nickweston Posted May 20, 2007 Share Posted May 20, 2007 Well, that's my point. Radio is dead or dying in the US. As far as 3rd world, yeah, radio lives on, but who buys the products they advertise? Much smaller market. The bigger picture and the point I was trying to make is that people are much more aware and savvy, having access to the internet. That being said, it is much more difficult to spoon-feed bad music, people will instead find stuff they like on the web and put it on their iPods, without having to listen to ads. This reminds me of advertisers scrambling to counter the TiVo and the fact that people that own TiVos speed through ads. Jeez, the fact that 75% of teenagers listen to music on an iPod, and the fact that iPods don't have FM tuners in them ought to point out the future of radio... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashermusic Posted May 20, 2007 Share Posted May 20, 2007 Well, that's my point. Radio is dead or dying in the US. As far as 3rd world, yeah, radio lives on, but who buys the products they advertise? Much smaller market. The bigger picture and the point I was trying to make is that people are much more aware and savvy, having access to the internet. That being said, it is much more difficult to spoon-feed bad music, people will instead find stuff they like on the web and put it on their iPods, without having to listen to ads. This reminds me of advertisers scrambling to counter the TiVo and the fact that people that own TiVos speed through ads. Jeez, the fact that 75% of teenagers listen to music on an iPod, and the fact that iPods don't have FM tuners in them ought to point out the future of radio... You are contradicting yourself. If teenagers were harder to spoon-feed bad music they would not be listening to awful sounding mp3s of awful stuff like My Chemical Romance in droves on their iPods. In the 60's we listened to the Beatles, Jimi Hendrix, Janis Joplin, Sly and the Family Stone, James Brown, etc., all spoon-fed to us? So who was more savvy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickweston Posted May 20, 2007 Share Posted May 20, 2007 You are contradicting yourself. If teenagers were harder to spoon-feed bad music they would not be listening to awful sounding mp3s of awful stuff like My Chemical Romance in droves on their iPods. In the 60's we listened to the Beatles, Jimi Hendrix, Janis Joplin, Sly and the Family Stone, James Brown, etc., all spoon-fed to us? So who was more savvy? hmmm....I still respectfully disagree... Danger warning....you are sounding like an old fart... I talked to a 13 year old just yesterday who listens to Zepellin, AC/DC, Deep Purple and Jethro Tull. But that doesn't mean he thinks everything today sucks! How soon we forget that in the 60's and 70's we had some of the WORST music of all time also! The Partridge Family. "Yummy Yummy Yummy I've Got Love In My Tummy," Theme from Billy Jack, Kung Fu Fighting...I could go on and on. There is still great music happening today, it's just harder to find. That's why the internet has opened things up so much, and taken the power away from ignorant record companies and radio stations run by 60 year olds. The fact that you think Chemical Romance is awful means absolutely nothing! Try telling a kid that loves them that he's wrong! You might as well tell them that chocolate is better than vanilla IMHO. MY point is that kids are FINDING music they like ACTIVELY, not just turning on a radio and taking what comes. That is a HUGE difference! Liberating! Anyway, I'm not going to get into the my music vs. their music thing, it's really pointless. My Grandma loved Sinatra but her Mom hated him, she liked Rudy Vallee. My Mom loved Elvis but her Mom hated Elvis. I loved Zappa and my mom hated him.... Peace my friend, we probably like the same stuff. Oh, and good riddance radio/Clear Channel! Long live Chunky Monkey! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashermusic Posted May 20, 2007 Share Posted May 20, 2007 You are contradicting yourself. If teenagers were harder to spoon-feed bad music they would not be listening to awful sounding mp3s of awful stuff like My Chemical Romance in droves on their iPods. In the 60's we listened to the Beatles, Jimi Hendrix, Janis Joplin, Sly and the Family Stone, James Brown, etc., all spoon-fed to us? So who was more savvy? hmmm....I still respectfully disagree... Danger warning....you are sounding like an old fart... I talked to a 13 year old just yesterday who listens to Zepellin, AC/DC, Deep Purple and Jethro Tull. But that doesn't mean he thinks everything today sucks! How soon we forget that in the 60's and 70's we had some of the WORST music of all time also! The Partridge Family. "Yummy Yummy Yummy I've Got Love In My Tummy," Theme from Billy Jack, Kung Fu Fighting...I could go on and on. There is still great music happening today, it's just harder to find. That's why the internet has opened things up so much, and taken the power away from ignorant record companies and radio stations run by 60 year olds. The fact that you think Chemical Romance is awful means absolutely nothing! Try telling a kid that loves them that he's wrong! You might as well tell them that chocolate is better than vanilla IMHO. MY point is that kids are FINDING music they like ACTIVELY, not just turning on a radio and taking what comes. That is a HUGE difference! Liberating! Anyway, I'm not going to get into the my music vs. their music thing, it's really pointless. My Grandma loved Sinatra but her Mom hated him, she liked Rudy Vallee. My Mom loved Elvis but her Mom hated Elvis. I loved Zappa and my mom hated him.... Peace my friend, we probably like the same stuff. Oh, and good riddance radio/Clear Channel! Long live Chunky Monkey! While I grant you it is generational and there is good and bad in every era all those artists I mentioned had hits on the charts and were played on the same radio stations at the same time. Please point me to a Billboard listing in the last 10 years where you will find a top 100 with that kind of quality and diversity and the staying power that kids will still be listening to 40 years from now. You know you can't. And BTW, both my 23 year old daughter and 18 year old niece agree with me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benw