Step FX: is it possible to set the start position of the plugin, where the plugin starts its counts of Steps?

[BenjaminOe]

Step FX: is it possible to set the start position of the plugin, where the plugin starts its counts of Steps? Or will it always be on beat 1 of the project?

I have tried to bypass the plugin, but it seems that the plugin "runs in the background"/is locked to project start(?). This can make it complicated to work with, when having changing time signatures.

 - In another Topic/forum post I ask if its possible to automate the number of steps, because that would mitigate the problem. But so far that does not seem to be possible.

If not I'll just have to stick with workarounds.

[David Nahmani]

Indeed in Step FX the steps are hard-synced to Logic's grid when the transport is running (during recording or playback). 

[scg]

Just as a heads up, Step FX is vulnerable to Logic's 'timeline-synced plugin latency compensation' bug/idiosyncrasy, so irrespective of the issues you're trying to solve, Step FX may be out of time anyway in some cases, depending on your project configuration.

I realize non-free software may not be an option you're considering, but it seems appropriate to mention Cableguys' ShaperBox as an alternative, because its MIDI trigger feature solves both the delay compensation problem, and also the problem you're trying to solve, that is, re-triggering or re-aligning the pattern to correspond to e.g. changing time signatures and so on. The interface and approach is different from that of Step FX, so it's by no means a one-to-one drop-in replacement, but it performs a similar function.

There are free alternatives as well, such as A1TriggerGate, but unfortunately I don't know one off the top of my head that provides an external trigger option of some sort, which is likely what you need both for your purposes, and to overcome any latency compensation issues that might arise. (Maybe A1TriggerGate has this, but I don't remember encountering that feature last time I looked at it.)

Edited May 14, 2023 by scg

[scg]

One more thing. You can do some very cool stuff in Logic with the step sequencer and automation. As with e.g. ShaperBox, it's a different approach and not a one-to-one replacement for Step FX, but it might be worth experimenting with, and would solve any issues related to re-triggering and time signatures and so on.

[BenjaminOe]

Thanks a lot for your replies David Nahmani and scg. 

scg

I'll look in to your alternative suggestions with A1Triggergate, and Logic Step Sequencer and maybe even Shaperbox

I haven´t delved in to the Logic step sequencer with automation, but it seems promising as well as the third party plugins.

Meanwhile I came up with a way that might work using the Step FX in Writing mode, where I can stamp in automation by enabling cyclemode and setting the automation to write for that area. But then again I take note of your warning/heads up regarding the "Logic's 'timeline-synced plugin latency compensation'bug/idiosyncrasy". 

Would printing/bounce in place solve that idiosyncrasy?

-Regarding that "timeline-synced plugin latency compensation'bug/idiosyncrasy", would you care to explain to me what that means or point me in direction to learn more about it? -Right now I am experiencing some oddness in the form of

1)the Step FX engaging slightly after the plugin as been de-bypassed (bypass off),

and

2)  Step FX automation reading behaving differently upon repeat / not reading the Bypass information upon cycle repeat. 

Could those issues be related to the "timeline-synced plugin latency compensation'bug/idiosyncrasy" or are they seperate issue all together for whole other topic?

Thanks again,

Benjamin

[Danny Wyatt]

This is not a "solution", but I tend to do what works for me before I try to buy another plugin that I will probably use once or twice. And it's always fun to come up with workarounds, when there's no other option (other than buying another plugin):

if I were in the same situation I would just duplicate Step FX and automate the depth of Step FX #1 to 0% when I need Step FX #2 and vice versa. Not the ideal solution, but hey, if it works...

I tend to automate depth and stuff like that instead of plugin on/off (bypass), because in the past, turning plugins on/off would not be in synch with the project so I stopped doing that completely. It seems you are experiencing the same thing when you activate the plugin again, right? If so I would suggest automating the depth, the output, etc, and just leave the plugin always on.

Now for example if you already have a pattern you like and you suddenly see it's starting at the wrong beat, just shift it left/right:

Again, this is not the perfect solution, but if it's something you do once in a while, why having another plugin on the list when you have the tools right there for you to use, right?

Hope this helps

Edited May 18, 2023 by Danny Wyatt

[scg]

2 hours ago, BenjaminOe said:

Would printing/bounce in place solve that idiosyncrasy?

Sure, if you get the timing the way you want it, you can always freeze/bounce to avoid any subsequent timing issues that might be introduced.

Quote

-Regarding that "timeline-synced plugin latency compensation'bug/idiosyncrasy", would you care to explain to me what that means or point me in direction to learn more about it?

It's been discussed in quite a few threads here and elsewhere. For example, it's the second item listed here. I've posted example projects demonstrating the behavior (using Step FX I think), but without digging around I'm not sure in what thread(s) I did that.

The issue is that one of the things that can be thrown off by incorrect latency compensation is plugins that are 'locked' to the timeline in some way, like Step FX. Basically, under certain circumstances involving the presence of enough accumulated plugin latency, the timing of such plugins will be shifted noticeably.

Quote

 

-Right now I am experiencing some oddness in the form of

1)the Step FX engaging slightly after the plugin as been de-bypassed (bypass off),

 

There are also issues with latency compensation and automated plugin bypasses (or perhaps just with bypass automation timing in general), so you may be running into that here. So that may be a separate issue.

@Danny Wyatt's suggestion is a good one, and is also a common way of getting around any difficulties with bypass automation. It won't solve the timeline sync problem, should you run into it, but it could address the original problem of needing to 're-trigger' Step FX.

 

[Danny Wyatt]

23 minutes ago, scg said:

It won't solve the timeline sync problem, should you run into it, but it could address the original problem of needing to 're-trigger' Step FX.

When I need a sequence that starts on a different beat, I just shift the whole sequence left or right so it matches the beginning of my "riff" so for example StepFX #1 could be for everything starting at beat 1, StepFX #2 would be for everything that starts at beat 3, by shifting the sequence to the right X amount of steps

Edited May 18, 2023 by Danny Wyatt

[scg]

44 minutes ago, Danny Wyatt said:

When I need a sequence that starts on a different beat, I just shift the whole sequence left or right so it matches the beginning of my "riff" so for example StepFX #1 could be for everything starting at beat 1, StepFX #2 would be for everything that starts at beat 3, by shifting the sequence to the right X amount of steps

Sorry, by 'timeline sync problem', I was referring to Logic's issues with timeline-synced plugins and latency compensation, not the original question regarding time signature changes and so on. Your suggestion does indeed address the latter, but the former is (alas) a different problem.