Workflow tips for PT (ex) users

[nikkik]

Hi!

Hope this is a good place for this. I am figuring that there wil be more PT users considering Logic Studio, Logic 8 specifically. I do not think anyone would argue that both apps are capable of providing the end user with a great set of tools... just that each have their own manner of accomplishing certain tasks. That said, let them flow!

 

(I hope this is in the right section, and also hope people will refrain from starting a "feature war" between the two. I simply feel that Logic is capable of many/most things PT provides, and vice-versa; as such, for those of us coming from that foreign land- help please? )

[nikkik]

I will go first!

PT: Region Groups

Logic: Folders, and Folder Tracks.

 

Pro Tools has Region groups, which (simply put) are when a user selects a number of regions in a session, and then..groups them. It forms a larger region, and the region then can apear in the Region List, and also in the workspace.

 

For those coming from that, Logic has something similar. Some might say cooler, some might not.

 

Folders, and Folder Tracks.

Select the regions you want to "group" or what Logic calls "pack," and then, well, pack them into a Folder. If you expand the Folder, or instead simply double-click it (which moves you down a level in hierarchy), which then shows the contents of that Folder in the Arrange Window, on tracks the same as the ones the regions were on when originally packed. (see my next tip, voices, for more on this aspect).

 

Examples of usefullness might be:

Select all the regions on your drum tracks, and then pack them. Walla! You now have a single "drum folder track" in the top level of hierarchy in the Arrange Window, much cleaner and easier to work with for some/most.

 

Another:

Pack the regions that make up a verse; a chorus; intro; outro; etc. Now simply shuffle those folder regions around to play with different versions of your song. You could even go so far as to pack folders within folders. For instance, pack the drum regions for the verse, then guitars, vocals, etc, each in their own folder, then stick those folder regions into a single Verse folder. Navigating the levels wthin the Arrange window will make sense as you try this, and the flexability and power this affords should become apparent quite quickly. You could even duplicate a track with a folder containing your verse, chorus, intro, outro, etc folders, and then mute th eoriginal track, and then drop down a level in the duplicate, and reorder the folders/regions within that folder, creating a new "playlist" or song arrangement. Repeat to your heart's content! VERY powerful!!!

[nikkik]

PT: Voices

Logic: Objects

 

OK, this is a simple one, and a complex one.

 

Pro Tools uses "voices" (except, in practical use, with PT LE/MP with the MPT or LE + DV Toolkit 2, which simply has...tracks.). Basically, each track requires a "voice" to have the audio flow "out" of the channel strip.

 

Logic is similar: it uses an "Object." I will only use the Audio Object here, for simplicity's sake. When you have an Audio Track in the Arrange window, and have regions of audio on it, that audio needs an "Audio Object" to be..well, let's say "voiced." This means that if you choose to use the same Audio Object for two or more Audio Tracks to flow thru, you have a problem. The Audio Object can only have one stream passing thru it, so one will have priority. If you come from PT HD/TDM, this is simple to relate to, as you have most likely used, or know of, manual voicing. This is almost EXACTLY the same!

 

Previous versions of Logic used this a bit more, especially with comp'ing and such. With the new Takes/Comps feature in Logic 8, one need not *resort* to multiple track assignment to the same Audio Object (ala manual voicing) to perform these comps. Of course, it is still usefull to understand, and understand how to use it to your advantage IMO.

 

The impact of this goes beyond the TDM equiv. tho. Since multiple Audio Tracks in Logic can be assigned to the same Audio Object for voicing, this means that if you mute one fo those Audio Tracks in the Arrange window, that does not mean you will not have sound passing thru the Audio Object! If any other tracks are assinged to this Audio Object, then they will be given next priority to use the Audio Object.

 

This will also allow one to understand how Folder Tracks and Folder Regions work a bit better I think. When you drop down a level in the Arrange window by double clicking a Folder Region, you will see tracks, and regions on those tracks. Those tracks will be assigned to various Objects for their "voicing." This remains as such, even when you go back up a level- those Object assigments remain, and priority remains.

 

Summarized, Objects can be likened to voices for the actual tracks in the Arrange window. The tracks themselves do not directly "connect" to your hardware; they always pass thru an Object; that Object is (can be) assigned to the track, either automatically, or manually. Just as you have a set number of voices in PT that are available for use, so you have with Audio Objects (and other types) in Logic. However, it differs a bit: For example, PT LE is limited to 32 of these voices (stock LE); Logic has 255 Audio Objects you can use to voice those Audio Tracks!

 

I am sure someone more knowledgable could expand and/or correct me on this....

[fader8]

Spotting Regions to the Playhead

 

Pro Tools, in Slip mode, lets you spot to the playbar when you ctrl-opt-click and drag from the region list to any track you like. The same key command is used if the region is already on the track.

 

Logic Pro 8 now uses command-click and drag from the bin to anywhere on the Arrange and it will land only on the selected track at the playhead. If the region is already on the track, use the Pickup Clock command.

