Region automation won't draw single points anymore

[phermann]

Hey there,

I changed my computer recently to a MacMini 2020 M1 and upgraded to Logic 10.7.2.

Since I did this, I have trouble drawing in midi automation with the pencil tool. Instead of drawing lots of single points as it used to, it only draws in two points connected by a straight line (thus making it impossible to have a fine tuned automation line). Do any of you have an idea whether this is a bug or whether I can change some setting to get back the "old" way of drawing it in?

Thanks a lot in advance!

[polanoid]

Works here, just penciled this in using 10.7.2:

[polanoid]

Or, if by MIDI automation you meant controller data:

[polanoid]

In the automation prefs, what's your setting for this? If it's "Hold Option for Curved Editing", you will need to hold the option modifier when using the Pencil tool. Or just change it to "Hold Option for Stepped Editing"

[phermann]

Thanks for your quick ideas! In fact I am talking about the controller data.

The automation preferences are on "Hold Option for Stepped Editing". My secondary tool for the piano roll is the pencil. However, I tried holding down Command, Option or both of them whilst trying to draw points but to no avail. It always draws only one straight line.

Also, (I don't know whether this is connected or not), when I try to work on track automation, the automation lines don't move while I drag. It's only once I release the mouse button that the line snaps to the new position (which is pretty annoying when you would like to see what you're doing)

[polanoid]

Also, (I don't know whether this is connected or not), when I try to work on track automation, the automation lines don't move while I drag. It's only once I release the mouse button that the line snaps to the new position (which is pretty annoying when you would like to see what you're doing)

 

Not seeing this here either... are you on an M1 machine? I'm still on Intel, maybe there's a difference...

 

Edit: Saw you already wrote you're on M1. So I guess that might be the cause. Let's hope the issue gets fixed soon then.

[David Nahmani]

It sounds like you're trying to draw an automation curve while the Note Velocity parameter is selected? Which controller specifically is selected in your Automation Parameter pop-up menu? Can you share a screenshot of what you're seeing? How to attach files to your post

[phermann]

I mainly want to draw in modulation data, although this seems to happen on other controller data as well.

I used the mod wheel to enter the mod data in the first place

But when I try to fine tune it (with holding command and drawing) I get this (instead of another line of many small steps). It seems to only record the first and the last step and then connects it with a straight line.

[polanoid]

I mainly want to draw in modulation data, although this seems to happen on other controller data as well.

I used the mod wheel to enter the mod data in the first place

Before.jpg

But when I try to fine tune it (with holding command and drawing) I get this (instead of another line of many small steps). It seems to only record the first and the last step and then connects it with a straight line.

After.jpg

 

Seems to work here as well, see attached video, recorded on 2019 MacBook Pro 16'' with Logic 10.7.2

Screen Recording 2021-12-15 at 09.58.14.mp4.zip

[polanoid]

BTW David, is it possible to attach a video to a post without zipping it first?

[David Nahmani]

BTW David, is it possible to attach a video to a post without zipping it first?

Hey polanoid, in that post I explain how you can attach a video to a post in Logic Pro Help: Re: How to attach files to your post

[polanoid]

Ah thanks. Seems like zipping is the quickest and easiest way then

[phermann]

Good to know, I tried to upload a video first but hadn't read this post. So here you can see the problem in action:

[polanoid]

That looks bad indeed. Can other people with M1 machines reproduce this?

[David Nahmani]

Ah thanks. Seems like zipping is the quickest and easiest way then

I find that LiceCap is the quickest and easiest way. It also embeds the video in your post rather than requesting others to download a file that they then have to open in another app to playback.

[phermann]

Hey there, just wanted to know whether anyone around here has an idea what I could do in order to fix this issue?

[snerkler]

Thanks for your quick ideas! In fact I am talking about the controller data.

The automation preferences are on "Hold Option for Stepped Editing". My secondary tool for the piano roll is the pencil. However, I tried holding down Command, Option or both of them whilst trying to draw points but to no avail. It always draws only one straight line.

Also, (I don't know whether this is connected or not), when I try to work on track automation, the automation lines don't move while I drag. It's only once I release the mouse button that the line snaps to the new position (which is pretty annoying when you would like to see what you're doing)

I have the M1 Max running the latest Monterey and Logic Pro X and can confirm that mine has the same annoying issue. However, I have found that if I hold option whilst dragging the automation point it behaves as you would expect.

[phermann]

Glad to hear someone else is experiencing this! Holding the option key doesn't work for me though...

[snerkler]

Glad to hear someone else is experiencing this! Holding the option key doesn't work for me though...

On trying it again it doesn't really work for me as it selects several points and drags them, so whilst you can see the points moving and the parameters changing it's no use if you just want to adjust one point.