Posted May 20, 2007 Share Posted May 20, 2007 as a 16 year old i am inclined to LARGELY agree with the point about the billboard chart, but there are exceptions in my opinion, most noticeably the new modest mouse album, which i think was no1 in the billboard chart when it first came out?? not sure if thats right, im english... but it definitely entered. also, on the subject of the loudness wars and over compression, just compare this picture of tracy chapman's fast car with the sugababes freak like me ( a succesful pop single in the uk in roughly 2003) inside logic... its fairly obvious which one has a greater dynamic range: http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q121/traininginvain/logiccomparisonpicture.jpg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noeqplease Posted May 21, 2007 Share Posted May 21, 2007 Well, that's my point. Radio is dead or dying in the US. As far as 3rd world, yeah, radio lives on, but who buys the products they advertise? Much smaller marketu.The bigger picture and the point I was trying to make is that people are much more aware and savvy, having access to the internet. That being said, it is much more difficult to spoon-feed bad music, people will instead find stuff they like on the web and put it on their iPods, without having to listen to ads. This reminds me of advertisers scrambling to counter the TiVo and the fact that people that own TiVos speed through ads. Jeez, the fact that 75% of teenagers listen to music on an iPod, and the fact that iPods don't have FM tuners in them ought to point out the future of radio... Wow,I'd love to find out where you are getting your "facts"... I won't go into it anyomre as I see way too many generalizations in your post reply,that would take me about 6 years to sort out for you...I got better things to do... Bye Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
editbrain Posted May 21, 2007 Share Posted May 21, 2007 benw, i totally agree with your pictures. as a dj from the early '90's thought today. playing house and techno from EU and US. I can definitely tell you that vinyl coming from EU was a lot louder than from the US. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yojames Posted May 21, 2007 Share Posted May 21, 2007 Marry me... OK AllyMusicGirl, Who were you offering that to? Was that me, David, or Bon?!? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsilbers Posted May 22, 2007 Share Posted May 22, 2007 if it wasnt becuase logics apregiator is really clumpsy and doesnt have "chord" pattern ill use logics plugs al the time!! also tthere is no trancegater but there are a few cheap and free one on the net. also, theres a little jewel not many know but if u go to garageband instrument and use the sync synth, fiddle the presets a little and then on that same slot where the sync synth, just open an ES2 and the same preset/sound will apear. so the sync synth will take fast to those fat sync sounds and then u go to ES2 to edit. loce it! i have gotten tons of 3rd party plugs and instr. but always use the same for sound and convinience. which is my virus TI synth also plugin (great sounds) and camel space. but i believe that ES1 juno pbass preset is the bestest thing ever for dance and electrnic. its that sound u hear from cars far away with an humongus stereo system , which rumbles low freqs. awsome. and i use EXS24 with vengeance dance sample colection. tape delay must be one of the best delays out there, it just works! the compressor is not my favorite but one that use all the time, and its sidechain feiture just make up for it. the vocoder is great, better than the vokator. so im hopefull that the logic team will use this forums "add feature" for the upcoming release. but still for producing logic rules. by the way, a lot of the new Ozomatli CD synth sounds came from logic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zaque Posted May 22, 2007 Share Posted May 22, 2007 anybody got more stories or screenshots of some professional sessions? i think the bulk of this discussion has taken place in about 100 other threads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvertonesx24 Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 ive always wondered what actual tv and film scores actually look like in logic's arange, and how composers organize their workflow with Logic. as someone else said, screenshots would be boss! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vankarius Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 If you've got a ruler... LOL! Depends on how accurate you like your square Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jope Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 Anybody still here? David, very interesting thread, although it went away step by step from its origin. The quintessence to me is not to overdo the efforts to adjust and straighten the theoretical part of your environment but to train your skills in getting results that sound just right. Nikki, I love your contemplations, especially the part about how pointless it is to try making others to believe what one believes himself. Let me add: It's dangerous, too, as everybody can verify easily by listening to newscasts. Every human lives in his/her own universe. It's also fairly human people like to be understood by other people. But if we start trying to tear somebody out of his universe into ours, things will become rediculous - or worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
editbrain Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 Let me add: It's dangerous, too, as everybody can verify easily by listening to newscasts. Every human lives in his/her own universe. It's also fairly human people like to be understood by other people. But if we start trying to tear somebody out of his universe into ours, things will become rediculous - or worse. now that is funny. to me at least. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jope Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 now that is funny. to me at least. Good... At least I could amuse you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
