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Multiple Moog Phatty (& other hard synths?) tracks w/ Logic


mtache1212

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Hi All,

 

First of, I want to say thank you to this community. I've been reading posts for the past year and it has solved ALL my logic pro issues. I've finally come across something that doesn't appear to have been addressed / discussed (or I simply can't find it).

 

I bought my first hardware synths about a month ago, but am very familiar with it as I have spent countless hours tuning sounds.

 

I have an Akai MPK 25 plugged via USB into my 2011 macbook pro. I have a focusrite saffire 6 audio interface, plugged into macbook pro via the other usb. The audio interface midi's (In and Out) are plugged into the midi's (In and Out) of my Moog Slim Phatty. I own and use the Rekon editor / AU. MOOG subcontracted out the creating of this Phatty editor to Rekon Audio. Rekon has horrid customer service.

 

So.....I can record fine in logic pro. The problem comes when I have two tracks assigned to the Rekon editor. I will record something with the Phatty into the first track in midi (and software instrument in Logic). I will then add a second track, using a different preset / patch, in Midi....again using the Rekon editor (and software instrument in Logic). It all seems fine until I go back to the first track and the sound has completely changed as it is now using the patch that I used for the second track. Why is Logic (or maybe the Rekon editor) not separating the presets between the two tracks?

 

I am able to record midi with a Slim Phatty and then record this midi to an audio track. I can then add another midi track and record with the slim phatty and then record it to a second audio track. There are obviously issues I have with this....mainly that I can't change the sound of either track after it is recorded to an audio track. I want to make an entire song using the Slim Phatty and UltraBeat.

 

There must be a fix for this. I just ordered a second synth (Moog Microkorg XL), and I'm wondering if I am going to have the same problem? Don't laugh, I got it cheap on EBAY and I've never tried it, so I may use it to replace my Akai MPK.

 

None of this makes no sense. There must be a work around. Maybe I'm using logic wrong, but can't figure out what it is. I've spent HOURS trying to figure this out. I've tried setting the presets using both the editor and the slim phatty, and have had no luck.

 

Can anyone provide any input on this? Anything advice is good advice and it would be much appreciated.

 

Much love....keep it rockin!

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So.....I can record fine in logic pro. The problem comes when I have two tracks assigned to the Rekon editor. I will record something with the Phatty into the first track in midi (and software instrument in Logic). I will then add a second track, using a different preset / patch, in Midi....again using the Rekon editor (and software instrument in Logic). It all seems fine until I go back to the first track and the sound has completely changed as it is now using the patch that I used for the second track. Why is Logic (or maybe the Rekon editor) not separating the presets between the two tracks?

You mention that you are recording MIDI tracks in Logic with software instrument and Reckon editor. That is unclear.

Could you please post a screen capture of the Logic's mixer (where we could see the involved tracks) in order to have a clear picture of what is going on?

Intuitively, I would be tempted to believe that since Phatty is monotimbral, the change of patche does not occur at the Phatty and Reckon just follows what it can read from the Phatty. If this is the case, I would think that either Phatty does not read the patche change, or Logic doesnt issue it... But, again, this is a blind shot really! Other things could be at play here...

 

I am able to record midi with a Slim Phatty and then record this midi to an audio track. I can then add another midi track and record with the slim phatty and then record it to a second audio track. There are obviously issues I have with this....mainly that I can't change the sound of either track after it is recorded to an audio track. I want to make an entire song using the Slim Phatty and UltraBeat.

It sounds like you are confusing of what you can do with audio recorded data vs MIDI recorded data tracks.

In Logic, each of these track types offer different and many similar/equivalent editing possibilities.

For clarification purpose, software instrument tracks are different from External MIDI tracks, although they both contain/record MIDI data... I understand that you have recorded MIDI tracks in Logic, which actuates your Phatty. And sounds coming from Phatty are recorded in audio tracks in Logic. In short you end up with one MIDI track and one audio track for each part recorded. Right? If so, have you considered using an External Instrument plugin?

 

There must be a fix for this. I just ordered a second synth (Moog Microkorg XL), and I'm wondering if I am going to have the same problem? Don't laugh, I got it cheap on EBAY and I've never tried it, so I may use it to replace my Akai MPK.

You have to be aware that Microkorg XL is made by Korg, not by Moog. These are two different brands/companies!

Also be aware the your Akai MPK is a MIDI controller, which is different from a synthetiser, that are the MicroKorg and the Moog Phatty...

 

None of this makes no sense. There must be a work around. Maybe I'm using logic wrong, but can't figure out what it is. I've spent HOURS trying to figure this out. I've tried setting the presets using both the editor and the slim phatty, and have had no luck.

