Adaptive Limiter behavior

[bonesproject]

I am using the adaptive limiter on my master bus. I am hitting the input at -3.0 peak. I have ceiling set at -0.1 , I am adding 7.7 dbs of gain and the out put is at -0.1 (as expected). If I bump the gain up to +8.0, the output reduces to -0.2 although I have not changed anything else. Does this indicate that I've pushed too far? It seems weird that if the ceiling is set at -0.1 and the gain is increased that the output would decrease...

Thanks for any explanations

[lagerfeldt]

I think it has an option for inter-sample peak protection. I never use it, but check out the extended parameters by clicking on the disclosure triangle.

[Bouncer]

I find adaptive limiter having an error of Out Ceiling being - 0.8 dB when set to 0 dB....

[bonesproject]

Thanks. It's not that I'm worried about that .1db of level, but I have a need to understand what happened to it. If I raise the gain higher yet, the output reduces to -.3db although the ceiling is still set at -.1

[Eriksimon]

I have a need to understand what happened to it.

 

I think the real, and geeky, and scientificish explanation probably would point at the inherent unpredictability of the processed material and the nonlinear behavior of the Adaptive (!) Limiters' algorithm (modelled on similarly nonlinear behaviour of electric currents in analog circuits) at more extreme and fidelity-compromising settings. But, in the end, those are meaningless numbers. It may even be that that is not what is happening (in actual levels), but that the refresh rate of the meter misses things.

 

What I was trying to say: don't worry about it.

[Jope]

I haven't been happy with Adaptive Limiter in the past, and I'm not using it anymore.

Predictable - hmmmm, an elastic term, there's more than numbers, but still you can learn what to expect if there is predictability. (Well, astrologers and meteorologists even tell you what will happen where there is no predictability at all.)

I found Adaptive Limiter too little predictable, yes. There is someone working with your material in it whom you can't talk with. What is worse, I had distortion (but not clipping!) with it. Sometimes. Unpredictdably.

Ah, no. I'm back to using the simple Limiter to push the level a bit without clipping and try to do the rest by the mix. But of course it also depends on the musical orientation, the sound you expect, the dynamic range you want etc.

[Rev. Juda Sleaze]

For a very cheap alternative, I would recommend ToneBoosters' Barricade limiter.

[Bouncer]

I find adaptive limiter having an error of Out Ceiling being - 0.8 dB when set to 0 dB....

 

works fine now as it should..... maybe in some cases it tries to adapt, lol

 

its a better sounding limiter than the regular one tho

[zakkleifeste]

I've gone through the same thing.

 

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=87611&p=460329&hilit=adaptive+limiter#p460329

[bonesproject]

Thanks for that link and for everybody's info. I guess I'll just accept it and move on....and take it easy on the gain as well

[Rev. Juda Sleaze]

For a very cheap alternative, I would recommend ToneBoosters' Barricade limiter.

 

This is worth checking out. It's very good, the free trial is unlimited ( ) except for not saving presets, and it costs like 15 euros.

[Bouncer]

can anyone confirm that using multiple instances of Adaptive limiter creates mad latency when playing live midi...... i am on 128 buffer and my delay is about a second... i have maybe over a dozen of adaptive limiters open... never had this kind of delay in my entire life....all playing back fine tho...

[Eriksimon]

The AdLimiter can be very latent, depending on its Lookahead setting. This lookahead setting can be set from 20 to 200 ms, so the basic latency of 1 AdLimiter is at least 20 ms, probably more. You can find this at the bottom of the AL, just click the disclosure triangle.

 

 

Having said that, it is unusual (I'd almost say "wrong") to use these sort of plugins live, it is considered more of a mixing/mastering plugin, because it has this inherent latency. Also I fear for how your live sound must be, with that many AdLimiters it must be squeezing the life out of it...?

Try using the simple Compressor instead.

[Bouncer]

thanks for the reply.....

 

i use it on different tracks... some have gain to the full... the regular limiter sounds sterile to me... this one adds nice color to the sound... the lookaheads are set to 50ms... i had no clue it could cause latency.. in the end i will turn them all off to see what happens

[Rev. Juda Sleaze]

You don't have to turn them all off individually, just turn low latency mode on.

[Bouncer]

great tip judas... i somehow forgot all about the low latency mode... used it before too...

[Rev. Juda Sleaze]

You're welcome

 

But remember that if you've got all those limiters slapped on everything, you'll most likely have to turn your main output down. I'd suggest inserting a gain plug-in on your stereo-out with the correct amount of attenuation for when low latency mode is on, then you can option-click it to turn it on and off for using LLM.

[denitronik]

Thank you Rev. for the "ToneBooster" link, I just bought the limiter (Barricade) and really like it!

[Rev. Juda Sleaze]

Thank you Rev. for the "ToneBooster" link, I just bought the limiter (Barricade) and really like it!

 

Yeah, it's much better than I was expecting!

 

The inter-sample peak protection is a nice feature too.

 

Really good, cheap investment for people who need a bit more level and clarity than the AdLimiter can give.

[Bouncer]

These adaptive limiters do create massive amount of latency.... I just switched about 10 of them for the regular limiters and the latency is gone....

[Bouncer]

Thank you Rev. for the "ToneBooster" link, I just bought the limiter (Barricade) and really like it!

 

guys i dont know much about limiters, only the fact that they "limit" the peaks.... just curious how is this one better than the one(s) in Logic? thanks

[Rev. Juda Sleaze]

Thank you Rev. for the "ToneBooster" link, I just bought the limiter (Barricade) and really like it!

 

guys i dont know much about limiters, only the fact that they "limit" the peaks.... just curious how is this one better than the one(s) in Logic? thanks

 

Very basically, you can add more gain before it distorts.

[denitronik]

Also "Barricade" has more control (attack, release...) and the metering is much better than Logic's "Adaptive Limiter".

[Bouncer]

Judas thank you for suggesting this plugin..... It is very very very good.... much much much better than any other limiter i have ever tried in my life..... i cant believe what it does to the sound.... amazing algorithm

[Rev. Juda Sleaze]

Judas thank you for suggesting this plugin..... It is very very very good.... much much much better than any other limiter i have ever tried in my life..... i cant believe what it does to the sound.... amazing algorithm

 

Hey, no problem!

 

It is very good, much more transparent than other software limiters I've used, and never "pumps". Unbelievable for the price!