bit, started a new project, and voila, Barely any CPU/HD spikes, honestly, I never even saw the bars fill up to the halfway point.

 

So the next day, I open up the project and hit play.....what do I see? The same CPU/HD spikes I was seeing before i bounced the stems to 16 bit...

From the second I press play, not uncommon, but it takes forever to go down, and decides to randomly jump all the way back up, which then peaks my CPU and LPX overloads...

 

All of my projects are saved to my WD My Book Essential 1TB HD which has something like 400GB of free space, and my internal HD has around 120 GB of free space.

 

I don't record much audio through my interface so i have my I/O buffer at :1024 and the buffer range at: medium/large (depending on the project)

 

Nothing seems to help.

 

This remix I'm working on is around 16-20 tracks of audio.

 

I know that I should be running from a 7200rpm HD with a firewire connection, but I haven't run into any issues with my WD before so I think it has to do with this specific project?

 

Plus, I started another project with my friend the same day, No CPU spikes at all, running around 10-12 tracks of audio and 4 midi tracks...

 

That is why I'm posting here, because all of my past projects, on the same external HD, run just fine (some are up to 40 audio and midi tracks)

 

But this one project, (which ive deleted and reimported all the audio intro) just keeps overloading!

So, I am hoping to find some helpful pointers or at least some type of diagnosis.

I have a similar situation with this and track-freezing: I am wondering if having a Journaled File System is the culprit. Here is a link to a discussion on this matter: https://discussions.apple.com/thread/5194288?start=15&tstart=0

 

If those HD spikes occur on or around a bunch of dense edits, can you bounce or (Pro Tools lingo: "Consolidate") those dense sections into continuous files? (i.e., Combine those 237 separate stereo edits over 5 seconds into a one continuous five-second stereo file.) Place it into an adjacent track then hard-mute/disable (no In/Out/Send) the originals as needed to check this method.

 

Or, if you have an extra blank external audio drive: Make a "Save As" version of your project with all of the projects files onto that disk, reopen that (Saved As) version from that disk and see if it runs better. If it runs loads better, you -may- have a fragmentation issue with the WD. Please list your external drives into your signature.

 

There are other similar discussions in these LogicProHelp.com forums.

 

LMK.

CPU and HD are two very different component of your computer, and often when one is getting overloaded you can ask the other to relieve some of the work in various ways... but in order to make a decision you need to know WHICH of the two is overloaded, or you could very well make things worse for yourself.

 

the files were 24 bit. Nothing to crazy. But I figured they were the culprit for my workflow crippling overloads in LPX.

How did you figure that? Were you seeing HD peaks, or CPU peaks, or both? Did you get an alert and if yes what was the exact text of the alert?

 

So the next day, I open up the project and hit play.....what do I see? The same CPU/HD spikes I was seeing before i bounced the stems to 16 bit...

I don't see any CPU spikes, only HD spikes?

Haha. This is almost the same problem I have, with only difference that my WD Mybook is connected via USB. I have noticed that the HD spikes go away every time when I "save as" the project and start to work with the new one. So weird. Example if I bounce couple of files into project, it starts to get hd spikes. After "save as" the project will work fine again, until I bounce or export some more audio in it. I have like 80% of the storage left in the external drive.

 

One problem can be my iMac's usb as all the connections are working in the same bandwidth. Especially with the NI Maschine the problem occur more often...

 

Your are lucky as you have this problem only with some project, I have this with every one....although this has been occurring more commonly

Is it possible that the HD meter's "threshold of HD activity" is just more sensitive or responsive than it was in 9.1.8?

 

In my recent project (one that I started in 9.1.8 then transferred to 10.0.5) the HD meter is spiking at the start of a sequence (just like it did in 9.1.8) but I'm -not- getting "disk too slow" messages or any indications in the EXS24 Options window that any samples were not being read in time. So even though the meter may look spiked once in a while, everything's working as it should.

 

BTW: I'm -not- freezing any EXS24 tracks.

 

I don't let it bother me unless I'm losing audio somewhere.

Actually the HD meter is pumping time to time but the real problem is the "disk is too slow" messages. Perhaps I just have to test another harddrive as the WD Mybook is those stupid energymodels and I have to use disksomnia to keep it wake...Maybe thats causing something, i dont know...

Can you split some of the the work off onto another drive? Like a FW400/800 drive?

 

I've got one of those WD Green 1TB drives that I've stuck into a G5 as an installer disk. After the WD Book is out of warranty, you could pop the case open and replace the drive with just about anything that -doesn't- say something about being "Green" or "Energy Smart" because those terms always mean trouble with HDs. If it only does USB 2, you may want to hang onto it as a backup/transfer/iTunes drive and save and get a small FW800, USB 3, or Thunderbolt drive for your current projects. 7200 RPM or SSD. Check the gear forums. Best of luck, Santate.

Thanks everyone!

 

Yeah it is now only happening to certain projects.

