Nektar Panorama CS12 - customised control of Logic Pro X

[David Nahmani]

6 hours ago, oscwilde said:

There's obviously the Shift button and (I'm assuming) Fine button which are hard assigned to modifier keys - along with Cycle, Rec, Marker, etc., etc. buttons being assigned to QWERTY keys (presumably?).

They don't seem to be hardwired. Pressing Shift on the CS12 doesn't perform the same actions as pressing Shift on the Mac keyboard. For example Shift + touch the fader can be used to reset the volume fader to zero (on the Mac keyboard that would be Option + click). 

[rcandy]

9 hours ago, oscwilde said:

Can you press multiple modifiers to access / leverage further key commands?

I'd like to see something like that.

I'd like to be able to setup an auto punch in zone using the controller. Having a poke around in controller assignments I can see that there is an assignment to turn auto punch in on/off but can't work out which key or which key combination does this (it's not covered in the manual). 

[TChandler]

On 3/9/2024 at 1:38 PM, rcandy said:

I'd like to see something like that.

I'd like to be able to setup an auto punch in zone using the controller. Having a poke around in controller assignments I can see that there is an assignment to turn auto punch in on/off but can't work out which key or which key combination does this (it's not covered in the manual). 

You can re-purpose the M1:M10 buttons with [MARKERS] active.  These controls default to directly access the first 10 markers, but you can also access markers by holding the [MARKERS] button and scrolling with the DATA/MENU control.

 

To re-purpose M1:M10:

1.  Engage [MARKERS] on CS12 so the button is fully illuminated.

2.  OPTION+K on the QWERTY to open Logic's Key Command Assignments

3. Use search to locate the key command - so for auto punch as called out above, I type in "punch" and found it as "Toggle Autopunch mode".

4.  Select the key command in the main dialog window so it's highlighted blue.

5.  Click "Learn New Assignment". 

6. Press M1:M10.

 

You can trigger the M1:M10 functions by holding down [MARKERS] and pressing the control.  In this case, MARKERS mode is disabled on release - so in this way, [MARKERS] is acting as another SHIFT layer.

The M1:M10 marker assignments trigger on button up which means it will sense any user-made assignments and then prevent the marker triggering.  This way the two assignments will never clash after rebuild Defaults is triggered (unlike when you override other control surfaces in this way).

To remove a user assignment from the M1:M10 controls and return marker functionality, SHIFT+OPTION+K QWERTY to open the controller assignments dialog and delete the triggered function that is displayed when the M1:M10 button is pressed.

Edited March 11 by TChandler

[prodbyogchiboi]

If I create a map for a VST3 plugin, how do I use this map and import it into the AU version of the same plugin?

[prodbyogchiboi]

I have also realized that some plugins that have linked controls do not work as expected. Slate Digital's VCC and Pulsar's 1178 being examples. The input and outputs of the VCC do not move together when the controls are linked. The stereo version of the 1178 only controls one one channel at a time, not both.

Plugin Alliance's AMEQ EQ 250 is an example of a plugin that works as intended when the stereo instance is loaded.

Maybe I am missing something...

[simon.a.billington]

Been waiting on something like this for a long time.  But it's early days.  I'd expect to see a few bugs or workflow issues.  I think its will really benefit once its in the hands of many Logic users and they've all put forward their suggestions of how to better improve things.

Exciting times though.

[David Nahmani]

Just now, simon.a.billington said:

Been waiting on something like this for a long time.  But it's early days.  I'd expect to see a few bugs or workflow issues.  I think its will really benefit once its in the hands of many Logic users and they've all put forward their suggestions of how to better improve things.

Exciting times though.

Very exciting. Been experimenting with my CS12 for the past few days and my first impressions are that it's a great channel strip controller for Logic pro. You can tell that a lot of thought has been put into it. 

First, what I love is that it's mostly intuitive and you can use all the basic functionality you'd expect from it in a very intuitive way, without having to crack open the manual. 

