New version of Logic fears

[TimWheeler]

I'm getting that hair-rises-on-your-neck feeling there's another Logic version out soon, although I'm not holding my breath.

 

My phobia, though, involves whether the new version will operate in the same manner. I continue to invest time in learning the current version, but part of me is saying, don't waste too much time, as the next version may eliminate the need for that learning curve, or create new methods, altogether.

 

For example, I just went through the apple loops tip and compared it to working with Ableton Live!, thinking that the next version of Logic will have more Live!-like features for loop editing... making the mastery of apple-loop editing, while intriguing, worthwhile-not so much. (Plus, I have Live!)

 

I'm not trying to say I don't want to learn, I'm just afraid Apple is going to go in a drastically different direction, that although may be a good thing, will render much of what I've learned, lately useless. (as I'm a relatively new Logic user)

 

Sorry for the ramblings... but does anyone have the same feelings?

[Waterboy]

I hear you on your point - and agree with most (if not all) of it.

The thing that I keep thinking about is why would Apple change Logic? Although it may be a little more challenging than other DAW's, it is still very do-able, and the "learning curve" may be the thing that sets Logic apart from the rest!

I guess what I am saying is although I too wouldn't mind seeing an easier version of Logic, something like that could be a short-coming (IMHO).

 

Kind of like the old saying: if it was easy - everybody would be doing it! That's what makes up special!!

[eggman]

Just throwing this out there as a Gedankenexperiment:

 

I feel that Logic is perhaps too big for it's own good and that users might be better server by a audio production suite composed of smaller, more focused parts (similar to what apple has done with its final cut suite). There could be an app dedicated to composition, another to live performance, and then perhaps one that would let you design Audio and MIDI instruments and FX, for example.

 

Ah dunno, I've been hitting the Malteasers since three.

[arafel]

Oh I hear ya! I too have real trepidation, based on the complete lack of information on LP8, of the obsolescence of my LP7 skill set. Working methods, workarounds, hardware environments - all gone/ work for naught! Yikes.

 

All the time & energy spent on learning different working methods on dif systems (OS9 - wtf! Rebirth, Reason, Reactor, Live, Logic, Rax, Bias peak, etc) sometimes seems like such a waste compared to just actually making music. But... for me the DAW is the instrument - with a final track the end goal, so the more knowledge the better. Getting a call from a buddy working on a completely dif system (cubase, etc) and working out a problem - because of your ability to think in multiple dif terms - man thats gratifying too. The skills you've aquired will not go to waste - they are always usefull. Imagine starting a working relationship (a band, etc) with some guy, that happens to use the exact method that you've spent time struggling with - Voila - Payoff!

 

But... and here is the kicker. I'm not going to update - neither my hardware or my software for the foreseable future. Im good, my machine is good. I've built a stable and productive workstation (both on my G5 dual, and G4 lappy), that I find easy to workwith and enjoyable to compose on. I've developed consistent workhabits (Save, Save, Save, exported files go in folder with name & version of song, backup regularly, etc). I'm being productive with my DAW, so updates can wait.

 

 

PS. I think Live & Logic work really well together - its a great Rewire team. I've found Appleloops a little ham-handed (like needing to bounce one out, then import to be able to alter, slice&dice like regular aiff). For my working methods, I save 3 steps (tempo match, pitch match, organization) using Appleloops, but add on 3 (bounce, organize, import).

 

Use Whatever works... Keep makin Noize!

[Dave Jolley]

I hear you on your point - and agree with most (if not all) of it.

The thing that I keep thinking about is why would Apple change Logic? Although it may be a little more challenging than other DAW's, it is still very do-able, and the "learning curve" may be the thing that sets Logic apart from the rest!

I guess what I am saying is although I too wouldn't mind seeing an easier version of Logic, something like that could be a short-coming (IMHO).

 

Kind of like the old saying: if it was easy - everybody would be doing it! That's what makes up special!!

 

 

though I kind of agree with you, I think it's worth pointing out that apple's aesthetic around their apps seems so be in direct opposition to this. Seems to me apple tries to make everything as easy and accessible as possible, rather than value difficulty as a way to make their apps "special"

[Waterboy]

though I kind of agree with you, I think it's worth pointing out that apple's aesthetic around their apps seems so be in direct opposition to this. Seems to me apple tries to make everything as easy and accessible as possible, rather than value difficulty as a way to make their apps "special"

 

That is a good point! In the words of PC : Touche!!

 

[Tarekith]

I'm going through this too, do I hone my key commends and finger muscle memory as is, or keep making due with Live until Logic 8 is out? If Logic 8 isn't a lot different, not sure I want to keep using it to be honest.

[TimWheeler]

But... and here is the kicker. I'm not going to update - neither my hardware or my software for the foreseable future....I'm being productive with my DAW, so updates can wait.

 

Boy I wish I could claim I haven't said this a half-dozen times.