I've noticed that when i save a track, close LPX, the reopen, I run into this issue.

 

Otherwise Logic runs just fine.

 

So after reading all of these responses, I'm pretty sure that it is a HD issue.

 

Damn WD...

 

Thanks guys!

So weird. Example if I bounce couple of files into project, it starts to get hd spikes. After "save as" the project will work fine again, until I bounce or export some more audio in it. I have like 80% of the storage left in the external drive.

 

YES. I just did a "save as" on the SECOND project to have these weird HD overloads and it is running perfectly fine again. I believe that it may be a HD fragmentation issue....or something of the sort.

Okay. So, after working on the "new" project for a few hours, I was bouncing midi to audio and after that process the HD overloads started occurring again.

 

Once they start, they wont stop.

 

I have to start the track from the beginning otherwise it overloads after 2 seconds or less of playback.

 

It also overloads at a certain point everytime, about 1:30 into the track, even though nothing crazy is going on in the mix.

 

It is very odd, and I'm now convinced it is my hard drive.

 

Because when I did the "save as" work around (which is no longer working with this project....sigh) I was editing all over the place and the HD/CPU meter (focusing on the HD because that seems to be the culprit) wasn't spiking, and if it did, it went down quickly and did not overload..

Hi

 

Because when I did the "save as" work around (which is no longer working with this project....sigh) I was editing all over the place and the HD/CPU meter (focusing on the HD because that seems to be the culprit) wasn't spiking, and if it did, it went down quickly and did not overload..

 

It seems as though the disk is sleeping and 'Save As' is 'sometimes' waking it up.

I bought WD disk and quickly replaced it with G-Drive FW 7200rpm disk because of similar sleeping problems.

The system is much better after the change.

The WD disk is used as a backup disk only now.

 

I noticed improvement in HD performance with 10.0.6

is there a reason you've stayed on 10.0.4

 

Is App Napp turned off for Logic.

 

In System Preferences: Energy Saver.

Make sure disks are never allowed to Sleep.

Logic X is beginning to really slow down in my project. I've sent the crash report back to Apple today. Mine was a Save As project too. I think there is something going on that is clogging things up, even though my [mostly Software Instruments only] project is not increasing in track count, but in note count. There could be an issue with history/undo states getting stacked up, even though I save often and restart my Mac whenever I smell trouble.

 

Unfortunately, I can't open my project in Logic 9.1.8 [64-bit] and work in peace. App Nap disabled. Sometimes I really miss Studio Vision Pro 4.x.x.

There's something really f**ked up about Mavericks and the way it handles memory. It eats it up somehow after half an hour or so.

Been hearing this from some people.

What is the rotational speed of your system drive?

 

Hi

 

You can leave Time Machine off, and backup manually with the time machine icon on the upper right (top menu bar).

That's what I do.

 

Thanks triplets! A Gem! Backing up this way for a couple of days now and my system feels better for it.

 

Mavericks and the way it handles memory.

It eats it up somehow after half an hour or so.

Been hearing this from some people.

 

External FW Drives - Audio Hardware - FireWire chipsets.

Wireless, AirPort, 3rd-Party-Software, (32bit Purge) OS X. New Logic Version.

It reminds me of the Gui-Lag thread days. I didn't get the Gui-Lag issue. A slight glitch in the Piano Roll graphics.

From the Unresponsive Logic Bugs and Workaround thread:

 

It is almost certainly to to with logics NSEvent handling.

 

https://developer.apple.com/library/mac/documentation/Cocoa/Reference/ApplicationKit/Classes/nsevent_Class/Reference/Reference.html

 

An NSEvent object, or simply an event, contains information about an input action such as a mouse click or a key down. [...] When the application is ready to process an event, it takes one from the queue.

[...]

It's like it's waiting for some other process, perhaps part of the audio engine, to complete before getting back to handling the event queue.[/i]

 

13" late 2014 Retina MacBook Pro, and when I drag the EQ to an external monitor, it works flawlessly.

 

focusing on the HD because that seems to be the culprit) wasn't spiking, and if it did, it went down quickly and did not overload..

 

There could be an issue with history/undo states getting stacked up, even though I save often and restart my Mac whenever I smell trouble.

 

No Retina No External Monitor on MBP here, one Desktop only in Mission Control. I don't use the Trackpad. Magic mouse and midi keyboard my main interface for Logic. Through the gui-lag issue I turned off what I didn't use and Tweaked what I did. Turning off Time Machine and backing up using the Menu 8). Less stress on the system and clean backups. I can see reflections in today's posts of big changes to both Mac/Logic since SL days. Gui-Lag has a history on SL too. Optimising your system to find out what isn't involved in the issue gives positive results.

Audio Devices:FireWire chipsets external hard drives.

Changing the Sample Rate in Logic often seems to help in some cases.

 

FW chipsets? External FW Disks sort of 'sleeping' but not sleeping...

Reseting the Audio Device defaults FW Disks behaviour...

