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Normalize Region Gain Issue


PJ Jin
Go to solution Solved by fuzzfilth,

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Unless it appears in a change log as fixed, it is not fixed

Actually there have been many bug fixes that were not listed in any release notes.

 

The most helpful thing you can do if you encounter this issue again would be to share a project where this happens so we can reproduce the issue and even possibly forward it directly to the Logic team if we can reproduce it.

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NB It has been my experience over many versions of Logic that the Normalize Region Gain function will make no adjustments to regions that have a level of 0.0 (like many normalized tracks one might get). The regions just stay at 0.0. If you adjust the gain of the underlying audio file and reduce it by a tiny amount (no longer 0.0) the Normalize Region Gain will adjust.
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NB It has been my experience over many versions of Logic that the Normalize Region Gain function will make no adjustments to regions that have a level of 0.0 (like many normalized tracks one might get). The regions just stay at 0.0. If you adjust the gain of the underlying audio file and reduce it by a tiny amount (no longer 0.0) the Normalize Region Gain will adjust.

That is exactly the bug that is fixed in 10.6.1 already, so I'm wondering if you still experience it (as from your signature your're on 10.6.3 already)? If so, an example project - or steps how to reproduce this - might help, also to clarify what Cocker reports. FWIW I can not reproduce this in 10.6.1 or later versions.

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I haven't run in to any tracks shipped to me with 0.0 levels, so hadn't realized the "no change" bug was fixed.

As I watch your video, number 2 in particular, I can't quite see what is wrong. After Normalize Region Gain the Gain field in the region inspector should have the offset value that is applied to assure the peak gain of -6. I have no expectation that any of the gain offsets will be the same on a region to region basis.

 

Are you expecting the Gain value for the region will be -6 for the region? or that the gain adjustment will be the same for each region?

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I haven't run in to any tracks shipped to me with 0.0 levels, so hadn't realized the "no change" bug was fixed.

As I watch your video, number 2 in particular, I can't quite see what is wrong. After Normalize Region Gain the Gain field in the region inspector should have the offset value that is applied to assure the peak gain of -6. I have no expectation that any of the gain offsets will be the same on a region to region basis.

 

Are you expecting the Gain value for the region will be -6 for the region? or that the gain adjustment will be the same for each region?

 

Nothing's wrong in the second video. That's from 10.6.1 (the fixed version). I thought that was clear from the GIF's name.

 

In the first video, recorded from 10.4.8, the "Clipped" regions (which definitely peak at 0.0dB) don't change their gain, even though I used a level of -6dB for Normalize (so a clipped region should end up at -6 dB region gain)

 

So maybe you could try and check with a file with a peak level of 0.0 dB if the bug is fixed for you as well?

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  • 1 month later...

I hate to have to revive this thread once again, but I am now having issues with Normalize Region Gain as well. I am on 10.7.2.

 

Just so there is no ambiguity around what one person assumes this function should be doing vs reality - I watched this video:

 

 

and that is exactly how I'm expecting NRG to work, yet it's not doing so in the test I'm running.

 

To keep it simple and remove as many variables as possible, I am using just one track with one region on it. It's a kick drum track - before applying any gain normalization, the track is peaking around -30dB (fader set to unity) - I attempt to apply Normalize Region Gain with the algorithm set to Peak, and the target set to -18.0. The result - the gain does change, but the peak value is -22.0?? So it seems to be off by 4dB. If I set the target of NRG to -14.0, well then I get my desired peak of -18.0. I don't understand why this is happening. Why doesn't it work the way it works in the video and just give you what you ask for 8-) ? What I'm experiencing isn't as far off as what others in this thread have experienced (where there is no effect at all), but I can't argue with the fact that something about this functionality isn't doing what we would expect it to do.

 

Note that I tried using all three options for Affect, and they all yield the same result.

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Did you try and (destructively, so better use a copy of the file) normalise the file in the Audio File Editor, to ensure the peak is really -30dB? (In Functions-> Function settings... set Normalize Peak at -30db, then Normalize - if I'm thinking correct it should leave the file unchanged then) Edited by polanoid
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polanoid said:

Note that I edited my post, my first proposal was much too complicated ;)

Sounds good, thanks. I'll report back my findings - I will say however that I've now experimented with ALL tracks in my session, and for all of them, if I use NRG and put in a peak -14db, they all peak at around -18db. Very odd.

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Did you try and (destructively, so better use a copy of the file) normalise the file in the Audio File Editor, to ensure the peak is really -30dB? (In Functions-> Function settings... set Normalize Peak at -30db, then Normalize - if I'm thinking correct it should leave the file unchanged then)

This is exactly the same operation Nola111 is already describing

 

Physically navigating to the Normalise Gain function will not make any difference over using the keyboard shortcut - they lead to the same menu item

 

The Normalise Gain function is also non-destructive by its very nature - you can continuously change the gain of any region at any time

 

It only becomes destructive if you bounce to a new version of the file or consolidate it to a new one

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Polanoid is talking about the Audio File Editor; The functions you use there are "destructive"...