 

Can anyone provide any input on this? Anything advice is good advice and it would be much appreciated.

-Learning about your MIDI Settings could also be beneficial (among other manuals reading)...

-Abiding to Board rule #5could also be helpful to your eventual helpers and other readers...

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Thank you for the response.

 

I have attached a screen shot. You know what, I never use different channels or buses. I actually don't even understand the function of either, as I have never needed to use them. I've also read something about creating an "AUX" in the mixer. I know how to add this, but again I don't know the function. Maybe this has something to do with my problem? When I move knobs with the Rekon editor I see them move on my phatty. When I change patches on the phatty they respond on the editor. So the communication links are there.

 

I get the same problem when opening two external midi tracks. I will delete the standard 16 channel (?) instrument and add two midi instruments in the Environment window. I tried setting one of them to channel 1 and the other to channel 2. In the arrangement window, I added two audio tracks to compliment the two external midi tracks. I set the channels to match the environment window. I am able to play the phatty, but the same patch plays on both tracks. In addition, I can't figure out how to open the Rekon editor when I do this. Any ideas?

 

Thanks for the links, I will take a look. I think this may boil down to understanding how the channels work and how the bus works within the mixer section. Do you have any input to assist? I will do my homework now. I also need to figure out how to open the Rekon editor when setting an external midi track.

 

Thanks again for your response.

823681613_ScreenShot2012-10-25at6_18_34PM.thumb.png.5d07ae012e358245fb8c03381fa68e10.png

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Check out the screenshot when I open two tracks when both are set to external midi. What is the "click" in green in the mixer? I am able to open Rekon from their.

 

When I move the filter knob on the phatty the "instrument 1" gain knob moves. Weird. I don't see the second midi track in the mixer, but you can see two tracks in the arrange window.

 

Do you need an associated audio track when for each external midi track you create? I thought I read a thread that stated that.

 

Thanks,

Mike

28217108_ScreenShot2012-10-25at7_02_33PM.thumb.png.6c2ceeb501e46a6977934f379a208412.png

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This is from the logic pro manual. Refer to the last sentence. I wonder if the slim phatty can only be played on one channel. I went into the audio midi setup on my macbook and connected my saffire up to my slim phatty (two cables - one out and one in)

 

Channel: Defines the channel used for MIDI output by the instrument track, allowing your “real” instrument to receive the data.

You can also alter the MIDI channel of an external MIDI instrument part by choosing another sub-channel of the current multi-instrument.

A sub-channel is one of 16 possible MIDI channels or parts that can be played by a multi-instrument object. It goes without saying that the external MIDI synthesizer (represented by the multi-instrument object) needs to be capable of playing on more than one MIDI channel for sub-channel selection to be useful.

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... It goes without saying that the external MIDI synthesizer (represented by the multi-instrument object) needs to be capable of playing on more than one MIDI channel for sub-channel selection to be useful.

Which applies to the Fatty. Fatty can only play on one MIDI (sub)channel at the time as it is monotimbral...

You could however record many different audio tracks from it, one after the other in Logic. They will play afterward simultaneously. while your Fatty remain silent.

You should learn about the differences about the MIDI tracks and the audio tracks...

Things I see in your screen captures, reveal that you know little about Logic...

I know this is cumbersome to "crack the book" but there is no way around it, if you want to enjoy all that Logic has to offer you.

Trust me, it is time well spent and will save you lot of headaches...

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I'm very familiar withe Midi vs Sound. Maybe I don't know much about logic, but I have at least 40% down. I had no clue on the integration of external synths with logic.

 

Anyway, I found a way. You cam draw up many instances of the EXS24 sampler. I found it to work the best when you sample one note per octave and then put the file on the sampler keys and drag. You can do automation, modulation, compression, etc directly in logic.

 

It works well so I'm happy with that. My friend has told me another way, but basically it needs to go to audio and get out of midi. I suppose if I had a multi-timbral synth I could stay in midi? For instance the Nord Lead 2X is multi-timbral but only has 4 channels, does that mean I can keep 4 tracks under the Nord and stay in MIDI as long as I want with different presets (obviously using the Audio Interface which converts the Midi into Audio)?

 

I can get a Nord Lead 2X rack for $600 from an aquentence in San Francisco. It's in mint condition. Is this worth it....I assume I could at least sell it for what I paid 2 years down the road. What do you think?

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I'm very familiar withe Midi vs Sound. Maybe I don't know much about logic, but I have at least 40% down.

...

(obviously using the Audio Interface which converts the Midi into Audio)

...

What do you think?

 

 

Keep reading the Logic manuals to learn more about it (and the differences between MIDI and audio)...

We'll talk after...

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