 

I know what you mean, but somehow some great unforseeable feature gets added that makes me eat my words.

[xs4is]

I understand where y'all are coming from, but the simple fact is we don't know when that update is actually going to happen, so we shouldn't let the ghost of a possability hold us back. Learn as much as you can, you won't be dissapointed.

 

I'm willing to bet that the functionality of Logic won't change much. Apple has a history of simplifying their apps, but I don't think they'd canabalize Logic to make it more Garageband like. Rather, I think they would make it more "layer" like. Simple functions on the "surface layer": recording, simple MIDI editing/programming; Medium stuff in the "middle layer": routing tracks, combining effects, more in-depth programming, etc; Hard stuff on the "bottom layer": deep Environment programming, computer networking, etc etc. That way anybody could have a shot at learning what Logic can do. I know that it's like that now, it's just not laid out in a logical sense. Everything is thrown together (not necessarily bad, just hard to grasp all at once).

 

Besides, Logic 8 will probably suck for the first few months as most major releases do. I'd wait for the first (or second) update to it before taking the plunge.

 

But that's just me.

X

[albertlopez]

What if Ableton Live 7 - which will be announced in the next few months - is so good, that we won't need to rewire Ableton to Logic anymore.

[David Nahmani]

What if Ableton Live 7 - which will be announced in the next few months - is so good, that we won't need to rewire Ableton to Logic anymore.

Well then I will need to redesign the site, change the domain name, and find a new job.

[tiny333]

aww come on guys dont worry be happy

 

you wont lose your skill sets etc as these are not confined to simple button pushing but rather an understanding of the process and needs of your creativity whatever it is ( 8 ) you will know what you want it to do....and hence make it do it... as we lead the tools and not the other way round

 

come on its going to be great ! nice pretty interface new icons ..better editing and everything!!!

 

im a bit fed up with this one its been the same since 1990!!

 

 

its only rock n roll

 

i mean i still think computers in general are pretty new fangled...

[Dave Jolley]

I'm going through this too, do I hone my key commends and finger muscle memory as is, or keep making due with Live until Logic 8 is out? If Logic 8 isn't a lot different, not sure I want to keep using it to be honest.

 

 

I can totally empathise with you, tarekith. I used to feel this way until I went through both of the official apple books on logic. Now I'm using far more than live, and far more quickly. Between logic and melodyne, I currently have no need for live (except DJing).

 

I encourage you to stick with it, I think you'll be happy you did! I know I am

[Tarekith]

Honestly it's only frustrating for me because of all the little gotcha's I keep running into, small bugs here and there that aren't easily reproduced (like snap mode not working all the time, or core audio errors, see my other threads). I feel comfortable using it, read the manuals twice, watched the Macprovideos, etc. It's not lack of understanding for me, or not seeing where the benefits are compared to other DAWs (configurability, full customized key commands, etc).

 

It's that it's decidedly a bit dated feeling compared to other apps in the same vein. Honestly it really reminds me of Cubase VST5 in so many ways. You could tell that that it was a midi app, where the audio side of things was tacked on later. It doesn't have that integrated workflow, where you can do a great deal of detailed work all in one view. I'm really hoping that the next version of Logic is a rewrite similar to SX, where they finally tied everything together into one methodology, cleaned up the code, and approached it with an audio first mentality.

 

I switched to a Mac from PC back in October, and so far it has been a revelation on all fronts in terms of ease of use, well thought out software, and consistancy across apps. Except for Logic, which does not feel like an Apple app AT ALL (and I know it's only been a short time since the Emagic buy out). Which as a musician is what I want the most.

 

I'm not bashing Logic here, it's just that it's SO CLOSE to what I think a DAW should be. I can see the potential of what it could be, now it's just a question of waiting to see if that actually gets delivered. I'll admit, while Live is MUCH less powerful than Logic, the developers clearly communicate with their users, and each new update bring a load of oft-requested improvements from it's user base. It's very obvious they listen to their customers, and implement solutions in a way that doesn't break from the ableton way of thinking. That's very important to me. It's one reason I like and support developers like Ableton and u-he.

 

Anyway, i'm just anxious for news of what's next like everyone else. It should be obvious to anyone that logic is gettig a bit long in the tooth now, so it's only natural that we start to pine for news of the next best thing. After all, these are tools many of us use for hours each day, almost everyday. And for all my er... complaining, I'm still going to be spending the rest of the night working on my new CD....

 

...in Logic.

[Dave Jolley]

Right on, totally understood. I still miss the immediacy of audio editing like it is in cubase as well.

 

My personal workaround as far as audio goes has been melodyne, and I've never been happier with audio! I don't think I'll use live anymore, melodyne just sounds WAY too good. I run logic and melodyne simultaneously but not rewired or bridged, and have a couple of key commands set up for quick bouncing and exporting of regions. dump em in melodyne, fix em and bring em back into logic, only takes a sec and is incredibly clean and flexible, it's really been amazing!