 

I've submitted it on the apple feedback page, have you done the same? Hopefully the more people that mention it the more apple will take not and come out with a fix.

 

https://www.apple.com/feedback/logic-pro.html

[polanoid]

Copied from the other thread on this subject:

 

Wait a sec... Found this on discussions.apple.com:

"I found a work-around: The problem seems to arise when have the application BetterSnapTool (https://apps.apple.com/us/app/bettersnaptool/id417375580) running (it's a productivity toll that rearranges windows on the screen). This app was been working fine with Logic up until 10.7, but now they seem to clash. When I close this app, Logic behaves as expected."

Maybe that (or a similar app) is the culprit for you as well?

 

EDIT: Just installed BetterSnapTool , just to check, and indeed the issue happens here as well now.

Edited December 20, 2021 by polanoid

[phermann]

Wow, that did the trick for both issues!! Thank you so much for the hint!

I wrote the initial problems to Apple, (not mentioning the BetterSnapTool however), but until there is a fix for this I know what to do to get around it. Thanks a lot!

[snerkler]

Copied from the other thread on this subject:

 

Wait a sec... Found this on discussions.apple.com:

"I found a work-around: The problem seems to arise when have the application BetterSnapTool (https://apps.apple.com/se/app/bettersna ... 5580?mt=12) running (it's a productivity toll that rearranges windows on the screen). This app was been working fine with Logic up until 10.7, but now they seem to clash. When I close this app, Logic behaves as expected."

Maybe that (or a similar app) is the culprit for you as well?

 

Thanks for this, disabling better snap certainly fixes the glitch with regards to dragging an automation point, but it doesn't seem to fix the drawing issue although that being said I've never done that before so could well be user error.

[polanoid]

Here it seems to make a difference if I do a long click before starting drawing or dragging: If I click and then wait for a bit before I move the mouse, both issues happen. If I immediately start dragging, both issues do *not* happen. Do you see that too?

[polanoid]

BTW the question is if Apple can fix this at all or if BetterSnapTool does something it shouldn't do...

[snerkler]

BTW the question is if Apple can fix this at all or if BetterSnapTool does something it shouldn't do...

I'm not sure, maybe they should liaise with each other. I've just been using it some more and it's still not 100% perfect with bettersnap disabled although perfectly usable.

[polanoid]

Which issues do you see without BetterSnapTool running? Please be specific.

[snerkler]

Which issues do you see without BetterSnapTool running? Please be specific.

When dragging the automation point sometimes it won't move initially and it shows the little dash that I mentioned before then all of a sudden the automation point will snap to the mouse pointer and then move as expected.

 

As for the drawing of lines in the piano roll, at the moment it only seems to want to draw straight lines for me regardless of whether I have the automation preference set to "hold option for stepped editing" or "hold option for curved editing". However, I've never used this function before so it's likely to be something I'm doing wrong and need to learn how to 'draw' automation rather than just adding points.

[David Nahmani]

When dragging the automation point sometimes it won't move initially and it shows the little dash that I mentioned before then all of a sudden the automation point will snap to the mouse pointer and then move as expected.

Sounds like the normal behavior is you have Snap Automation active?

 

As for the drawing of lines in the piano roll, at the moment it only seems to want to draw straight lines for me regardless of whether I have the automation preference set to "hold option for stepped editing" or "hold option for curved editing". However, I've never used this function before so it's likely to be something I'm doing wrong and need to learn how to 'draw' automation rather than just adding points.

Are you drawing with the Pencil tool?

[snerkler]

When dragging the automation point sometimes it won't move initially and it shows the little dash that I mentioned before then all of a sudden the automation point will snap to the mouse pointer and then move as expected.

Sounds like the normal behavior is you have Snap Automation active?

 

As for the drawing of lines in the piano roll, at the moment it only seems to want to draw straight lines for me regardless of whether I have the automation preference set to "hold option for stepped editing" or "hold option for curved editing". However, I've never used this function before so it's likely to be something I'm doing wrong and need to learn how to 'draw' automation rather than just adding points.

Are you drawing with the Pencil tool?

It doesn't matter whether snap's enable or not, and it seems to have a mind of its own, sometimes it will do it sometimes not. And yes, trying to draw with the pencil tool

[polanoid]

Sounds like the normal behavior is you have Snap Automation active?

 

 

Are you drawing with the Pencil tool?

It doesn't matter whether snap's enable or not, and it seems to have a mind of its own, sometimes it will do it sometimes not. And yes, trying to draw with the pencil tool

 

It would be great if you could provide videos of what you're doing. Could help to explain what's happening.