Tempo Marker

Hi folks,

having Flex View turned on and changing tempo in the Global Track, I can't see the Tempo Markers lines on the audio region [no blue lines displayed]

Any suggests?

Thanks

http://documentation.apple.com/en/logicpro/usermanual/index.html#chapter=16%26section=4%26tasks=true

http://documentation.apple.com/en/logicpro/usermanual/Art/S15/S1566_ELA_FlexMarkerTypes.png

Yes, it's normal that the blue lines don't show up at every tempo change.

They do show up in situations where you import audio files which contain tempo events from other projects/write tempo info into the file. They also pop up if you record a file in an area with with tempo changes/another tempo and move it to a new section - with Flex activated - and start to deal with export/import tempo commands (in order to make the files play back at the desired speed).

If you record a second region in that project, in an area with no tempo changes and move it to an area with tempo changes, the blue lines aren't shown, but the audio is stretched according to the tempo changes in that area (if Flex is on), and will turn green/orange.

But If you afterwards use "Import Tempo Information From Audio File" while that second region is selected, that region will not look green/orange anymore, but the original region (#1) will. It will also have the blue lines visible (because the tempo info is still in the file). The green/orange look of region 1 means that it will be stretched according to the tempo imported into the tempo list from region 2.

If you look in the tempo list, you'll see that the tempo events (in area # 1, where region # 1 was recorded) are removed for the length of region # 2. A new tempo is written from the start of region #2 (because Import Tempo Information From Audio File" was used).

It's both complex, confusing and feels a little.... backwards.

One confusing part of this (I may be wrong here) is that while region #2 also contains tempo information, it doesn't have a blue line in the beginning, but a white line at the end.

Another confusing thing is that these menu commands are named only after what they do technically, and not after why we would want to use them.

"Import Tempo Information From Audio File" seems to copy the tempo info "hidden" in that file into the tempo list, so "Copy the region's tempo events into the project's tempo list" would have been more descriptive. Maybe even the word "replace" should have been thrown in there, because this process will replace the existing tempo events for that area.

The process also resets that region to it's original (non-adjusted, not time stretched) length. This is something I often need when regions suddenly are stretched without me wanting it. I guess the most accurate description of all this would have been "Copy tempo from selected region into the tempo list and reset region length".... except that such a wording still wouldn't explain the users when we need to use this feature.

If all this sound greek to you, just don't worry about whether the blue lines are in there or not.

And - to avoid giving myself a headache I won't even try to describe how the blue lines/tempo markers behave in conjunction with "Export Tempo Information to Audio File", except that this command copies tempo from the tempo list into the audio file. I wish the manual had a detailed description of when we need these functions.

The bottom line:

1) if something is green/orange, it's stretched.

2) If you want it not to be stretched if it is, or vice versa, you often need one of these two features.

3) It is sometimes needed to use Remove Tempo Information From Audio File before using any of the the two other commands.

All these options are found under Options>Tempo.

Again, if you don't worry about the blue lines, but instead focus on 'green/orange' vs. 'shades of gray' you get a good picture of what's happening in the files.

I hope that all this will be simplified in a future Logic version.

ETA: I also hope that the text in the box which appears when you import an audio file ("Import Tempo Information?") will be reworded.

Since this dialog appears when I import an audio file, I'd expect that a 'No' to the question about importing tempo info would mean that only the audio is imported, and not the tempo info. Now, the tempo info isn't imported into the tempo list, but since it's still there, in the audio file, users are opt for some surprise if they think that only the audio material is imported: these hidden tempo events in the file can make regions suddenly change their length - in situations we don't want them to.

This is where an option to keep *but ignore* the tempo events in the file should be possible (they may be needed in other projects). Why? Because sometimes I want to use flex to clean up some notes in a file without automatically seeing the whole region changing length (when Flex is enabled).

Hehe...

AFAIR, that section in the manual is also hard to find by using the built in search function, which can be quite flakey. I sometimes have more success with Google when looking for stuff in the manual...

Unfortunately, manuals are written by people who either created these features or have been explained how they work by people who created them. They should IMHO rather be created by fools like me who struggle to figure out how (in this case) Flex and blue lines and reset region length work, and should be written within 10 minutes after we understood it all, otherwise we'll forget what we found difficult.

Or even better, rewrite Logic here and there to make everything simpler. And add a way to ignore tempo info in files please!

FlowerPower for President!!!!!

Thank you very much.

Time for me to RTFM

You could also have a read of this Book I've heard that it's very good

On reading this post my first reaction was the same as David's first post. Thanks for that great post FlowerPower.

Alan.