Weird Logic Project file size behaviour

Hi!

This has been going for quite a while, even before 10.7 came out. I always start new Logic projects from a template, so the project settings are always the same. I always save my projects as folders, not packages. However, some of my projects have really big file sizes and I can't figure out what is the cause for that. In such cases, when I right-click the project file and go "Show Package Content", I notice that some of the projects are storing duplicated audio files inside the project file itself. That means that I have audio files inside the "Audio Files" folder (outside the project file), and AGAIN the same audio files (or some of them) inside the "Media" folder when showing the package content.

This is such a waste of storage. I've been showing the content of all of my latest projects and manually deleting the "Media" folder inside every single one - and all projects still open just fine after that, with no missing files. But this is also such a waste of time and I can't figure out a way to stop this from happening.

I attached a project where this happened. In this project, I was tracking bass for a client's song, so it's a pretty simple project, with only 4 audio tracks in total. The project file weighs 28,8MB, and if I delete the "Media" folder inside it, it goes down to around 1MB. That's a huge storage impact in the long run.

I also attached two screenshots: one of my template's Assets settings, and one of the options I use to save my Logic projects. I never ever change these.

This happens with about 50% of my Logic Projects but it's actually really random.

Edit: I can't attach the project example due to its size, so here's a download link: https://www.dropbox.com/s/lfx30t6l3l2muxn/huge%20project%20file%20size%20example.zip?dl=0dl=0

Any ideas?

Thanks!

28 Megabytes for a project with 4 audio tracks is about right. I don't see an issue there.

Why do you have Alchemy audio files selected in your Assets?

I think you have to select the previous option for Sampler so the Alchemy option gets highlighted.

With the media files and any backups inside the Project file removed, it gets down to 445KB, which is reasonable for a four track Project with no media files, edits, automation or Environment patches.

Audio files should not get duplicated inside *and* outside the Project file, so something is not right here.

Looking at the date of the audio files inside and outside the Project file, it looks like you opened your Template, recorded some takes, then did a Save As...

What happens is this: If you record into a newly created yet unsaved Project, the audio files have nowhere to go, thus they are stored inside that Project file which temporarily gets parked inside your Music folder. If you then save the Project, the audio files get duplicated to their proper location, but so does the Project file with its now unused audio files inside. At least that's my theory right now.

The very first action after creating a new Project should be to save it. I personally think Apple should make this mandatory, but that's just me. Try this and report if it solves the problem.

28 Megabytes for a project with 4 audio tracks is about right. I don't see an issue there.

 

Why do you have Alchemy audio files selected in your Assets?

I think you have to select the previous option for Sampler so the Alchemy option gets highlighted.

It is a lot. It is double the size of what the audio files were supposed to take. There's another 40MB of the same audio files the project file, inside the "Audio Files" folder. Think of this in the long run - that would be adding up a lot of bloat (in GBs) very quickly, considering I work with this full-time.

For example, a Pro Tools session file for something this small only weighs around 100KB, and all audio files are inside the "Audio Files" folder.

Not sure about the Alchemy option though. Gonna tick the Sampler option as you suggested and see if that does anything. Thanks!

With the media files and any backups inside the Project file removed, it gets down to 445KB, which is reasonable for a four track Project with no media files, edits, automation or Environment patches.

 

Audio files should not get duplicated inside *and* outside the Project file, so something is not right here.

 

Looking at the date of the audio files inside and outside the Project file, it looks like you opened your Template, recorded some takes, then did a Save As...

 

What happens is this: If you record into a newly created yet unsaved Project, the audio files have nowhere to go, thus they are stored inside that Project file which temporarily gets parked inside your Music folder. If you then save the Project, the audio files get duplicated to their proper location, but so does the Project file with its now unused audio files inside. At least that's my theory right now.

 

The very first action after creating a new Project should be to save it. I personally think Apple should make this mandatory, but that's just me. Try this and report if it solves the problem.

Yes! You get my point - audio files should not be stored inside AND outside the project file - only in one of these places.

Hmm, that's a good guess. I think this has happened to projects I saved before starting recording, but I could be wrong. I'll do a few tests by saving the project before working and check if the issue persists. Thanks a lot!

I always religiously save my empty project before I record or import any audio file into the project and have never suffered this issue so my guess is as Christian, that you started recording before saving the project.

I did a test and opened a new project, recorded an audio file before saving the project, then saved the project and recorded a dozen other audio files. Only the file that I recorded before saving the project was inside the project file package, and duplicated in the project folder audio files folder.

It still is a bug that needs reporting to the Logic team. But for now, it's a bug that can be avoided by following a strict workflow of always saving the empty project before you start working in it.

Meanwhile, I'll report the bug to the Logic team.

I always religiously save my empty project before I record or import any audio file into the project and have never suffered this issue so my guess is as Christian, that you started recording before saving the project.

 

I did a test and opened a new project, recorded an audio file before saving the project, then saved the project and recorded a dozen other audio files. Only the file that I recorded before saving the project was inside the project file package, and duplicated in the project folder audio files folder.

 

It still is a bug that needs reporting to the Logic team. But for now, it's a bug that can be avoided by following a strict workflow of always saving the empty project before you start working in it.

 

Meanwhile, I'll report the bug to the Logic team.

David, I also did the same test and got the same results. Only audio files that were recorded before saving the project get stored inside the project file.

And I also discovered that the same thing happens to imported audio files which Logic has to convert (for example, MP3 files that get converted to WAV by Logic when imported). I was noticing that many of my client's backing tracks were also being duplicated inside the project folder, but not all of them.

I imported an MP3 file, then saved the project, and imported a new MP3 file. Only the first one was duplicated.

So I think the final conclusion is that the bug happens to every audio file that Logic generates (be it converted or recorded) before saving the project..

David, I also did the same test and got the same results. Only audio files that were recorded before saving the project get stored inside the project file.

 

And I also discovered that the same thing happens to imported audio files which Logic has to convert (for example, MP3 files that get converted to WAV by Logic when imported). I was noticing that many of my client's backing tracks were also being duplicated inside the project folder, but not all of them.

 

I imported an MP3 file, then saved the project, and imported a new MP3 file. Only the first one was duplicated.

 

So I think the final conclusion is that the bug happens to every audio file that Logic generates (be it converted or recorded) before saving the project..

Yes indeed, and that makes sense, well I mean that make sense that the same bug would occur for both situations, thank you for reporting your findings!

I'm seeing this behavior now in a film scoring template. Loads of VI's powered off, samples purged etc. File sizes ballooning up to 2-3gb. I took a peak inside and it seems Logic is duplicating the movie file split audio files (Dx, Tmp) inside the media files folder, which added with project file backups accounts for the huge size. These are all saved as folders, and reference the audio within the audio files folder. If I delete the content from the media folder, Logic will repopulate it when re-saving. Any ideas? Using 10.7.3 on a new M1 MBP.