editbrain Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 it was. i wasn't being an Ahole/iHole. just to clarify. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jope Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 i wasn't being an Ahole/iHole. A what? No, don't explain... I just said, if you find funny what I say, it seems to be useful in some way. Just to clarify. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveH Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 Sounds like another endless discussion is building... I'll pass! Yeah... let's debate sample rates instead! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashermusic Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 as a 16 year old i am inclined to LARGELY agree with the point about the billboard chart, but there are exceptions in my opinion, most noticeably the new modest mouse album, which i think was no1 in the billboard chart when it first came out?? not sure if thats right, im english... but it definitely entered. BTW, I too am a Modest Mouse fan but I have not heard the new CD. However, apprently is has lot of the digital clipping that I was talking about. Pure carelessness if true. Check the thread on Gearslutz. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Nahmani Posted May 23, 2007 Author Share Posted May 23, 2007 Yeah... let's debate sample rates instead! On Windows or Mac? I have heard sample rates sound warmer on Mac than on Windows (provided you're summing the analog signal with itself with an anti-foldback analog brickwall aliasing peak filter before clocking). Taping a little piece of paper towel on the right tweeter really helps too (Kleenex Ultra Cuddle Plus seems to work best on Brass arrangements). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashermusic Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 Particularly if you recorded it into a Tascam Portastudio. Those cassettes had lots of headroom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ericwiggle Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 David, your last sentence says it all: "Don't get too caught up in those debates, and spend more time producing music!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Nahmani Posted May 23, 2007 Author Share Posted May 23, 2007 Particularly if you recorded it into a Tascam Portastudio. Those cassettes had lots of headroom. Believe it or not, I recorded an album like that with one of my bands once (it was one of the nicer 8 track Tascam cassette portastudio). We then had it mastered, and it didn't sound half bad! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsilbers Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 if u check out the apple/software/logic pro page u will see in the botton somoe cool videos and the seminars are from pro session, one is nelly furtado and the other one is one of those rock clone bands.. greend day..creed i dont know they all sound the same to me these online seminar show how easy these guys use logic and their "consious" way of approaching it just rocks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benw Posted May 23, 2007 Share Posted May 23, 2007 Jay, the new cd certainly isn't great as far as over compression and loudnesss goes BUT it is still pretty darn good! I just got back from seeing them at the Royal Albert Hall, they still rock! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nikkik Posted May 24, 2007 Share Posted May 24, 2007 Particularly if you recorded it into a Tascam Portastudio. Those cassettes had lots of headroom. I actually miss my old 4-track Tascam from time to time. It was one of the first models they made, was like a tank, and travelled with me across the country many, many times..dropped, crushed, spilled on....still worked when I passed it on to a friend's oldest kid I used to babysit for and went on to play guitar due to my...erm..."bad influence" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nikkik Posted May 24, 2007 Share Posted May 24, 2007 There is a band, one of my favs, Porcupine Tree. The "head honcho," Steven Wilson, uses Logic Pro, and their latest album was reportedly done completely in Logic Pro...including the mastering, by Steven himself. Rumour has it he was upset with the "loudness wars" and the crappy mastering techniques being used in "today's music." Oh, how I wish I could spend a week in the studio just observing his work.... Oh- and everybody knows that the Atari Falcon, Amiga and Mac SE30 were the best sounding computers ever. Only thing that came close was a Turtle Beach powered Windows machine! BTW- if anyone even cares, the first time I realized I could make my own music and not worry about how great the gear was came from reading about Steve Vai, and seeing interviews. His first album, Flexable, was done in his own home, with a Fostex 1/4" 8-track reel-to-reel, and with a bunch of gear loaned to him by Mr Zappa. He claimed his resulting studio that he built (The Mothership) was from the profits from that album. It was because he did it all himself, and retained every bit of control, he could do with it what he wanted, and made more with that then wth his stint with David Lee Roth. Though I am no Steve Vai, it gave me the ability to realize that anyone can do the same thing.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
editbrain Posted May 24, 2007 Share Posted May 24, 2007 OT 000==== Way OT.. Didn't Steve V. auction his "mother ship" to help children or something? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marcel72 Posted May 24, 2007 Share Posted May 24, 2007 If you have a few minutes to read, check this out: http://www.gearslutz.com/board/q-producer-engineer-mixer-tchad-blake/ OK, so he works in PT... But this guy is the epitome of 'if it sounds good, it is' kinda thinking that I really dig. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy M. Posted May 25, 2007 Share Posted May 25, 2007 if it wasnt becuase logics apregiator is really clumpsy and doesnt have "chord" pattern ill use logics plugs al the time!! also tthere is no trancegater but there are a few cheap and free one on the net.. Sorry to take this thread off topic but... 1. connect the arpeggiator to a chord memoriser and edit away - job done 2. trancegates are easy to set up - insert gate, sidechain the rhythm into it - hey presto. Thanks for the GB to EXS tip BTW. 8) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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