 

Beware of selecting a region in the bin and then using the Pickup Clock command. If the region is used elsewhere in the project, those will move too. To avoid this, use the bin command "Add Region" to make a copy of the region before placing a duplicate in the Arrange.

 

(The old Logic 7 "command-click" one shot from the audio window is gone in Logic Pro 8.)

[dkgross]

Spotting Regions to the Playhead

 

Beware of selecting a region in the bin and then using the Pickup Clock command. If the region is used elsewhere in the project, those will move too. To avoid this, use the bin command "Add Region" to make a copy of the region before placing a duplicate in the Arrange.

 

lordy..that's just stupid. if you have created a killer 'explosion', and want to 'spot' it at 5 different timecode locations, do you have to make 5 copies of the region??

 

I think this is one area that PTools shines. Once a region is created (and or put in the timeline', it exists as it's own entity...option-drag it to make a copy, and changes to THAT copy don't affect any of the other ones!

[fader8]

Nudging Region Content by Value

 

Pro Tools 7: Hold ctrl and press + or - on the numeric keypad moves region content by the current Nudge value.

 

Logic Pro 8: There is no exact equivelant, but, SMPTE lock the region and drag the left bottom corner. The content will nudge by the current snap value. Note that this changes the region length because the region's end still maintains its relationship to the content. (I find this better sometimes than the Pro Tools way). There is no key command for this.

 

Both methods assume you have sufficient content "handles" outside the region itself.

[fader8]

I think this is one area that PTools shines. Once a region is created (and or put in the timeline', it exists as it's own entity...option-drag it to make a copy, and changes to THAT copy don't affect any of the other ones!

 

Dave, I think you misunderstood. Logic works the same way. I'm referring only to when and if you selected a region in the "bin". If you drag a region to the Arrange from the bin, then do it again to another place, then selecting the region in the bin, not the track, selects both regions. So yes, option dragging the track region is better than dragging from the bin for additional copies within the project because it makes a new region. PT has its own weirdness with this stuff too.

 

Interestingly, if you drag twice from the bin to the same track, then one acts completely like an alias of the other. If put on different tracks, then they don't.

[i]

Spotting Regions to the Playhead

(The old Logic 7 "command-click" one shot from the audio window is gone in Logic Pro 8.)

 

This works fine with my Dual 2.0 PPC/10.4.11./LP8.

 

i

[fader8]

Spotting Regions to the Playhead

(The old Logic 7 "command-click" one shot from the audio window is gone in Logic Pro 8.)

 

This works fine with my Dual 2.0 PPC/10.4.11./LP8.

i

 

But now it creates a new track for itself. It used to place the region on the selected track. If you've found a way to override that without using Add to Arrange->Use Existing Tracks, I'm all ears! . . or eyes in this case.

[i]

Hi.

You're right. I have no solution to that. Let's wait for an update.

 

i

[dkgross]

Interestingly, if you drag twice from the bin to the same track, then one acts completely like an alias of the other. If put on different tracks, then they don't.

 

that's just bizzare

[n8tron]

One workflow that I think I miss the most in pro tools is the selector tools ability to control the playhead. That and the smart tool.

 

a half way tip for in Logic is to use the marquee tool. If you click and hold for a second longer on a position in the timeline the playhead will start from there next. It fairly annoying, and when I'm working fast I have to think about it, where in pro tools the playhead always just seemed to be where I wanted it to be.

 

I hope they make a smart tool, or at least get rid of that hold time in logic.

[bluedog]

Could I have missed a feature in L8 to bounce (ie: generate stems from different outs simultaneously) as possible in PT?

 

I mean talking about workflow...on a score that took me 2 weeks to complete, I then had to spend 3 weeks generating all the stereo stems!...

 

Thanks in advance for your feedback!

B

[fader8]

Could I have missed a feature in L8 to bounce (ie: generate stems from different outs simultaneously) as possible in PT?

 

Apparently you did.

 

I mean talking about workflow...on a score that took me 2 weeks to complete, I then had to spend 3 weeks generating all the stereo stems!...

 

Well, perhaps you should have asked first, or checked the manual.

 

This works pretty much the same way as it does in PT. Mix your stems to a bus/aux, set up stem tracks and source the input of each one from each bus. Record all your stems at once.

[bluedog]

....hi F8...thank you for your FB...!

 

Just to make sure, (BTW, as soon as I knew that it looked like I might have to do without any engineer for most of it, I did attempt the manual...AND I did ask my L7 friends...but obviously not enough...) I'll have to make a little more sense of your instructions, forgive the basic questions, but will this :

 

1-work with an audio starting point and Midi starting point alike?

 

2-include the processing all the way down the path....?

 

Thanks again.

B

[fader8]

1-work with an audio starting point and Midi starting point alike?

 

Sure, wherever you start it from, just like PT..

 

2-include the processing all the way down the path....?

 

Yes, all the processing you include in the path to, and including, the aux you're submixing to. But you can choose where you want to tap audio from by which objects you assign to the bus.