The 'Save As' problems and the FW Disk 'sort-of' sleeping. Mounted but not 'listening' properly?

 

Multiple EQ's.

I've copied Logics Demo song to my ExtFwDisk and open it from there. The one in the Menu of Logic shouldn't do as well as the External FireWire Disk project. Opened Lp9 projects using LpX and saved them. 'Saved As' is used a lot. I disabled Logics Auto Save function straight after installing logic9. Moving from LpX tutorial 44.1 projects and Custom 48 projects a lot, in one to two hour sessions.

 

EQ ia Slow and Sluggish

 

The External FW Disk, behaves better here with Manual Time Machine Backups. So does the system disk.

Closing Logic (44.1) then backing up from the Menu TM. There's a strange silence every hour or so 8)

I BackUp, take a break.

 

There's a lot of variations, bugs are another story and you have to think of the massive Changes to Mac/Logic. Some Firewire chipset audio device issues are fixed by using Express Card/FW hub. Daisy chaining your audio device through your External FW Disk works for others. A different Cable working for some.

 

How are you using your External FW Disks? Logic Projects only?

 

Hoping the next updates solve a lot of these issues.

Yeah, see my system profile. I'd gladly trade back a lot of the new and fancy-lookin' Logic X features for a stable, non-leaky OS and Application. I wonder how sweet this stuff would run if planned obsolescence hadn't left Tiger behind. Even Snow Leopard. -Which is Intel.

 

I have a couple G5 towers that run Pro Tools 7.4 without a flaw even with the dreaded MBox2 Mini. Could it be the ECC memory? The stable OS 10.4.11? Hmm.

Hi

 

If you have the last line 'No WiFi' etc, of your specs under control you're on the right path.

Tiger is before my time on osx, though I've read good reports. My most stable system to date was Snow Leopard Logic 9.1.5, though 9.1.8 is running now alongside LpX. "Fancy looking Logic X". I agree. I want to be comfortable while working, and not disturbed by Fluff or eye candy. I disable as much of this as possible.

"Features Logic X". I think the new features are amazing and am prepared to continue upgrading to see them develop. Having a pro stable system and testing system is ideal but osx/logic development doesn't disturb my workflow enough to consider two setups.

 

Could it be the ECC memory?

The way Mavericks handles Memory is causing many issues.

Logic too, here upgrading from 10.0.1 gave great improvement.

The OP uses Macbook Pro 15 inch 2.6 Retina with 16 gigs of Ram.

 

Memory and Hard Drive Leak in LPX

 

Mavericks and memory (Ram) "Mavericks boards".

https://discussions.apple.com/thread/5470580?tstart=0

 

Disk I/O Overloads LPX - (OP)

Early Logic X versions gave this when opening large projects. Much better Today. Logic 10.0.6

I've seen similar HD behaviour on my mbp, but only a fraction compared to some systems.

I keep a close eye on my Firewire disk and audio device, improvement is continuing as I upgrade.

Thanks for that info. I'm clearing my undo history when I do my last Save of the day. I just finished a 01':36" midi orchestral project that took way longer than it should have because Logic just won't allow me to edit or quantize midi data with the ease that I could in Studio Vision Pro. I know: SVP is gone and it is never coming back. But when it's faster for me to just replay a Clarinet part than to finesse the quantize editor, then I think it's a problem. I'm just not sure who's problem. All I know is that I started to cut 12 voiceover spots today for a .Net firm, and I ended up doing the thing in PT9 after 20 minutes of fooling around in Gar.. uh, Logic Pro X.

 

After two little jobs I think I'm seeing the logic (heh) of Composing in Logic and doing the edits in Pro Tools 9. - Two programs because the EXS24 via Structure Free brings PT9 to it's knees. Kinda sad. I need to keep my momentum when I write, you know?

Hi No Problem.

 

I've just reduced the Undo History from 15 to 10. Am I imagining the improvement?.

"Clearing undo history last save of the day" I don't, should I?.

"SVP" sounds very good, I've never used it. My history is win-32-64 Cubase back to VST-5 and SX,

Linux (real-time kernel) and five years Mac. The Mac gives me the least maintenance issues, it just works.

"seeing the logic (heh) of Composing in Logic and doing the edits in Pro Tools 9:".

Experience gives workarounds and it seems like you know your way.

"Kinda Sad", yes but as you say keeping a flow going is vital to the creative process.

 

I've spent all free time in the last 4 days/nights revising osx/logic 'history' and benchmarking basics such as EQ,

File Structure 'Save As', osx\logic (Ram) and Firewire disk Duet (fw) performance.

LpX is getting better, with time and the fixes to the bugs today... I'm thinking positive, it's the only way.

 

search.php?keywords=glyph+fw800+Memory 4m

 

search.php?keywords=tiger+memory+eq 76m

 

search.php?keywords=tiger+memory 76m

 

Writing the Reports takes longer than the test but is worth every minute...