After that, you do some exploring and realize there are tons of additional, more advanced features that you wouldn't have thought of with intuition alone. 

Now there are a couple of glitches I stumbled upon in the process but nothing that isn't quickly worked around, and as you suggested I'm sure what needs to be improved upon will be improved upon by either Apple or Nektar depending on where the responsibility falls for each issue. 

I'm working on an article on the CS12 where I document my experience, that should come out in a few days. 

[simon.a.billington]

How intuitive is, I wonder, to use with a third party channel strip like those you see from PA or Waves?!?  And how intuitive is it if you have tendency to use a different channel strip for each project??

[David Nahmani]

1 minute ago, simon.a.billington said:

How intuitive is, I wonder, to use with a third party channel strip like those you see from PA or Waves?!?  And how intuitive is it if you have tendency to use a different channel strip for each project??

By default the plug-in knobs (the 12 knobs on the right) are assigned to plug-in parameters in the order they appear in the Control view, however it's quite easy to reassign them however you'd like. If you reassign the knobs then those custom assignments can be used every time you select that plug-in, no matter where you've inserted it. 

[simon.a.billington]

3 minutes ago, David Nahmani said:

By default the plug-in knobs (the 12 knobs on the right) are assigned to plug-in parameters in the order they appear in the Control view, however it's quite easy to reassign them however you'd like. If you reassign the knobs then those custom assignments can be used every time you select that plug-in, no matter where you've inserted it. 

Oh brilliant.  I hardly expected it to work straight out of the box for every plugin.  It really comes down to how quickly you can map them and whether it recalls the mapping for the plugin.

Sounds like they've implemented that part well at least.

[David Nahmani]

Just now, simon.a.billington said:

It really comes down to how quickly you can map them and whether it recalls the mapping for the plugin.

1. Hold Shift,
2. Click a parameter in Logic Pro,
3. Move a knob on the CS12,
4. Repeat steps #2 and #3 for more parameters,
5. Release Shift. 

Done. 😄 Mappings recalled when using that plug-in in any insert, any track, any project. 

That's the quick version but you can also use Learn mode to avoid having to hold down Shift. 

Or to go in depth you can use Nektarine which allows you to completely customize the mapping, the RGB color, the labels, the way parameters are organized in menu pages etc... 

[guavadude]

where/how is it saving these mappings, in Logic's controller assignments or there's the option to save internally?

[David Nahmani]

I just published a new article on the Panorama CS12!

[TChandler]

On 3/12/2024 at 3:11 AM, prodbyogchiboi said:

If I create a map for a VST3 plugin, how do I use this map and import it into the AU version of the same plugin?

It depends on the plugin unfortunately.  If the plugin has the same name string across versions, then it will pick up the VST3 map automatically with the AU version loaded.  Unfortunately, some manufacturers use different name strings according to the version and in this case Nektarine/ControlCore effectively sees a different plugin.

 

On 3/13/2024 at 3:58 AM, prodbyogchiboi said:

I have also realized that some plugins that have linked controls do not work as expected. Slate Digital's VCC and Pulsar's 1178 being examples. The input and outputs of the VCC do not move together when the controls are linked. The stereo version of the 1178 only controls one one channel at a time, not both.

Plugin Alliance's AMEQ EQ 250 is an example of a plugin that works as intended when the stereo instance is loaded.

Maybe I am missing something...

As above, it depends on the plugin...  We have found many workarounds are required in plugin mapping as plugins do not expect such a high level of control.  

I can recreate the link issue with Slate VCC, it's just how the plugin is handling incoming automation data unfortunately.  That said, I can see how we could add a workaround for this via ControlCore.

 I'll create a feature request to handle linked parameters.  It's a good suggestion and one of the workarounds we have missed out.  

Thanks for the detailed feedback!

 

 

[oscwilde]

Hey @TChandler.