 

 

Yes and you are both wrong in the case of the Normalise Gain parameter

 

Drag in an audio file or record a new one

 

Open it in the Editor

 

Apply Normalisation to 0dB for the sake of argument (you cannot normalise above 0)

 

Now select the region and inspect it in the region inspector

 

Edit: Actually you can normalize above 0dB if you use LUFS - but it doesn't destructively alter the waveform and you can still use the inspector to return to the original gain

 

This will tell you how much gain was added to normalise to 0dB and you can adjust it even further from here

 

If it was destructive - you would be able to adjust beyond clipping and not go back

 

In simple terms the Normalise Gain function just adjusts the region gain via the parameter in the region inspector

 

You still need to flatten or bounce to a new file to make the changes permanent

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Did you try and (destructively, so better use a copy of the file) normalise the file in the Audio File Editor, to ensure the peak is really -30dB? (In Functions-> Function settings... set Normalize Peak at -30db, then Normalize - if I'm thinking correct it should leave the file unchanged then)

This is exactly the same operation Nola111 is already describing

 

No.

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You end up at the same place more or less. It will only normalise to 0 dB which in practice is no different from normalising using the track tab

 

and you can still manually adjust gain by +/- 30 dB in the inspector

 

What I was proposing was a way to find out what the real peak of the audio file is, using the Audio *File* editor, in case you don't trust the (nondestructive) Normalize Gain function for whatever reason.

 

Also, the Audio File editor will not "only normalise to 0 dB". You can set the peak level it normalises to in the Audio File Editor menu, Functions -> Function Settings... dialog.

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  • 2 months later...
On 12/14/2021 at 12:20 PM, Cocker said:

Two years later...

I've encountered the same issue in Logic 10.6.1

Key command [ctrl+option+G]

You should be able to auto normalise any number of selected regions to a set level but it works only on some random regions but not others

You then have to go find the regions that it didn't work on and adjust these manually in the region inspector

Still not fixed - It's a niche issue that barely anyone would notice but it's still there

Most logic users I've met do not even know this key command exists - it would be amazing if it worked as expected

About 5 months later, seems like this issue is still relevant in logic pro, it happened to me just now and also happened to a classmate a few days ago. HOWEVER if ^⌥G didn't work, ⇧P would work. At least, that's what happened in my experience. ⇧P opens the "Selection Based Processing" menu which has a normalization feature within it. It's just a slightly different menu where you can do more than normalization. However, you cannot chose between RMS and peak normalization and you can't set the target, but I'm guessing it's peak normalization with a target of -1 dB.

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13 hours ago, benwaddi said:

About 5 months later, seems like this issue is still relevant in logic pro, it happened to me just now and also happened to a classmate a few days ago. HOWEVER if ^⌥G didn't work, ⇧P would work. At least, that's what happened in my experience. ⇧P opens the "Selection Based Processing" menu which has a normalization feature within it. It's just a slightly different menu where you can do more than normalization. However, you cannot chose between RMS and peak normalization and you can't set the target, but I'm guessing it's peak normalization with a target of -1 dB

 

Please attach a screenshot of the settings you enter in the dialog box that pops up when you use the ^⌥G key command. I have not found Logic behaving incorrectly regarding this command yet. The normalization happening in "Selection Based Processing" is not the same because it is destructive, it doesn't use Region Gain. Which Logic version are you using?

Edited by polanoid
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  • 6 months later...
  • 4 weeks later...
On 12/2/2022 at 11:30 AM, matchewy said:

I was having this same issue too (10.7.5). Only way I could get around this..... :: drum roll :: instead of entering the target level value via the keyboard, I used the little arrows next to the value and then it finally worked.  

I have been stuck on this issue for the past hour and this is the only solution that worked for me, very strange, but yes, when i manually use the mouse to enter the desired DB, it works! when i type in the desired number, it does not. Funny.

  • Like 1
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On 12/2/2022 at 4:30 AM, matchewy said:

I was having this same issue too (10.7.5). Only way I could get around this..... :: drum roll :: instead of entering the target level value via the keyboard, I used the little arrows next to the value and then it finally worked.  

After entering the target level via keyboard, you can also press the Return key to make Logic use the entered value. The bug, it seems, is that the entered value is not taken over when you simply enter it and then click "Apply". Easy to work around though.

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  • 1 year later...

I read quite a few threads on this site, most of them are helpful. This thread was far too long and filled with an embarrassing amount of unnecessary banter for zero reason.

i too have experienced this same problem of late. And I appreciate the people who were attempting to be helpful…

Edited by Steve Kudlacek
Incomplete
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2 hours ago, Steve Kudlacek said:

I read quite a few threads on this site, most of them are helpful. This thread was far too long and filled with an embarrassing amount of unnecessary banter for zero reason.

i too have experienced this same problem of late. And I appreciate the people who were attempting to be helpful…

Could you describe what happens exactly (e.g., which settings do you use for Normalize Region Gain) so people can help you better?

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