Are there any restrictions re: the AAX format and ControlCore?
Had a get-together with a group of engineers/musicians, and a few Logic users were chatting about the CS12...and the PT users (about 6 or 7) were impressed with the size/look/concept/price and basically indicated they'd pick up a unit the day PT support is available....and the AAX question came up.

[David Nahmani]

8 hours ago, oscwilde said:

Hey @TChandler.

Are there any restrictions re: the AAX format and ControlCore?
Had a get-together with a group of engineers/musicians, and a few Logic users were chatting about the CS12...and the PT users (about 6 or 7) were impressed with the size/look/concept/price and basically indicated they'd pick up a unit the day PT support is available....and the AAX question came up.

While we wait for an official answer, I've heard from a secondary source that Pro Tools support was on the way. 

[StudioQ1]

On 3/13/2024 at 11:14 AM, simon.a.billington said:

Been waiting on something like this for a long time.  But it's early days.  I'd expect to see a few bugs or workflow issues.  I think its will really benefit once its in the hands of many Logic users and they've all put forward their suggestions of how to better improve things.

Exciting times though.

Yes I’m having a major issue. Nektar support is 10/10 on the support they’ve offered for my problem. (Fader doesn’t work without touching metal in hand that I’m not using fader on.. yes I need to have my offhand touching metal to get the fader to work) it’s non responsive, clunky, has immense friction like there’s sand in the fader. 

While nektar support could not be better I don’t think I should have to try plugging things into different outlets in the wall and undo my cable management just to see if it makes the fader work. Super jealous of all the YouTube videos I see where people’s fader works as advertised. 

I'm probably just salty but again ektar support is 10/10 and could probably get me through this issue it’s just not an easy troubleshoot for my studio. 

[David Nahmani]

5 minutes ago, StudioQ1 said:

Fader doesn’t work without touching metal in hand that I’m not using fader on

Is your CS12 connected to a power supply, or only via USB to your Mac? 

[StudioQ1]

Just now, David Nahmani said:

Is your CS12 connected to a power supply, or only via USB to your Mac? 

Only via usb. Tried plugging it into my usb hub with included usb cable and a usb c cable to the back of the Apple studio display and neither have worked. Again the support has been incredible. They’ve talked to me about this and have provided an incredible list to trouble shoot. In my particular circumstance I just don’t think it’s worth the effort. There’s one or two easy trouble shoot recommendations they gave me. Going to try those and see if it’s better before I give up. I have a second laptop charger and can easily try a second outlet with that charger or try it in a different room with my laptop but the other steps are pretty tedious  

 

[David Nahmani]

The first thing I'd try is to have only the laptop and the CS12 connected together, no power supplies whatsoever (not even to power the laptop), and see if it works as expected? 

[StudioQ1]

1 hour ago, David Nahmani said:

The first thing I'd try is to have only the laptop and the CS12 connected together, no power supplies whatsoever (not even to power the laptop), and see if it works as expected? 

Okay your tutorial you posted is making me want to put in the effort to get this thing working. Going to follow nektars steps and I’ll post back if I have any success or not. 
 

David as per usual fantastic article. 

[velanche]

Good luck with the power issue, @StudioQ1. When I first had my CS12 plugged into my USB hub, it was still under-powered even though the hub had power (but then it had at least 9 other devices plugged in). When I plugged it into my Thunderbolt dock that has a lot more power, then it worked normally.  Nektar support might have reminded you of the plug in the back for you to connect a power adapter, as well. 

[David Nahmani]

18 minutes ago, StudioQ1 said:

David as per usual fantastic article. 

Thank you! Glad to hear you find it useful! 🙂 

[StudioQ1]

5 hours ago, velanche said:

Good luck with the power issue, @StudioQ1. When I first had my CS12 plugged into my USB hub, it was still under-powered even though the hub had power (but then it had at least 9 other devices plugged in). When I plugged it into my Thunderbolt dock that has a lot more power, then it worked normally.  Nektar support might have reminded you of the plug in the back for you to connect a power adapter, as well. 

Thank you for the suggestion. I saw when I ran it through the test mode it says its high powered or something like that. 

I'm awaiting a response from nektar I sent them some videos of what was going on and hoping they can get to the bottom of it. I could be misinterpreting the results as someone who knows nothing about any of this but when I ran the controller in the test mode the fader functioned perfectly. I wasn't getting any friction but maybe that mechanism doesn't kick in without control core and logic launched so take that with a grain of salt. 

So upon brief tests covering my hand with my sweatshirt and using the fader everything seems to function so I'm going to see if nektar gives me any suggestions but it could be as simple as wrapping the fader in a cloth or rubber. 

Also noticing that im having a variation of the idle bug david described in his article when I tabbed to my browser (brave) to write this the controller seems like its no longer functional and goes to the home screen. Tabbing back to logic or pressing buttons on the cs 12 doesn't change anything. If you leave logic is there a sleep mode of some kind? 

[TChandler]

On 3/16/2024 at 1:40 AM, oscwilde said:

Hey @TChandler.

Are there any restrictions re: the AAX format and ControlCore?
Had a get-together with a group of engineers/musicians, and a few Logic users were chatting about the CS12...and the PT users (about 6 or 7) were impressed with the size/look/concept/price and basically indicated they'd pick up a unit the day PT support is available....and the AAX question came up.

There's no restrictions at all in ControlCore, as it's not hosting anything directly and is really just simple data management.  

However there is a restriction with Pro Tools in that there is no API available for 3rd party manufacturers to integrate hardware with Pro Tools.  

[GrahamG]

I have one and it's very promising indeed. However, I want to get deep into mapping in Nektarine, and the manual for Nektarine is....um, rather limited. Are there any good videos showing how to map both instrument and effects plugins in Nektarine? Also, it seems that Nektarine can do an instrument with a bunch of effect plugins as a rack, but how do to that is very unclear. Nektarine doesn't appear as an available instrument in Logic, only as an effect.

[enossified]

Tim,

Is the motorized fader in the CS12 different than the one in the P6? I’ve never run into any of the issues people have been reporting.

[StudioQ1]

On 3/7/2024 at 6:44 PM, fstrat76 said:

@TChandler I am also encountering the fader issue.  I installed the latest .04 firmware and all status lights green.  Everything seems to be working fine except intermittent fader issues. Moving the logic mixer moves the cs12 fader fine, but most of the time, the fader will not move the logic fader.  When its not working, sometimes you can press another button and it will eventually work until you let go for more than a second. 

I submitted a support ticket as this is pretty much unusable without fader control right now.

support has been great so far but it sounds like im a firmware update behind now so I need to update! Still no fix on my end. I just sent them 6 videos of them asking for things for me to test and then 3 random stuff that i thought maybe would be useful. hopefully I get an answer soon. thankfully unlike teenage engineering and the ko2 fadergate situation they actually seem to be acknowledging something is going on. 

[TChandler]

17 hours ago, enossified said:

Tim,

Is the motorized fader in the CS12 different than the one in the P6? I’ve never run into any of the issues people have been reporting.

No, it's the same part.  We've only had 3 reports of touch responsive issues thus far in support, so it's not a common issue.  

We do want to look at improving resilience to external factors that can affect touch responsiveness so it's important that customers are reporting these issues and in the case of @StudioQ1 we have some excellent data to work with.  

[David Nahmani]

ControlCore 1.0.6 for Logic Pro available now.

• The update includes feature improvements, new mapping and bug fixes.
• Tempo encoder now assignable. [Shift]+[Tempo encoder] now produces a list of 7 functions for selection: Playhead (jog), Scrub, Nudge, Cycle, Vertical Zoom, Clip gain and of course Tempo.
• New plugin maps for UAD, Waves, Audio Damage, Baby Audio, Slate Digital and SSL products included.
• Option to temporarily disable the fader motor by pressing [Select]+[fader cap]. Touch the fader cap to reactivate.
• Bug fixes.